Prime Reefer 250 - from the beginning!

[ksfulk]

Hard to say really - I mean tearing down the old tank got water everywhere. I havent had any real flooding in the basement in years, so I'd guess it was from the teardown a few weeks earlier. That said the foam padding itself was obliterated - it came off in wet chunks rather than a solid pad.

I dont want to panic you or anything, that was just my most recent experience. I had my biocube on the hardwood floors upstairs for almost three years - and when we moved it out, it was just a good scrubbing and a set of floor polish and you could tell it had even been there.

 

[DT Prime]

Hard to say really - I mean tearing down the old tank got water everywhere. I havent had any real flooding in the basement in years, so I'd guess it was from the teardown a few weeks earlier. That said the foam padding itself was obliterated - it came off in wet chunks rather than a solid pad.

I dont want to panic you or anything, that was just my most recent experience. I had my biocube on the hardwood floors upstairs for almost three years - and when we moved it out, it was just a good scrubbing and a set of floor polish and you could tell it had even been there.

Cool that makes sense, thanks for clarifying and chiming in at all!

 

[DT Prime]

Well the shims helped a bit with the leveling but water line's still about 1/4" higher in the front than the back (1-1/4" deep in front and 1-1/2" in the back). Probably should have bought bigger ones considering how ridiculously thick this rug is, but will live with it for now.

Ammonia was finally starting to drop a bit yesterday, as is my ph though so I'm going to mix a new batch of saltwater tomorrow and try to bring it up. Want to raise the salinity a bit too, which is at 1.024 currently:

Also think I noticed my first tiny speck of algae, time to read up again on the various species I'll run into since I did it back in July which seems forever ago. Hopefully getting closer to the clean up crew stage, figure this is the only time I'll be excited about having algae and looking forward to snails, so enjoying it while I can :)

6.5 gal ATO bucket came and I'm pretty happy with it, good size and sturdy, and the manual spin-lock lid is great for the limited space:

Also holds the doser for now, until/if I can come up with something more elegant.

Flipped the reactor around to try it out on the inside of the sump (though there is room for it to go back out), it's getting pretty dang tight in there though. Figure for this tank if I can manage to get the inhabitants part right I'm willing to live with the jenky aesthetics, then go for the super clean build next time when I have a better idea of what I'm doing.

Also got the marinepure ceramic filter, and gotta say the thing was way more brittle than I expected. Hacksaw made super quick work of it, you could probably use a serrated dinner knife honestly. Caution though, this thing produced a TON of debris even pre-cutting:

After initial cut:

This was on the third rinse:

And in the sump:

Ended up cutting it in half for two 8x8x2 blocks, then took 2" off the top of both halves and a 1/4" off the depth for 8x6x1.75, and then an extra 2" off the length of one of the halves. Ended up with an 8x6x1.75 and a 6x6x1.75 for 14x6x1.75 when combined which fit pretty snug.

Can't really comment on its effectiveness yet, still quiet and no bubbles so works in that sense at least. I would again caution there is a TON of debris and whatever is still on when it goes in the tank will be in your return pump chamber, I have a little sandbed in mine currently that I'll need to slowly siphon out tomorrow :(

That's about it from yesterday and gonna be up in wine country for the day- shout out to Napa Reefer even though we'll be in Sonoma! Hoping equipment is more or less set up to be functional at this point and can focus on finishing off the cycle, tank is finally looking clear and I'm ready to get my head out of the cabinet for a bit! My photography skills don't exist as you've probably noticed but here are a couple shots of the tank itself:

Cheers,
DT Prime

 

[DT Prime]

Little more algae showing up this morning looks like:

 

[DT Prime]

Looks like ammonia is almost zeroed out, nitrite honestly doesn't look like any of the examples to me but it's been pretty dark the last couple days, and nitrate looks like it make have actually dropped from 40ish to 20ish since yesterday?

Assuming ammonia is gone by tomorrow I'm going to do a 20% water change in 2 parts and get salinity up to 1.026 by .001 at a time, and then redose a small amount of ammonia to keep the cycle going. Hopefully by the end of next week it can clear a few ppm in 12 hours, at which point I'll probably start getting ready to order a small clean up crew for the next week.

