Power Generation and Storage

[siggy]

I am having a quote for solar done up and trying to decide what type of backup I want on the house. It is underground utilities in my neighborhood so I'm not 100% sure I need, but I am looking at a NG Generac or 8kW almost-whole-house battery backup.

oh, and @siggy, I grew up along Gratiot before running away from home to join the military.

Hey there @vangvace, I cross Gratiot every day
You have some homework to do regarding back up options. Personally I would go with a Natural Gas Gen-Set, Batteries Can go bad and cost $$$ as you will learn with the quote. Storage and ventilation are concerns too.
Your requirements should be based on frequency and duration of outages in your area. Most of my outages last 3 to 8 hours but 24 to 48 has occurred after summer storms blow threw. As you know we get snow but you folks see the Ice storms and severe summer storms so a generator would be my pick. Good luck!

 

[RobW]

I am having a quote for solar done up and trying to decide what type of backup I want on the house. It is underground utilities in my neighborhood so I'm not 100% sure I need, but I am looking at a NG Generac or 8kW almost-whole-house battery backup. How big is your house? 8kw isn't a whole lot of power. That's only 33.3 amps@240 volt. Also where do you live? Because here in florida, if we have hurricanes and trees get uprooted it can potentially break a gas line and your generator would be useless. It is always better to set a propane tank into the ground or if you are in an area where you can have a generator with an above ground diesel tank(usually attached to the generator) they are the most efficient. I have had a few clients that have larger properties and they were able to have a generator set on the property somewhat away from the house with 100 gallon diesel tanks. They can run full bore on 30kw generator for 2 weeks. That's 125 amps.

oh, and @siggy, I grew up along Gratiot before running away from home to join the military.

 

[RobW]

Amos. Sure why my first response showed up as nothing...

Anyway, depending on what you are trying to run on your house is what you would use to determine your generator size. A generator of 8kw is no where even close to running an entire house. Not sure what size electrical service you have coming in but, the average size home (depending on age) can be anywhere from 100 amps to the more common 200 amp service. If you install and 8kw generator which is only 33.3 amps max, you wont be powering very much other than lighting and a refrigerator. They do make load shed modules for generators that will shut circuits down if the demand becomes more than the generator can handle i.e. for air conditioners and larger equipments. Also think about natural gas like this... if natural gas is delivered to you via underground lines. (Which it should most definitely be) if in the even t a storm uprooted a tree and breaks a gas line, your generator is rendered useless. Set a propane tank in the ground to supply your generator and gas appliances. If your property is large enough and you are able to have a diesel generator. That would be the best option as they are more efficient than propane or natural gas. If you tell me the size of your electrical service, the square footage of your house and snap me a picture of your interior breaker panel. I can figure out a load calculation and let you know what size generator you really need to run your entire home or what size you need to run just important things that you want. Most people where I am want at least one air conditioner on their systems for the common areas of the home or in the master bedroom areas of the home. Then you obviously want to keep all refrigeration equipment on the generator. I.e. refrigerators, freezers, ice makers, wine coolers, etc. Some like to have a washer and dryer. Lighting takes up the least amount of demand of all the things on the house.

 

[RobW]

Amos. Sure why my first response showed up as nothing...

Anyway, depending on what you are trying to run on your house is what you would use to determine your generator size. A generator of 8kw is no where even close to running an entire house. Not sure what size electrical service you have coming in but, the average size home (depending on age) can be anywhere from 100 amps to the more common 200 amp service. If you install and 8kw generator which is only 33.3 amps max, you wont be powering very much other than lighting and a refrigerator. They do make load shed modules for generators that will shut circuits down if the demand becomes more than the generator can handle i.e. for air conditioners and larger equipments. Also think about natural gas like this... if natural gas is delivered to you via underground lines. (Which it should most definitely be) if in the even t a storm uprooted a tree and breaks a gas line, your generator is rendered useless. Set a propane tank in the ground to supply your generator and gas appliances. If your property is large enough and you are able to have a diesel generator. That would be the best option as they are more efficient than propane or natural gas. If you tell me the size of your electrical service, the square footage of your house and snap me a picture of your interior breaker panel. I can figure out a load calculation and let you know what size generator you really need to run your entire home or what size you need to run just important things that you want. Most people where I am want at least one air conditioner on their systems for the common areas of the home or in the master bedroom areas of the home. Then you obviously want to keep all refrigeration equipment on the generator. I.e. refrigerators, freezers, ice makers, wine coolers, etc. Some like to have a washer and dryer. Lighting takes up the least amount of demand of all the things on the house.

 

[RobW]

I am not sure why my first response showed up as nothing...

Anyway, depending on what you are trying to run on your house is what you would use to determine your generator size. A generator of 8kw is no where even close to running an entire house. Not sure what size electrical service you have coming in but, the average size home (depending on age) can be anywhere from 100 amps to the more common 200 amp service. If you install and 8kw generator which is only 33.3 amps max, you wont be powering very much other than lighting and a refrigerator. They do make load shed modules for generators that will shut circuits down if the demand becomes more than the generator can handle i.e. for air conditioners and larger equipments. Also think about natural gas like this... if natural gas is delivered to you via underground lines. (Which it should most definitely be) if in the even t a storm uprooted a tree and breaks a gas line, your generator is rendered useless. Set a propane tank in the ground to supply your generator and gas appliances. If your property is large enough and you are able to have a diesel generator. That would be the best option as they are more efficient than propane or natural gas. If you tell me the size of your electrical service, the square footage of your house and snap me a picture of your interior breaker panel. I can figure out a load calculation and let you know what size generator you really need to run your entire home or what size you need to run just important things that you want. Most people where I am want at least one air conditioner on their systems for the common areas of the home or in the master bedroom areas of the home. Then you obviously want to keep all refrigeration equipment on the generator. I.e. refrigerators, freezers, ice makers, wine coolers, etc. Some like to have a washer and dryer. Lighting

 

[RobW]

Ok so now it posted like 4 times....

 

[vangvace]

@RobW @siggy I think it might be a wonderful educational idea for the community.

So the home is ~1600 square foot, 2 car garage, and a full finished basement. It has gas appliances and a 200 Amp electrical panel. June electrical usage was 890kWh with an average temperate of 74F.

Quote 1 11kW QCell solar system with an optional LG Chem battery backup

Quote 2 13.65kW Panasonic solar system with an optional 17.1kWh Panasonic Battery Backup

Quote 3 solar system with generator backup

 

[siggy]

That looks like work around hear most buy a 14k due to cost when a 16 or 20 should be used. There are several online calculators to assist in your desired system.

 

[crusso1993]

Great article @siggy ! I am sure many will get much direction and help from your writing it!

There is a related thread by @Taxus812 about building a DIY backup that some will find interesting, useful and a good project. It is linked below.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/solar-generator-for-backup-power.621771/