Overbuilt DIY stands?
- Thread starter cane
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Flippers4pups
Fins up since 1993
I think, speaking for myself, it's cheaper going 2x4, 2x6 and skinning with 1/4 plywood than solid wood panels. Over built? Yes. Intentional, not always. Does make me sleep better at night. Lol
mcarroll
10K Club member
I think there are very few structural engineers on here. I imagine that every commercial stand vendor has their stands profenssionally designed (and spelled) by and Engineer.
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For safety and peace of mind, mostly. Ever see what happens when one of the pet store MDF stands gets a little wet? Not a pretty sight as they swell and fail. The junk they sell at Petco and similar stores might hold a tank, but not in my house. Give me overbuilt any day.
mcarroll
10K Club member
You know I've seen some of these stands you're talking about at customer's houses and they get SCARY looking.
I've never even heard on the internet of one collapsing, let alone heard of one in person...let alone seen one.
Still SCARY looking.
Like I said, I don't think we understand MDF too well....certainly not a good idea to use something you don't understand too well in a critical application. It's good that we don't.
Obviously someone understands it pretty well though.My problem with "overbuilt" is that it's not necesarily very smart....you still see "overbuilt" designs where all the load will be placed on a set of screws or nails, for example. Or where there's not enough bracing against racking. Etc.
I know just enough to know that I don't know nearly enough to design a stand I'd feel confident around.
I think we overbuild because our diy "design" is not as efficient as those done by a professional, and we certainly don't want it to collapse...
I just had a similar situation, hanging a 70" TV, 1 wall mount is rated for like 37-70", another is 60-100", guess which one I picked
I just had a similar situation, hanging a 70" TV, 1 wall mount is rated for like 37-70", another is 60-100", guess which one I picked
vertigo01
Active Member
Like the above posters, I want piece of mind. Especially after seeing many big box store stands after they have been set up for a while.
Not in my house.
I used 1 1/2 × 1 1/2 square steel tubing for my new 150. As well I wanted full adjustability with leveling, front to back and left to right.
Is it overbuilt? Enough so that it withstood a 18' fiberglass bay boat, motor and trailer for 2 weeks (owner wanted to go fishing) with nary any inkling of worry.
Plus I had the materials, machines and wanted to say that I built it.
Not in my house.
I used 1 1/2 × 1 1/2 square steel tubing for my new 150. As well I wanted full adjustability with leveling, front to back and left to right.
Is it overbuilt? Enough so that it withstood a 18' fiberglass bay boat, motor and trailer for 2 weeks (owner wanted to go fishing) with nary any inkling of worry.
Plus I had the materials, machines and wanted to say that I built it.
You know I've seen some of these stands you're talking about at customer's houses and they get SCARY looking.
I've never even heard on the internet of one collapsing, let alone heard of one in person...let alone seen one.
Still SCARY looking.
Like I said, I don't think we understand MDF too well....certainly not a good idea to use something you don't understand too well in a critical application. It's good that we don't.
My problem with "overbuilt" is that it's not necesarily very smart....you still see "overbuilt" designs where all the load will be placed on a set of screws or nails, for example. Or where there's not enough bracing against racking. Etc.
I know just enough to know that I don't know nearly enough to design a stand I'd feel confident around.
I guess at the end of the day, we each need to decide if we want a stand that is engineered to be just good enough, or one that is overbuilt such that it can handle more weight and stress than it was designed for. I had a beautiful custom oak stand and canopy made for my 75g corner that I did not realize was oak veneer on particleboard until years of water contact led the stand to swell and sag. I tore down the tank before the stand failed and replaced the stand with a wood wrapped metal stand. I will bet that the guy who built the original stand saved less than $50 on materials. I would have gladly paid for the difference given a choice...
I am a mechanical engineer and I can tell you that while the stands at pet stores certainly work, my concern is what do they look like in 3 years. Salt creep and water do serious damage to wood and after time, that takes a toll. From what I have seen, most of the stands are made out of thin pine, and that’s a little concerning.
If you look at my build, I absolutely 100% know that it is way more than I needed. Yes I used 2x4s because they are easier to work with and cheaper, but then I also used 2x6s - and I only have a 29 gallon display.
The advantage I have is 1. I know that it will take way more water and salt to actually cause structural issues to my stand. 2. If I need to slide my tank off the wall, I can literally grab my stand and slide it - no problem and no shifting to the stand. 3. If I ever get out of the hobby I can use the stand to park my helicopter on.