Whenever I do end up getting them I was thinking of going with 5 each of cerith, trochus, and nassarius snails, and then maybe a couple tiny reef hermits, though I'm also debating going crab free. Definitely want to go with a light crew to start and add as necessary though, don't want any starving snails! Any thoughts from anybody following along so far? Or if I'm better off asking stocking questions in other sections let me know, definitely want to be planning ahead since eventually I want the corals to be the centerpieces.

 

[DT Prime]

Hey guys, hope I haven't bored everyone away with all this cycle talk! It's all I've really got right now sadly but I'll try to keep it to every few days until there's more interesting stuff going on :)

Ammonia finally zeroed and nitrate spiked Sunday morning:

I know they are supposed to spike anyway but I'm wondering if the high nitrates are partially due to adding the ceramic filter, since most of the negative reviews I saw were from people who hadn't soaked theirs properly and then had nitrate spikes/fish deaths after adding it. I washed mine a lot but also sawed it up, so probably released more of it into the water than normal.

Either way, did a 25% water change Sunday afternoon to get the salinity and ph back up, then redosed 2ppm of ammonia. That 2ppm cleared in 24 hours last night, and here's where I'm at this morning:

Checked phosphate as well for the first time, looks like it's at 0:

I am only running the lights maybe a couple hours a day at this point, think I'm starting to get the beginning of diatoms(?) cropping up on the top of the rocks closet to the lights as well though:

Open to any advice at this point! Not sure if I should leave it alone for a few days and wait for nitrite to zero out before adding more ammonia, or add a bit more ammonia now to keep the bacteria growing til it's clearing in 12 hours or less and just let the nitrite-eating bacteria keep building up? At what point should I do another water change to reduce nitrate? Thanks for any help in advance!

Tank currently:

Cheers,
DT Prime

 

[DT Prime]

Hey everyone,

Looks like it's confirmed my cycle posts bored everyone away so will refrain from more until it's done! That said hoping someone can chime in here and let me know if everything is going smoothly? :)

My ammonia zeroed out a week ago 9/17, I redosed 2ppm on 9/18 which was gone in 24 hours and I haven't added any since, however my nitrites have yet to move from >5ppm as far as I can tell since 9/16. Does that seem right? I tried to find some comparison API tests online since of all 4 its the one I have the hardest time matching to a reading, and while doing so saw a few places mention overly high nitrite levels can stall the cycle? Not sure if that's true but wanted to check and see if there's anything I should be doing differently or if it's just a waiting game at this point, not in a rush just want to make sure things are doing what they are supposed to!

Otherwise no real changes, continuing to get what I assume are diatoms on rock work and just starting on the sand. I moved my lights up about 4 inches after realizing they were too low as well.

I think I'm going to order the biotek marine par sensor off Dr f&s with the 25% off sale today so I have an idea of what they are actually putting out. Also reached out to artfully acrylic about a lid by email and message on here but haven't heard back. Anybody have better luck with a different contact method? Obviously they are slammed.

Lastly if there's anything I can do to make this thread more interesting I'm open to suggestions! I know there are a lot of nicer builds on here to spend time on so I'm willing to gimmick it up if need be :) everybody loves cats right!?

 

[ksfulk]

Hey everyone,

Looks like it's confirmed my cycle posts bored everyone away so will refrain from more until it's done! That said hoping someone can chime in here and let me know if everything is going smoothly? :)

My ammonia zeroed out a week ago 9/17, I redosed 2ppm on 9/18 which was gone in 24 hours and I haven't added any since, however my nitrites have yet to move from >5ppm as far as I can tell since 9/16. Does that seem right? I tried to find some comparison API tests online since of all 4 its the one I have the hardest time matching to a reading, and while doing so saw a few places mention overly high nitrite levels can stall the cycle? Not sure if that's true but wanted to check and see if there's anything I should be doing differently or if it's just a waiting game at this point, not in a rush just want to make sure things are doing what they are supposed to!

Otherwise no real changes, continuing to get what I assume are diatoms on rock work and just starting on the sand. I moved my lights up about 4 inches after realizing they were too low as well.

