Mixing T5 with LEDs

BlueDevil · May 15, 2020

Hello. I am currently running 3 Radions XR30 G4 Pros on my tank in a hybrid LED/T5 fixture. All four T5 bulbs are currently off. I am thinking of slowly incorporating the T5s in and wanted to know what the best way to accomplish this is. My Radions are currently running at 55% intensity.
Should I run the Radions at the intensity they are at and just slowly add the T5 in small duration increments? Or should I drop the intensity of the Radions and keep the T5s for the entire time the daylights are on on the Radions while keeping the same PAR levels? I’m not entirely sure if the spectrum of the T5 will affect the corals even if the PAR numbers remain the same.

I took a PAR reading with the T5s on with the Radions at 55% and on average the PAR increase was by 100, and in the highest spots of the aquascape it was close to +200.

Thank you!

BlueDevil · May 15, 2020

Just to get a better idea here is a PAR map of my scape showing just Radions at 55% and then adding in the T5s.

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Edit: I just realized that there might be some by looking at my pictures and thinking my tank is still empty. These pictures are simply those that were taking once I had my rock work completed. I used the pictures so I would have reference points when I measured the PAR. The readings I posted were taken when the tank was up and running with water in it

dwest · May 16, 2020

When I added T5’s to my LED, I did what you mentioned first. I kept my LED’s where they were and slowly ramped the photoperiod up on my T5’s starting at 1/2 hour per day. It worked great.

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

dwest said:
When I added T5’s to my LED, I did what you mentioned first. I kept my LED’s where they were and slowly ramped the photoperiod up on my T5’s starting at 1/2 hour per day. It worked great.

Thanks for the feedback. I was concerned that a sudden jump in PAR might end up shocking the corals or causing a nuisance algae outbreak. Using the second option I might be able to gradually increase the PAR since I can’t do that with the T5s (at least not from an intensity standpoint). Then again I wasn’t sure how the LED (at lower intensity) plus T5 on all the time would impact the corals either.

Bpb · May 16, 2020

How important is the “only
Blue LED running” look to you? That would impact my personal opinion/advice

Phildago · May 16, 2020

I found it easiest to just ramp turn down the leds and run the t5s on the schedule that I wanted. Then I slowly acclimated by ramping up my leds over the course of 2 months

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Bpb said:
How important is the “only
Blue LED running” look to you? That would impact my personal opinion/advice

I prefer at least some daylight for the corals. Though if your plan is only a temporary all blue setting I’d love to hear about it. Would the corals get adversely affected by running just blue given that I have been running the full spectrum for over a month now? I have ~12 SPS frags, some acans, chalices, zoas and a clam.

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Phildago said:
I found it easiest to just ramp turn down the leds and run the t5s on the schedule that I wanted. Then I slowly acclimated by ramping up my leds over the course of 2 months

That brings up another question - on hybrid setups, how long of a photo period is needed on the T5s? The entire duration of the full spectrum (8 hrs in my current schedule) or less?

Bpb · May 16, 2020

BlueDevil said:
I prefer at least some daylight for the corals. Though if your plan is only a temporary all blue setting I’d love to hear about it. Would the corals get adversely affected by running just blue given that I have been running the full spectrum for over a month now? I have ~12 SPS frags, some acans, chalices, zoas and a clam.

I’ll preface by saying, I’m not big into the solid blue thing. It’s ok but not preferable. If I personally ran a hybrid setup like you describe, I would treat the T5’s like the sky and the radions like the sun or in aquarium speak, metal halides. I’d have the t5’s run the long length of the photoperiod at 12 hours, and use the radions to ramp up for max daylight intensity in the middle.

For t5’s I’d probably do a blue+ and a true actinic in each bank, and for the radions, I’d probably set them equal on all channels for a very bright daylight look. Should come to around 14k mid day with the t5 running also. I’d set led intensity to reach a max par of about 500 or so at the highest brightest point you intend to use

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Bpb said:
I’ll preface by saying, I’m not big into the solid blue thing. It’s ok but not preferable. If I personally ran a hybrid setup like you describe, I would treat the T5’s like the sky and the radions like the sun or in aquarium speak, metal halides. I’d have the t5’s run the long length of the photoperiod at 12 hours, and use the radions to ramp up for max daylight intensity in the middle.

For t5’s I’d probably do a blue+ and a true actinic in each bank, and for the radions, I’d probably set them equal on all channels for a very bright daylight look. Should come to around 14k mid day with the t5 running also. I’d set led intensity to reach a max par of about 500 or so at the highest brightest point you intend to use

Thanks for this info! I guess the downside to this is that I won’t be able to use the Radion’s AB+ program I take it since the LEDs will be equal on all channels? I also like the ramp up/down setting which I will lose as well. Trade offs I guess!

Btw - I have a four bulb T5 fixture. I currently have the following bulbs on it: 2 x ATI Blue Plus, 1 Purple Plus and 1 Coral Plus.

Goubli · May 16, 2020

Do you have a dimmable T5 fixture? If not dimmable, do you have the ability to turn on only one channel at a time (2 bulbs)? I have a dimmable t5/LED combo fixture.

My current setup is KZ superblue, KZ New Gen, KZ Fiji purple and a true actinic. This is my 3rd different bulb combo I’ve tried. I ran the combo you’re running prior to my change to this combo.

I am able to run a variable level of light throughout the day with all my bulbs so I’m able to really dial in the spectrum (visible) that I find most pleasing. With what you have going you’ll easily get enough par.

