Lighting Intensity Schedule Data?

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Mine was built on information from my local LFS Website which had a description of the light and flow requirements. They along with additional goggle research gave me Par flow and Intensity requirements which I thought was intensity . would it not be nice to have a resolve between all the sources and have it free information in the interest of ecology to be accessed by all ? Which by the way was the original intent of the Internet? I will say no more.

I’m focussing this thread on the schedule, not the par or flow or color.

Lots of schedules are possible, and lots of different schedules are recommended by different people. I’m trying to decide what schedule is best. :)

 

[areefer01]

Thanks for posting it. I’m not sure I see how it answers the questions I posed, however.

It could be that I either didn't understand or articulate my reply. My guess is both.

Is it better to match a natural intensity schedule, or, for example, a 1 h ramp up and down?

My initial response is that it doesn't matter in today's landscape due to most of our corals being aquaculture vs wild collection. I am generalizing here as I don't know the actual breakdown is between them. So in short, does our lighting schedule matter? No, probably not. It probably comes down to our individual schedules for enjoyment rather than anything scientific or best. How we ramp up, down, and duration is all a personal preference and what makes us feel good.

Coral spawning? Yes, schedules are important. Richard Ross has talked about this in the past so both schedule and light noise come into play. This includes geo location to align the lighting schedule. I have never attempted this but the talks and papers sound reasonable and he is successfully spawning.

I am also of the opinion that we can have too much light. That is the focus of Dana's article I linked. Or maybe the one below may. Not trying to give you homework, sorry. I am taking schedule as start (ramp up), peak, end (ramp down).

Environmental Stability: Nature v. Aquarium: Photosynthetically Active Radiation, Ultraviolet Radiation, Dissolved Oxygen, and ORP, Part 2

We'll resume our discussion of various physical parameters beginning with Photosynthetically Active Radiation, or PAR, followed by UV Radiation, Dissolved Oxygen, and finally ORP.

reefs.com

How did you use it to determine a schedule?

How did I? Fair question. I am using a parabola schedule starting with a ramp up at 0700 and ending at 2100. Moonlights kick on after that. My peak intensity is 85%. Spectrum is all channels 100% or what Neptune calls coral growth.

How did I determine my schedule?

The first thing I did was create a sheets document then set a start (on) and end (off) time line. I then picked an intensity number for each of the time slots. I tried to use a even stair step approach starting at 7, then 14, then 23, 34, etc. Similar to ramping down. Next I had to take some PAR measurements. I put some tape on the display to mark my measurement spot(s) and selected the spectrum. The tank had water, flow, and some fish. Not corals at the time. Anyway with the Neptune Apex and SKY lights it is stupid simple to take these measurements as we can use preview. Using the pull down I started with Neptune SKY, set intensity to 7, measured. Then switched spectrum to Coral Growth, measure, repeat changing across all I may use. Once done I increased the intensity to the next ramp up number of 14 and repeat.

The long and short of it once I had all of the data I picked the spectrum that I liked then adjusted the intensity peak to match a DLI number which I was aiming for 8. I got 8.5. Average par is 197 and a peak of 300.

Does any of this matter? No, probably not. It is, however, how I built my lighting schedule. It was a fun exercise to do and made sense to me. At the end of the day I'm pretty happy and have some very large SPS colonies so can't complain.

TL; DR - I don't think it matters. There is some work done by Dana and others on the subject. Coral spawning it will be important. Rest is up to hobbyist to decide what works for their daily schedule and viewing pleasure.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Ok, thanks. I can accept that it may not matter, but how do you know?

Maybe most typical settings are good enough, but without actually testing and evaluating some endpoint with different schedules, how do we know?

Let’s take alk levels as a comparison. Many people have an opinion on what they consider is the best alk for their reef. I suspect many folks may be wrong, and the opinions are all over the map, but at least a lot of folks have tried different alk levels to get an opinion.

How many folks have tried different lighting schedules to see differences in different organisms, with endpoints varying from growth to color to health? Some must have. Those with farms, or public displays, etc.

In any case, I don’t want to make too big of a deal out of it because it may actually not matter, or be too complicated to sort out with hundreds of different organisms involved. I was just wondering if there was actual data comparing the effects of one schedule to another. :)

Right now my tank is 1 h linear ramp at each end, but I do plan a natural schedule once I get things settled down in my tank, unless I hear evidence that something else is better. :)

 

[Troylee]

I don’t know of any papers but it seems the farms go 12 hours a day with a hour ramp up and ramp down.. I’m actually running at 100% intensity on a 13hr day mimicking a large coral farm schedule and my tank has never looked or grown better! I’ve checked several different farm schedules but stuck with one of the oldest in the business.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I don’t know of any papers but it seems the farms go 12 hours a day with a hour ramp up and ramp down.. I’m actually running at 100% intensity on a 13hr day mimicking a large coral farm schedule and my tank has never looked or grown better! I’ve checked several different farm schedules but stuck with one of the oldest in the business.

Thanks. :)

 

[areefer01]

Ok, thanks. I can accept that it may not matter, but how do you know?