I think I'm going to order the biotek marine par sensor off Dr f&s with the 25% off sale today so I have an idea of what they are actually putting out. Also reached out to artfully acrylic about a lid by email and message on here but haven't heard back. Anybody have better luck with a different contact method? Obviously they are slammed.

Lastly if there's anything I can do to make this thread more interesting I'm open to suggestions! I know there are a lot of nicer builds on here to spend time on so I'm willing to gimmick it up if need be :) everybody loves cats right!?

Unless you are trying to win a popularity contest (I dont think R2R is doing that yet - but I could be wrong ;)) Dont sweat that people arent posting on your thread - lurkers are what make up the majority of people on here - people looking for ideas or experiences similar to theirs. The build is yours - so make it about you. I try to post on my thread three times a week - it helps keep me engaged and I can look back of what I was doing and what my issues were once Ive conquered them :cool:. Anyhow - I've been following along, so I'll do my best to answer some of your questions.

Cycle Stuffs:

Ammonia looks good, so your bacteria cycle is working. Realize that this means its working for how your tank is stocked currently - as you add new life, it will take time to adjust, which is why the general advice is to stock slowly and then wait. You have bacteria, but they can only cycle whats available - if they run out of food, they die back, if there's an abundance of food, they grow in population. Too fast in either direction is generally not a good thing.

Nitrites - Dont worry about this number, it doesnt tell you anything that you need to know about your tank. I dont test for nitrites - ever.

Nitrates - Generally I float in the 5-12ppm nitrate range. Looking at your little color chart, looks like you are between 10-20 ppm, which isnt a bad place to be. Without much livestock and a undetectable PO4 value, they probably arent going to move very much, at least thats my experience. Once you get some livestock in there, thats when the numbers start to move.

Artfully Acryllic - I ordered my lids from them the same day I ordered my tank. Ive had some email correspondence with them, but its generally on a 2-3 day delay (longer around MACNA time) but I would get a response and they have been good at answering my questions and suggestions. I've been told my lid is on track for a 6 week delivery timeframe, which means Im hoping to see some movement in the next week or so from them. Realize the more custom the lid ends up being the more lead time usually - but I have faith that the product will be well worth the investment in the end.

Glitter cannons usually work to jazz things up a bit - though you're equally likely to lose friends and loved ones :eek: And, for the record, I despise cats :oops:

 

[DT Prime]

Popularity is for high school, I just want advice! :)
I should just be posting them in the questions sections and leaving this for actual progress, the reality is this thread is very "me" currently since this the most learning from scratch I've done in a long time and I completely forgot how much I hate not understanding exactly what's going on haha. Plus I take marine life very seriously and really don't want to kill the first things I put in it even if it's snails, so I'm being extra neurotic these days. Thanks for help keeping me sane while I exhibit all the traits that drive me crazy in other people, this field/hobby seems to have a lot of conflicting info and unknowns which I'm starting to accept just means there are probably (hopefully) lots of paths to success...

On that note, interesting comment on the Nitrite. I've seen several people including scientific papers mention ignoring it but 98% of everyone else says it's toxic and need to 0 out before the cycle is finished/living things go in. So do you think I'm more or less ready for a CUC? My gut instinct is to do a big water change and recheck the levels tonight and if Nitrite is still high keep doing them daily until it at least changes color on the test kit, then see if it drops on it's own after that, then add a small amount of ammonia again and see what happens from scratch.

So no on glitter cannons- but what about TACO cannons!? Or are you the one monster in the world who hates cats AND tacos...

 

[exactlyobp]

I like the direction of this build is going.
What's the dimensions of the tank? (Excuse me if it's already mentioned)

 

[DT Prime]

I like the direction of this build is going.
What's the dimensions of the tank? (Excuse me if it's already mentioned)

Much appreciated! It's a Red Sea Reefer 250 if you want to check one out in more detail, dimensions are 36"Wx21"Hx19"D.

It's a really lovely tank in person, hoping I can do it justice.

 

[ksfulk]

Popularity is for high school, I just want advice! :)
I should just be posting them in the questions sections and leaving this for actual progress, the reality is this thread is very "me" currently since this the most learning from scratch I've done in a long time and I completely forgot how much I hate not understanding exactly what's going on haha. Plus I take marine life very seriously and really don't want to kill the first things I put in it even if it's snails, so I'm being extra neurotic these days. Thanks for help keeping me sane while I exhibit all the traits that drive me crazy in other people, this field/hobby seems to have a lot of conflicting info and unknowns which I'm starting to accept just means there are probably (hopefully) lots of paths to success...

