Live Food Discussion Thread

[Paul B]

Looks familiar.

 

[WesleyC]

My phyto won't grow. Im not sure if it's my starting culture (oceanmagik) or if maybe I don't have enough flow in the bottles but I will have to buy more phyto and find out.

According to OceanMagik website, their product contains Nano, Iso, Tet, and Thal. Iso and Tet are motile phyto and require slower flow. Nano is non-motile and require stronger flow. It would be hard to keep them all happy, and some are going to die and foul up your culture.

 

[leahfiish]

And here I was thinking it would be best to get a variety.

 

[Wrangy]

I used to operate an aquaculture business that was doing pretty good, but it was so much work that I slowly switched to doing aquarium servicing instead. However, during the aquaculture time, I spent a good deal of time researching nutrition. I developed what I believe is the perfect homemade frozen mash with nearly 100% human grade foods. I used the mash in aquaculture for several years, and my fish and inverts produced MASSIVE spawns with near perfect hatch rates. The larvae were strong and developed quickly. I don't think there is any better judge for good nutrition than this.

Would you be happy to share your mash recipe?? It sounds like it's rather amazing!

 

[WesleyC]

OK, as long as you can remove it. I need to clean it about every two weeks.

Thanks Paul for all the great idea. After many revisions, here is the most current version:

The feeder is anchored down by the base to avoid floating away or getting blown around by the reef tank water current. Just a push and a twist on the feeding tube, and the feeder can be removed from the under-sand-anchor:

After pouring in the BBS, you can unscrew the feeding tube from the feeder. The rigid air tube is compression fitted to the screw-like connector. You can put in a blind-plug to close the hole without getting your hand wet. The screw-like connector is loosely fitted until the last turn.

Here is the top side with the funnel. I have some longer rigid air tube on order. I'm just using the short rigid air tube from my phyto culture for fitting/testing purpose.

Here is the under-sand-base and the feeder:

Everything is modular design. If you have a thinner/thicker air-tube, just need to re-print the screw-like compression connector. If you have a different size funnel, just re-print the funnel-airtube connector.

The screens are changeable as well. I know these holes are too big. I'll print some with tighter holes later. These are just the few prototype screens I printed for fitting purpose. They print faster with less dense print out.

The next step is to make the under-sand-mounting leg exchangeable, so that it could be buried in various places and situations.

Now, I need to get some fish to feed. lol

 

[Paul B]

Now that looks perfect, your mandarins must be proud

I am not sure you will be able to print a screen with small enough holes but I am not a printer expert so I am probably wrong.
(think nylon stocking)

 

[WesleyC]

The screen is actually printed using a special technique utilization the gaps between the printer's stepping motor movement. The actual 3D drawing is just a solid disk, instead of drawing thousands of lines in the design.

The printed line can only go so thin, but the gaps could be as thin as what the movement of the stepping motor can do.

Even if that doesn't work, I can put an actual filter material or nylon stocking there just like you do. The cap of the feeder is friction fitted on the feeder container only at a few locations. If the material is too thick, I can print a cap slightly larger to make it fit. What a great world of 3D printing.

 

[Paul B]

It looks great. Mine was just a 5 minute thing that came to me in a Grand Marnier stupor. I use a mesh that I found inside my RO membrane. It is plastic and the perfect size. My urchins don't eat through it and it seems to last forever after multiple bleachings.

One bit of advice if you don't mind of your almost perfect design. You will have much better luck if that funnel was just above the water a little more. The thinnest part of the funnel needs to be "at or above the water line." This is very important. The reason for that is because if there is too much water in the funnel, as yours has, you will need to push all that water down into the feeder to get all the shrimps down. That will put too much water into the feeder causing many of the shrimp to be expelled into the tank and not be trapped in the feeder. You want to have to put as little water into the funnel with the shrimp as possible or you will lost many shrimp. You can also use a much smaller funnel but that really doesn't matter. After you add the concentrated shrimp to the funnel (which should be in no more than a tablespoon of water or so) just add enough water (maybe two tablespoons) until you see the last of the shrimp get into the feeder. Any more water and you will see shrimp being forced out of the feeder.

I hope you don't mind the criticism but I have been using this thing and tweeking it for many years and I want people to have success with this method

PS Don't be discouraged if the fish don't go near it for a while. All fish are afraid of new things especially new, white plastic and will shy away from it until it develops some growth. A lot of people tell me about this problem. The fish need to get used to it so don't clean the thing very well except for the screen. It may even be better if you could make it out of a dark color like green or blue.

 

[WesleyC]

All comments are welcome.

I do mean to have a longer rigid air tube, but that's the only one I have on hand. I was using the short tube from my phyto culture. The longer tube is on order.

 

[WesleyC]

That will put too much water into the feeder causing many of the shrimp to be expelled into the tank and not be trapped in the feeder.

Hi Paul, how do you judge if the screen holes are small enough to trap the shrimp yet, they can swim out? Even using stocking, I could stretch it a bit to make the holes bigger.

