Non-Reef Safe Silicone Disaster Cont.
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I do not know but if they state that there is a
From their own Product data Sheet - my bold
I do not know - ask the manufacter - this is what they say it contains in the SDS Scroll down and try to get it together if you can.
Sincerely Lasse
it must be some.
From their own Product data Sheet - my bold
I do not know - ask the manufacter - this is what they say it contains in the SDS Scroll down and try to get it together if you can.
Sincerely Lasse
Last edited:
Just thought I post this:
Uncleof6
For the record: All silicones are reef safe-once they are fully cured. The enemy is uncured silicone, not some mythical ingredient for controlling mildew.
That said, GE Silicone I is cheap junk. It is the aboslute barrel bottom of all materials (and many silicones are right there with it.) For our projects we really should move up to a higher quality product. Dow Corning makes several that blow GE Silicone away, but are not as hefty as the RTV100 series or SCS1200, however for small projects they are fine. DC 735, DC 999A to name two.
The MSDS for Silicone II does not indicate that there are any additions other than siloxanes, of which there are literally hundreds, (polymers) common to all silicones, without getting to complicated about it, The MSDS also does not indicate any proprietary additives either. Where such is present, the law requires that they be included in the MSDS. This raises serious questions as to the validity of the advertising.
What differentiates Silicone II from Silicone I is the latter is an acetoxy cure silicone, and the former is a neutral cure silicone.
Silicone II does not take longer to cure; published cure times are about the same. However the cure times pertain to a specific amount of silicone, usually given in a bead size, generally 1/8" or 1/4". Hardly have I ever seen an aquarium application use that little. As the amount increases the cure time increases, a week, two weeks...RTV100 series' 7 day full cure time is for a 1/4" bead!
I would say that neutral cure silicone is a bit more toxic in its "uncured" state than acetoxy cure silicone, but that is as far as it goes. It is better to malign a product for what it does not do well, rather than internet rumor.
Acetoxy cure silicone excels at bonding to glass and ceramics; acetic acid is corrosive, so it is not suited for metals, and it does not bond well to other materials (acrylic included.) Neutral cure excels at bonding metals (non-corrosive) and other materials (acrylic not included.)
Co-polymers, are another category (not 100% silicone) and are out of the scope of this thread.
Within the two general categories, there are several sub-categories: sealant, adhesive, high temperature, etc. Obviously we are only concerned with sealants and adhesives. the choice of which to use, really takes little thought. Sealants seal, adhsives hold stuff together.
GE Silicone I (Momentive) is, easy to work with, but is a bargain basement low end sealant. RTV100 series (Momentive) or SCS1200 (Momentive) are high end adhesives, not so easy to work with. In between there is a plethora of formulations, that will drive the most studious nuts ( I am a prime example.)
A short list has been publised at least a 100 times here on RC, not that they are the only choices, but everytime some off the wall silicone is asked about, or mentioned, it just adds to the confusion (and rumors.) In similar fashion "what is safe and unsafe" has been published at least the same number of times, over the past several years, here on RC.
Uncleof6
GE silicone 1 aquarium safe? - Reef Central Online Community
GE silicone 1 aquarium safe? Do It Yourself
www.reefcentral.com
For the record: All silicones are reef safe-once they are fully cured. The enemy is uncured silicone, not some mythical ingredient for controlling mildew.
That said, GE Silicone I is cheap junk. It is the aboslute barrel bottom of all materials (and many silicones are right there with it.) For our projects we really should move up to a higher quality product. Dow Corning makes several that blow GE Silicone away, but are not as hefty as the RTV100 series or SCS1200, however for small projects they are fine. DC 735, DC 999A to name two.
The MSDS for Silicone II does not indicate that there are any additions other than siloxanes, of which there are literally hundreds, (polymers) common to all silicones, without getting to complicated about it, The MSDS also does not indicate any proprietary additives either. Where such is present, the law requires that they be included in the MSDS. This raises serious questions as to the validity of the advertising.
What differentiates Silicone II from Silicone I is the latter is an acetoxy cure silicone, and the former is a neutral cure silicone.
Silicone II does not take longer to cure; published cure times are about the same. However the cure times pertain to a specific amount of silicone, usually given in a bead size, generally 1/8" or 1/4". Hardly have I ever seen an aquarium application use that little. As the amount increases the cure time increases, a week, two weeks...RTV100 series' 7 day full cure time is for a 1/4" bead!