On that note, interesting comment on the Nitrite. I've seen several people including scientific papers mention ignoring it but 98% of everyone else says it's toxic and need to 0 out before the cycle is finished/living things go in. So do you think I'm more or less ready for a CUC? My gut instinct is to do a big water change and recheck the levels tonight and if Nitrite is still high keep doing them daily until it at least changes color on the test kit, then see if it drops on it's own after that, then add a small amount of ammonia again and see what happens from scratch.

So no on glitter cannons- but what about TACO cannons!? Or are you the one monster in the world who hates cats AND tacos...

Heh - I love tacos... Id name my child Taco, but my wife wont let me. :oops:

I think if you are in need of a specific answer from a variety of people, then it might be best to start a new thread. I use my thread to "muse" - if someone chimes in, great - if not, thats fine too. As you get more involved in the forum and comment on other peoples threads, it tends to draw people to yours as well. Ive had three or four builds on here and 85% 0f those first couple of threads is just me. It happens.

Enough of my babbling... :rolleyes:

Nitrites is a fixed portion of the nitrogen cycle - so they are going to be there. Generally, Ammonia is considered the most toxic, then nitrites, then nitrates. That said, if the ammonia is not present, then some portion of it will be nitrites, and some nitrates - as the bacteria in your tank break down the ammonia that will always be excreted by your livestock. I find that nitrite testing can be finicky sometimes, but more importantly, the number doesnt tell me anything more than that they are present - which I already knew, since the ammonia was gone. Think about all of the things in the hobby that people use to remove nutrients from their tanks - GFO, Aluminum based media, sulfate reactors, chaeto, zeovite, etc etc etc - NONE of that ever deals with nitrites - we dont test for it, we dont treat it, its not an important number. (At least thats my opinion). Also, a big water change (lets say 50%) wont drop those levels drastically. You'd need a series of large water changes to bring the numbers down appreciably. Thats why people struggle to use water changes to drop nitrates, only to find that 5 - 20% water changes didnt drop their nitrates from 100 to 20ppm, but instead only dropped it to 45ppm. You get diminishing returns eventually. I would decide what your normal water change routine will be, and stick with that. If you plan on doing 10% every week, then do 10%. If its 10% every two weeks, then that... stability is going to be key, and by starting off on a schedule, you wont have to acclimate yourself or the tank to something you dont normally do - AND you're more likely to stick with it if its routine. :D

I think you are well into being safe to add a small selection of herbivores to your tank - but I would be judicious in your selection. Realize what eats what and who will eat who when you pick what to put in there. There's a great thread in the invert forums by Lionfish Lair that goes over a lot of the critters you may be considering for your tank. The author does a really good job of explain what each one does and what you should consider when adding them. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/choosing-cleanup-crew-critters.258695/

Im a newly converted anti-crab person, and Im trying snails only in my latest tank. Its a bit of an experiment, but like you said, there are many paths to success. I like trochus for film algaes. Conches are fun snails if you get the smaller ones, and cowries are really strange aliens like snails that are just too neat if you are into inverts. I can take a few pictures of them from my tank if you like.

Long story short - dont over think this too much. If you are getting some algae, then maybe pick a couple of snails or crabs. Start planning your livestock, fine tune your rockwork and start your maintenance routine now. The rest will fall in place in no time ;)

 

[DT Prime]

Speaking of things falling into place, I decided to zip tie the fourth big rock that made up the back of the "mountain" on the right side of my scape to the other three, since I was settled on the look after a few weeks and am paranoid of glass damage from tumbles. Like a genius I decided to do it in arm length gloves, since there's a bunch of stuff growing in the tank currently, and of course stupid-finger'd it with the gloves and sent the whole thing tumbling straight into the front glass panel. Luckily no crack and so far doesn't look like it scratched it either, but apparently there's a physics law that states I cannot replicate the same scape twice, so I have a modified right side that is more of a hill now:

It does have more "cave" to it, as well as a bit more flat space for corals, which I actually like, but it also has a bit of a jumbled look I don't love as much. Of course it stirred up a ton of crap hiding between the rocks, so back to cloudy tank for a while. Going to let it settle for a bit and try to recover from the mini-heart attack it gave me, then check again for scratches (and just found another tiny one, after already having issues with my glass cleaner scratching the front panel, sigh). Another time I wish I'd been more patient and spent more time scaping pre-fill and cemented these jerks together. Feel like I'm learning to drive in a brand new car and can't stop dinging it!