 

[Paul B]

If you use a stocking, don't stretch it. To judge the holes, "gently" pour the hatched shrimp gently through the mesh, some should go through and some should get stuck in the mesh. The shrimp are tiny and you should hardly be able to see the holes. About half should get through, that would be ideal. If they all get through, the holes are to big.

 

[WesleyC]

OK. Let me try that out. Thanks!

 

[dragonfish]

FOLLOWING

 

[leahfiish]

I just dumped my last attempt with algaebarn oceanmagik down the drain, it just wasn't growing for me. I have 2 algae disks from Florida aqua farms that I'm going to try, just not sure if I want to keep trying with 2l bottles or switch to something else. It seems like bags might be easier to work with. And I don't have to worry about sterilizing them, plus they are pretty cheap.
Something like this except on a smaller scale.


I also found this MACNA presentation by Todd Gardener really informative and helpful.


How is everyone else's live food projects?

 

[WesleyC]

The phyto is doing well.

The Ruby Red Dragonnets are trained to eat off the feeder while they are in QT. But once I put them in DT, they just eating off the live rocks day in and day out. They both are fatter than pigs. I'm surprise they haven't explored yet.

Here is a picture while they were in the QT.

 

[sundog101]

@Myka

I supplemented the fish with live blackworms which they would get everyday for about a month, then a few weeks no worms, then another month everyday. I found the blackworms really helped invigorate spawning in pairs that were already spawning, and helped trigger spawning in pairs that had not yet spawned. The on and off approached seemed to work best.

Is there a reason for the on and off? And why feel that works best?

Also, would you mind sharing your “mash” recipe?

 

[foxt]

I have a CBB that I want to feed with clams from the supermarket. I've read that people have done this, but I am sketchy on how to approach it. Some folks seem to just put the clam (after making sure it is alive) into the tank, and let nature take it's course. Others freeze the clams first to ensure that there are no nasty parasites that enter the tank with it. I think PaulB just strolls in from a day at the beach and puts them in his tank (mine won't be that fresh!).

I'm inclined to freeze the clams, and then pry them open and put them in the tank. What's the best practice here?

 

[Paul B]

Freeze them then slice off paper thin slices. My copperband is smiling from gill to gill.

 

[Myka]

Would you be happy to share your mash recipe?? It sounds like it's rather amazing!

@Myka

Is there a reason for the on and off? And why feel that works best?

Also, would you mind sharing your “mash” recipe?

On and off approach for blackworms worked best to trigger spawning.

White shrimp (shells on) 500 g
Wild Pacific salmon 200 g
New Zealand Green Lipped mussels 200 g
Squid 100 g (can't be more than 10% of total mix)
Flying Fish Roe (masago) 15 g
Florida Aqua Farms vitamins 10 g
Nori (green, dry) 5-10 g
Wild Salmon Oil 5000 mg
Hawaiian Astaxanthin 600 mg (I've been leaving this out and coating pellets instead)
Florida Aqua Farms Gelatin 50 g

I don't know what you guys have available in the USA, but Canada is more strict on product labeling and additives. The white shrimp I buy has phosphate preservatives in it because of the collection countries (these are NOT on the labels). It is very difficult and extremely expensive to buy white shrimp without preservatives - you have to buy fresh Canadian shrimp off the docks. I feed this mash to my reef multiple times per day for many years. I've not had any PO4 issues in the reefs (I actually ADD PO4 haha). The salmon I buy is always Canadian harvested. For squid, I look for anything BUT China.

Ocellaris (3 yrs old) 1,345 eggs. 99.6% viable eggs.

 

[Wrangy]

On and off approach for blackworms worked best to trigger spawning.

White shrimp (shells on) 500 g
Wild Pacific salmon 200 g
New Zealand Green Lipped mussels 200 g
Squid 100 g (can't be more than 10% of total mix)
Flying Fish Roe (masago) 15 g
Florida Aqua Farms vitamins 10 g
Nori (green, dry) 5-10 g
Wild Salmon Oil 5000 mg
Hawaiian Astaxanthin 600 mg (I've been leaving this out and coating pellets instead)
Florida Aqua Farms Gelatin 50 g

I don't know what you guys have available in the USA, but Canada is more strict on product labeling and additives. The white shrimp I buy has phosphate preservatives in it because of the collection countries (these are NOT on the labels). It is very difficult and extremely expensive to buy white shrimp without preservatives - you have to buy fresh Canadian shrimp off the docks. I feed this mash to my reef multiple times per day for many years. I've not had any PO4 issues in the reefs (I actually ADD PO4 haha). The salmon I buy is always Canadian harvested. For squid, I look for anything BUT China.

Ocellaris (3 yrs old) 1,345 eggs. 99.6% viable eggs.

Fantastic! Thanks for running through that for us

How fine do you make the food? Rough chop, fine chop/dice or minced?