Need some help. Bugs or something else?

[Red_Beard]

Need some more experienced eyes on this, and would be grateful for any advice getting to the bottom of this!
I have been shifing the focus in my tank to sps, and all my 'easier' stuff has been going great for a little over a year now so i decided to dive in and starting about August last year added a few batches of nice frags. A few months ago i started to notice 'tuliping' and distorted polyps and stunted growth. When the frags were first added they grew a little and would start to base out and then just hit a wall. I pushed through that and got another wave of growth, but am now seeing some basal STN and STN in areas where the frag is self-shading. Like really slow, over the course of a few weeks. In trying to figure this out and watching them at night i also noticed some odd patterning that looks like bug bite marks but for the life of me cant see any bugs even after looking almost every night for a week or so. Is this the work or a pest? Or is it something else entirely? Or a combination of the two?

I have been doing regularish water changes for 6ish months mraning every week or every other week 10-15 gallons (75 gallon display, 40b sump) skimming dry, i use AFR and have been manually dosing ammonium bicaronate as my nitrates are always super low. Po4 is high though and ive been working getting it down slowly with lanthanum chloride in the skimmer cup.

Sg: 1.0255
Alk: 8.3dKh
Cal: 400ppm
Mag: 1500ppm
No3: .2ppm (dosing .5 oz of 9g/250ml per day ammonium)
Po4: .4ppm
pH: 8.2

I have been feeding benireef 2x week as well as adding af probio s/f as directed. Parameters are stable except po4 which i am working on. Thank you!

 

[shakacuz]

#reefsquad

 

[Tahoe61]

Have you tried blowing off the Acropora to see if flatworms are present?
Do you see any red bug or similar, they look like little mites?

 

[Red_Beard]

Have you tried blowing off the Acropora to see if flatworms are present?
Do you see any red bug or similar, they look like little mites?

I have, nothing came off. I have not seen any red/white/black bugs. I have examined pretty closely over quite a span of time at night looking too, but just because i haven't seen any doesn't mean there can't be any there. I've never had them before though either so definitely not an expert there.

 

[shakacuz]

I have, nothing came off. I have not seen any red/white/black bugs. I have examined pretty closely over quite a span of time at night looking too, but just because i haven't seen any doesn't mean there can't be any there. I've never had them before though either so definitely not an expert there.

have you sent out an ICP?

could be SCTLD (stony coral tissue loss disease), or high metals in the water

 

[Red_Beard]

have you sent out an ICP?

could be SCTLD (stony coral tissue loss disease), or high metals in the water

That i have not done. I had been considering doing so, but wanted to rule bugs out first. That was my other thought though and why i had stepped up the water-changes lately too. Which ICP would you recommend? My only experience with those are what members here have posted from their own systems.

 

[shakacuz]

That i have not done. I had been considering doing so, but wanted to rule bugs out first. That was my other though though and why i had stepped up the water-changes lately too. Which ICP would you recommend? My only experience with those are what members here have posted from their own systems.

ATI ICP for trace minerals/elements(or the reefmoonshiner version). aquabiomics for a more detailed "bacteria" test. i'm not sure which of the two tests they offer (microbiome, and tankDNA) would help with testing for SCTLD.

i'd recommend getting the regular ICP test done to rule out any deficiencies in your water, as the aquabiomic tests are rather expensive. i've read that cirpo/amox helps with SCTLD but i don't believe "cures" it..

 

[danreef55]

You could try a Lugol's dip. Just follow the instructions for strength and duration

 

[Red_Beard]

You could try a Lugol's dip. Just follow the instructions for strength and duration

Would that be for treating the SCTLD?

 

[Red_Beard]

More than half of my frags are looking pretty good, its just those few that have really taken a slow turn for the worse.

I think this one may be beyond saving, and i lost one other one 2 weeks ago.

I just added a poly-pad too. Going to order an ICP.

 

[danreef55]

Would that be for treating the SCTLD?

I don't believe it is effective for SCTLD. Try asking @Jay Hemdal for his advice

 

[shakacuz]

Would that be for treating the SCTLD?

inadvertently, yes. lugol's helps with bacterial infection, but i'm unsure of its effects vs SCTLD.


i want to say i didn't "diagnose" your issue to be SCTLD, but just that it could be an option of what's occurring.

 

[Red_Beard]

inadvertently, yes. lugol's helps with bacterial infection, but i'm unsure of its effects vs SCTLD.


i want to say i didn't "diagnose" your issue to be SCTLD, but just that it could be an option of what's occurring.

Yeah, definitely still a possibility until an actual root cause is found.

I did order an ATI ICP, should be here Thursday. Hopefully that will help narrow things down a bit.

 

[danreef55]

Consider taking one of the acropora that has symptoms and do a Lugol's dip. It isn't going to hurt and see if anything falls off and observe it in the tank to see how it responded.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I don't believe it is effective for SCTLD. Try asking @Jay Hemdal for his advice

Sorry - I don’t have much to add about this issue, I’m more of a fish guy (grin).

 

[Red_Beard]

Sorry - I don’t have much to add about this issue, I’m more of a fish guy (grin).

Thanks for popping by anyhow Jay :) Your fish medic advice is stellar too BTW, has helped me a few times!

 

[Red_Beard]

Throwing this out for the evening crowd too

 

[Red_Beard]

I pulled one, dipped it. Not much going on. Mostly just a couple pods. But, whetever these are did give me pause, they are tinsey, i had them on some paper for contrast, you can see the fibers for referece. Any idea what they might be? Dont look like little spider bugs, look more like pods?

Need to get a microscope next maybe. This was pretty rough with a phone camera.

 

[underwaterwonders]

The one on the right is likely an ostracod(harmless). That first picture you showed with the really green skeleton is usually something I see when there have been really high phosphate, and looking at your parameters your sitting at .4, seems pretty high. Coral can acclimate to that over time, but if your new frags came from a lot less that may be stressful.

 

[Red_Beard]

The one on the right is likely an ostracod(harmless). That first picture you showed with the really green skeleton is usually something I see when there have been really high phosphate, and looking at your parameters your sitting at .4, seems pretty high. Coral can acclimate to that over time, but if your new frags came from a lot less that may be stressful.

Thank you for the insights! So it may be that i am just chasing my tail with phosphate issues? I will work a little harder to pull them down, i know they will likely never be super low, but i was hoping to get to .05 - .1 range and keep it stabile.