I'm not sure if this is directed at me as I exchanged replies earlier but to this question I can only speak to what i do and how I view the subject. I am not in that field of work so not sure who all has done testing as you suggest. I do know, however, that Dana Riddle has so there is that. There is also the reef wholesale coral lab test but one has to be aware that it may, or may not be, marketing driven.

https://ecotechmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/ReefWholesale_CoralLab.pdf

Right now my tank is 1 h linear ramp at each end, but I do plan a natural schedule once I get things settled down in my tank, unless I hear evidence that something else is better. :)

Whatever works for you is the right answer. Your display will let you know one way or another and this isn't your first rodeo. You also have enough experience to know there is more here than just a par number and schedule. We can both run the same lights and have opposite growth because maybe you run 2 part or just kalkwasser and I'm running all for reef. As an example.

That was all I was trying to say as to why it may not matter unless you are trying to spawn corals. There are some papers. Other than that it is just whatever floats our boat.

 

[oreo54]

Anyone ever seen evidence of what sort of lighting schedule seems best?

As folks know, there's all kinds of possibilities, such as matching a natural daylight schedule, or having a fairly short ramp up and down and then steady lighting for most of the day to maximize photosynthesis time, etc.

I'm not sure what sorts of data might have been generated on what sorts of organisms (if any, really), but I'm curious what data is out there.

TIA

I wish I had a better answer, but each question answered asks 10 more questions.

Question on photosynthesis data from Dana Riddle articles

@Dana Riddle Hello Mr. Riddle. I need help to better understand ETR and photosynthesis graphs in the articles you published in the past. In the PPFD interval ranging from zero to photosynthesis saturation point, is it right to assume that the energy produced linearly increases until the...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Freenow54]

I’m focussing this thread on the schedule, not the par or flow or color.

Lots of schedules are possible, and lots of different schedules are recommended by different people. I’m trying to decide what schedule is best. :)

My large tank on by 630 changes again at 8 again 10 peak at 12 until 4pm off again at 7 about 20 % intensity change throughout

 

[peterhos]

Anyone ever seen evidence of what sort of lighting schedule seems best?

As folks know, there's all kinds of possibilities, such as matching a natural daylight schedule, or having a fairly short ramp up and down and then steady lighting for most of the day to maximize photosynthesis time, etc.

I'm not sure what sorts of data might have been generated on what sorts of organisms (if any, really), but I'm curious what data is out there.

TIA

Sorry not to be able to answer your question, but I can only repeat it. I have a TMC ilumenaire+ over the tank working with the TMC FAViA app. The app has a range of preset schedules - I have gone for “SPS growth”. Maybe following the manufacturer’s preset schedules is the way to go.

 

[WhatCouldGoWrong71]

Some of this is a duplicate from another post I literally just posted. Sorry if someone may be seeing this again, just making it easier on me.

I wish I could provide something more analytical than my experiences or perhaps Apex graphs, sigh. I keep trying to push the envelope further and further. Below is my lighting rack and some shots of my tank.

When exactly is enough? Should we keep pushing? This is where I am.

I started with a full spectrum period of 4 hours and had Ushio 10k in the halides.
ATI Blue+ and KZ new gen
All lights are 14” with the XR30s having the high intensity lenses.

Today (my lighting schedule is below)
9.5 hours of intense full spectrum (I have maybe 3-4% left in my XR30s. I added Radium’s to my halides.

Total lighting period is 14.5 hours

My par during full spectrum is 900+ at my rocks (rocks follow the 1/3 method) and 600ish at my sand.

I’m running 9.5 DKH and 8.55 to 8.62 PH. My nutrients are low 6-8 and .08, but I’m dosing ammonia (and loving it).

Here is where the data part comes in. It’s amazing how fragile consumption levels are. If my kalk reactor overnight pukes and my PH is only at 8.2-8.3 at the start of my photo, I’ll be down a couple hundred mil of alk and 70-120 mil of CA. All my lights go through 2 EB832s, I’m discovering that after 4-5 months the on board circuit breakers are letting go holding this level of amperage for this period of time. Tripping half the lights in a tank and waiting for them to cycle to come back on stunts the photo period and consumption goes in the toilet for the day, there is like no real recovery for the day. Tank looks fine, but you can clearly see it in consumption.

I’ve really started zeroing in on my consumption rates. My CARX is way too small and also runs at basically max 24/7. I’m at 500 mills a day of CA. I’m going to lose this data point when I get my new reactor online, as I won’t need much two part, likely just enough to prop up PH.

So, I’m looking to ramp up more intensity. With my current set up, all I can really do is add 4 kz’s and drop the blues. I don’t think dropping my lights closer to the water is it. While that would give instant gratification. I’ve debated adding 4 a500’s to my rack for added mid day intensity. I don’t plan on making my overall lighting period longer, but I would like to get my full spectrum to 11 hours.

But, I also have equally strong flow. 3 closed loops, 3 6255s and 2 Stream 3s. At what point does increasing flow intersect with lighting intensity or prolonged schedule. What metric could be looked at to safely go through that intersection?

I havent attempted to push to the next “intensity milestone” as I’m not sure what is the proper gauge to look at. Looking at my coral, they look happy. Does that mean “give me more” or “this is nice and cozy”? Dosing the ammonia feels right, looks better, but - if no two tanks are the same, is there really “a data set” that is “the” baseline? Great topic.