I would say that neutral cure silicone is a bit more toxic in its "uncured" state than acetoxy cure silicone, but that is as far as it goes. It is better to malign a product for what it does not do well, rather than internet rumor.
Acetoxy cure silicone excels at bonding to glass and ceramics; acetic acid is corrosive, so it is not suited for metals, and it does not bond well to other materials (acrylic included.) Neutral cure excels at bonding metals (non-corrosive) and other materials (acrylic not included.)
Co-polymers, are another category (not 100% silicone) and are out of the scope of this thread.
Within the two general categories, there are several sub-categories: sealant, adhesive, high temperature, etc. Obviously we are only concerned with sealants and adhesives. the choice of which to use, really takes little thought. Sealants seal, adhsives hold stuff together.
GE Silicone I (Momentive) is, easy to work with, but is a bargain basement low end sealant. RTV100 series (Momentive) or SCS1200 (Momentive) are high end adhesives, not so easy to work with. In between there is a plethora of formulations, that will drive the most studious nuts ( I am a prime example.)
A short list has been publised at least a 100 times here on RC, not that they are the only choices, but everytime some off the wall silicone is asked about, or mentioned, it just adds to the confusion (and rumors.) In similar fashion "what is safe and unsafe" has been published at least the same number of times, over the past several years, here on RC.
motortrendz
2500 Club Member
This is exactly y I was always told never used GE2, GE1 is fine aslong as it cures completely first. Ge2 is made for bathrooms and kitchens, under cabinets and window sills. It has a chemical in it so they dont discolor and turn black from mold over time in higher moisture areas.
I have helped many persons here in Sweden after they have used Silicone containing anti mold components. Every time - the mistake have shown up as a total death of the whole aquarium. i do not know which anti mold formula GE2 use - but it is enough for me to not use it (or recommend it) only based on the fact that it contain a anti mold agent. In this case - the producer by it self also stress that it is not recommended to use it for.
Sincerely Lasse
Sincerely Lasse
Of course GE doesn't recommend those products for aquariums. That isn't their intended purpose. For one, it isn't very strong.
It is suitable for baffles in sumps. For anyone that had problems attributed to GE silicone, my question would be "how long did you let it cure?"
It is suitable for baffles in sumps. For anyone that had problems attributed to GE silicone, my question would be "how long did you let it cure?"
Is not the silicon strings of the baffles in continuous contact with the water? Why do they rise " For use in food contact applications " as an indication not to use just this type of silicon? the GE1 without anti mold agents seems to work - but not the GE2 as I understand
With other brands of "construction" silicone containing anti mold agents - the cure time have been (in the examples I have seen) between 1 to 30 days - all with the same result. The anti mold agent kill aquatic life.
The question here is not which type of silicone it is - the question is if it contain a anti mold agent or not.
Sincerely Lasse
.
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
Also need to let it dry few days for 100% silicone. Even if instructions only say 24 hrs.
Dr. Dendrostein
Marine fish monthly
To silicone or not to silicone, that is the question. Hahaha
Do not know that but if you have use silicone with anti-fungal and silicone without in a bathroom you have seen the difference. Which type is probably a secret and because is a low % of the chemicals/compounds used in the products - it does not need to be in the MSDS.
However - the word molds (mould) could have different meanings - I´ll change to the word anti-fungal instead.
Sincerely Lasse
However - the word molds (mould) could have different meanings - I´ll change to the word anti-fungal instead.
Sincerely Lasse
Randy Holmes-Farley
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I just clicked on the sds for two diffefent resellers of GE silicone 2 and both come up showing tin compounds in them. The ads that pulled up said ge5000 and ge5040. Only two I looked at, and both showed tin.
Here’s one:
Tin, dibutylbis(2,4-pentanedionato-.kappa.O2,.kappa.O4)-, (OC-6-11)-
0.1 - 1
Well that’s not good. I wonder if they changed it recently?
Can you post a link Randy.
Randy Holmes-Farley
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Sure. If you google GE silicone 2 sds, many come up:
Thanks Randy!
Randy, what form of tin is toxic? I believe it would only be toxic if uncured, or the silicone is degrading? I know from working in the hospital that a lot of silicone breast implants are made with tin. Knowing that tin is also toxic to humans, surely these companies would avoid making silicone implants if they were concerned with degradation.
The tin number on the MSDS is very low correct? A lot of people have tin in their reefs according to Triton results. At what level should reefers become concernd? I need to email GE to find out more.
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