I currently run my t5 all at 100% for about 7 hrs a day and my total photoperiod is around 12 hrs. I have my two blue channels of LEDs maxing out at about 40% for 8 hrs. The white channel is at 15% for 11 hrs. I made a rookie mistake when I replaced my t5 this year. Since it was a new bulb combo I take the time to go through and play around with the color mixer at various levels to figure out how to dial in the spectrum over the course of the day and like an idiot I bumped all my LED channels by 15-20% (max was around 70%). A few days later it looked like some of my montiporas started bleaching out so I’ve had to back them down.

Enough about me-as to your situation: do the radions allow you to control or customize a ramp up schedule of your own choosing?

If you let me know the controllability of your various lights I think you’ll be able to dial in what you want.

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Goubli said:
Do you have a dimmable T5 fixture? If not dimmable, do you have the ability to turn on only one channel at a time (2 bulbs)? I have a dimmable t5/LED combo fixture.

My current setup is KZ superblue, KZ New Gen, KZ Fiji purple and a true actinic. This is my 3rd different bulb combo I’ve tried. I ran the combo you’re running prior to my change to this combo.

I am able to run a variable level of light throughout the day with all my bulbs so I’m able to really dial in the spectrum (visible) that I find most pleasing. With what you have going you’ll easily get enough par.

I currently run my t5 all at 100% for about 7 hrs a day and my total photoperiod is around 12 hrs. I have my two blue channels of LEDs maxing out at about 40% for 8 hrs. The white channel is at 15% for 11 hrs. I made a rookie mistake when I replaced my t5 this year. Since it was a new bulb combo I take the time to go through and play around with the color mixer at various levels to figure out how to dial in the spectrum over the course of the day and like an idiot I bumped all my LED channels by 15-20% (max was around 70%). A few days later it looked like some of my montiporas started bleaching out so I’ve had to back them down.

Enough about me-as to your situation: do the radions allow you to control or customize a ramp up schedule of your own choosing?

If you let me know the controllability of your various lights I think you’ll be able to dial in what you want.

My T5s are not dimmable unfortunately. I have a 48” Aquatic Life LED/T5 hybrid fixture. Two bulbs on the front are controlled by one power cable and the two on the back by another. I have everything connected to an Apex so I can control the on/off time for each set of two bulbs as needed.

As far as the Radions are concerned, yes I can have them ramp up/down over whatever duration I like. Currently, my blues come on at 10am and ramp up until 12, which is when the full spectrums come on. All the lights stay on until 8pm, when the full spectrums turn off and then the blues ramp down until 10pm.

Here is my current radion schedule. I am running the Coral Labs SPS AB+ schedule.

Phildago · May 16, 2020

I personally run my lights for 14 hours. Id ramp up my leds in the morning with a rapid drop in led output right when the t5s turned on at noon, ramped up and down the leds while the t5s were on until 7 pm and continued to ramp down the leds until 10 pm.

The only reason I kept them on so long is I'd like to see my tank before I left in the morning and after dinner when I got home.

I have to say, it worked well. My theory was that I'd be able to have a more variable spectrum with hot spots as well as times with less hot spots and shading with the t5s. My tank is mixed with sps and LPS, so i thought if I cranked the leds up too high with the t5s on there I'd end up frying my lps

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Phildago said:
I personally run my lights for 14 hours. Id ramp up my leds in the morning with a rapid drop in led output right when the t5s turned on at noon, ramped up and down the leds while the t5s were on until 7 pm and continued to ramp down the leds until 10 pm.

The only reason I kept them on so long is I'd like to see my tank before I left in the morning and after dinner when I got home.

I have to say, it worked well. My theory was that I'd be able to have a more variable spectrum with hot spots as well as times with less hot spots and shading with the t5s. My tank is mixed with sps and LPS, so i thought if I cranked the leds up too high with the t5s on there I'd end up frying my lps

Interesting.So you ramp up/down your LEDs throughout the day while the T5s are on? Doesn’t the constant fluctuation have any detrimental effects on the corals?

ScottB · May 16, 2020

I find T5 source light to be extremely forgiving on SPS. I don't have MH experience, but in terms of PAR (at least according to Apogee) I can push a ton more with T5 and the corals don't blink.

My frag systems are hybrid and most sticks are in 300-350 PAR. When I move them to my display (8X80 watt T5) they are getting +425 and they seem perfectly happy.

I guess my point is, I don't think you need to reduce your LED power. Just ramp your T5 photoperiod over a few weeks.

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

ScottB said:
I find T5 source light to be extremely forgiving on SPS. I don't have MH experience, but in terms of PAR (at least according to Apogee) I can push a ton more with T5 and the corals don't blink.

My frag systems are hybrid and most sticks are in 300-350 PAR. When I move them to my display (8X80 watt T5) they are getting +425 and they seem perfectly happy.

I guess my point is, I don't think you need to reduce your LED power. Just ramp your T5 photoperiod over a few weeks.

Thanks for your reply. That does seem like the easiest option without a whole lot of fiddling around with settings, schedules and what not.

Goubli · May 16, 2020

Yes, I agree with what they said above about slowly incorporating the t5. Good luck! Slow is always best, except for growth!

BlueDevil · May 16, 2020

Goubli said:
Yes, I agree with what they said above about slowly incorporating the t5. Good luck! Slow is always best, except for growth!

I definitely plan on taking it slow! I’m in no rush whatsoever. I’d rather take it slow than jack up lights too quickly and end up bleaching the corals.