So yea, just about every DIY stand I see is completely overkill. But when you are talking about dropping 1000s - 10000s of dollars on a hobby as well as putting tons of corrosive liquid in your living room - we should all over build the crap out of the structure that holds it all.
Just my 2 cents.
If you look at my build, I absolutely 100% know that it is way more than I needed. Yes I used 2x4s because they are easier to work with and cheaper, but then I also used 2x6s - and I only have a 29 gallon display.
The advantage I have is 1. I know that it will take way more water and salt to actually cause structural issues to my stand. 2. If I need to slide my tank off the wall, I can literally grab my stand and slide it - no problem and no shifting to the stand. 3. If I ever get out of the hobby I can use the stand to park my helicopter on.
So yea, just about every DIY stand I see is completely overkill. But when you are talking about dropping 1000s - 10000s of dollars on a hobby as well as putting tons of corrosive liquid in your living room - we should all over build the crap out of the structure that holds it all.
Just my 2 cents.
You know I've seen some of these stands you're talking about at customer's houses and they get SCARY looking.
I've never even heard on the internet of one collapsing, let alone heard of one in person...let alone seen one.
Still SCARY looking.
Like I said, I don't think we understand MDF too well....certainly not a good idea to use something you don't understand too well in a critical application. It's good that we don't.
My problem with "overbuilt" is that it's not necesarily very smart....you still see "overbuilt" designs where all the load will be placed on a set of screws or nails, for example. Or where there's not enough bracing against racking. Etc.
I know just enough to know that I don't know nearly enough to design a stand I'd feel confident around.
Honestly, store bought stands are reliable. And you're right, they have materials engineers overseeing and it's not likely that they fail, at least not in the short term. You'd be surprised how much of an MDF stand actually needs to rot away before the tank falls...
The big difference between a store bought vs. DIY stand is that manufacturers have the added concern of having to factor in materials cost and weight so that they can maintain profitability. The DIY stands that I've seen are usually amazing, but probably have 5x the materials cost of a store bought stand, nevermind what additional cost would be involved shipping those beasts!
In the end, I would not trust a homemade stand built using manufacturer specs though, so for the hobbyist, it's almost a necessity to build them like tanks. Fortunately, without having to deal with salaries or shipping, the end product can wind up being cheaper too.
erk
Valuable Member
An older tank I setup almost 10yrs ago is still running and sitting on the same Wally world mdf stand I bought for it. That is a freshwater tank though.
For my first saltwater tank, I built a stand using only 3/4" plywood, the good stuff. That stand was very strong. I threw it away after 2 years because it was ugly and I wanted to make something nicer. I would say mdf is fine as long as it is the high density stuff and is appropriately sealed with several coats of lacquer. That is the difficult part for hobbyists. I would say the majority of us don't have access to a HVLP sprayer to apply nice finishes.
My latest stand is minimal 2x4 frame skinned in 1/2" plywood to stiffen it. If I did it again, I would go 1x4 or 1x6 instead for the frame. The plywood is again, the high end stuff. In this case, maple plywood.
I'm a mechanical engineer and as such
I typically do some rough calculations prior to building a stand just to to be sure. To be conservative, I typically shoot for a safety factor of 2 or 3 in my designs. This means if the material isn't actually homogeneous, it should still hold up well. The better the materials you use, the more likely they will be homogeneous. That is why I like using high end plywood. The alternating layers compressed with a good quality epoxy are more homogeneous than solid wood and likely to hold up better in both compression and tension applications.
For my first saltwater tank, I built a stand using only 3/4" plywood, the good stuff. That stand was very strong. I threw it away after 2 years because it was ugly and I wanted to make something nicer. I would say mdf is fine as long as it is the high density stuff and is appropriately sealed with several coats of lacquer. That is the difficult part for hobbyists. I would say the majority of us don't have access to a HVLP sprayer to apply nice finishes.
My latest stand is minimal 2x4 frame skinned in 1/2" plywood to stiffen it. If I did it again, I would go 1x4 or 1x6 instead for the frame. The plywood is again, the high end stuff. In this case, maple plywood.
I'm a mechanical engineer and as such
I typically do some rough calculations prior to building a stand just to to be sure. To be conservative, I typically shoot for a safety factor of 2 or 3 in my designs. This means if the material isn't actually homogeneous, it should still hold up well. The better the materials you use, the more likely they will be homogeneous. That is why I like using high end plywood. The alternating layers compressed with a good quality epoxy are more homogeneous than solid wood and likely to hold up better in both compression and tension applications.
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