Lord, beer me strength...

 

[ksfulk]

Speaking of things falling into place, I decided to zip tie the fourth big rock that made up the back of the "mountain" on the right side of my scape to the other three, since I was settled on the look after a few weeks and am paranoid of glass damage from tumbles. Like a genius I decided to do it in arm length gloves, since there's a bunch of stuff growing in the tank currently, and of course stupid-finger'd it with the gloves and sent the whole thing tumbling straight into the front glass panel. Luckily no crack and so far doesn't look like it scratched it either, but apparently there's a physics law that states I cannot replicate the same scape twice, so I have a modified right side that is more of a hill now:

It does have more "cave" to it, as well as a bit more flat space for corals, which I actually like, but it also has a bit of a jumbled look I don't love as much. Of course it stirred up a ton of crap hiding between the rocks, so back to cloudy tank for a while. Going to let it settle for a bit and try to recover from the mini-heart attack it gave me, then check again for scratches (and just found another tiny one, after already having issues with my glass cleaner scratching the front panel, sigh). Another time I wish I'd been more patient and spent more time scaping pre-fill and cemented these jerks together. Feel like I'm learning to drive in a brand new car and can't stop dinging it!

Lord, beer me strength...

Oh, if I had a nickel for every time I knocked over rocks while I had hands in the tank.... Well, I'd have like $1.20, but still. Your heart always stops when that kind of thing happens! Glad theres no scratches from it. I knocked over a set of rocks on my newly buffed out Acrylic tank... and newly cried as it left a dime sized divot in the acrylic. It was heart breaking. No one else seemed to notice, but my eye always went right to it. Sounds like yours is ok which is great.

 

[DT Prime]

Sadly I did of course end up with a small "ding" on the glass where that rock hit it, so now there's essentially a permanent flake of marine snow in that area. :( This is the part where I hope against logic that my glass abusing days are behind me and just move on, luckily there's finally been at least some progress.

Ta-da:

I managed to lose one of the little test tube caps so stuck checking 3 at a time but ammonia is also zero, or was zero since I dosed it back up to 2ppm. Hopefully that's gone by tonight and tomorrow nitrites are still gone as well. I did end up adding a bottle of bio spira on Saturday since I had heard enough good things on here and the worst was just that it didn't work, so for $10 I gave it a shot. Nitrites stayed high until last night when they started dropping quickly, so not sure how much it helped since technically it was also the exact timing of the "nitrite takes 2x ammonia cycle" theory, but the either way I am happy not to see the same shade of purple after 2 weeks.

Chiller has been busy the last few days since it actually hit over 90 in SF yesterday (which is about as crazy as if it snowed). Assuming levels stay good I'm going to order some live copepods for the end of the week so they can start seeding the tank for a month or two before anything is in there to eat them, and then get some trochus/nassarius snails and I think a solitary hermit to work on the new algae and remaining diatoms

In the meantime I need to figure out what the heck I'm really gonna keep in here! At this point the three things I keep coming back to are a trio of flasher wrasse, a Mandarin, and goby/pistol shrimp combo. If I could fit all 3 (or 6 technically) then I think I'd be totally satisfied, otherwise 2 of the 3 and a couple misc. nanos would be fine too, so trying to figure out if that combo would work and go from there. Anthias would also be awesome but seem to be more better for a 75+ than a 55.

As always if anybody has any thoughts I'd love to hear 'em!

 

[ksfulk]

In the meantime I need to figure out what the heck I'm really gonna keep in here! At this point the three things I keep coming back to are a trio of flasher wrasse, a Mandarin, and goby/pistol shrimp combo. If I could fit all 3 (or 6 technically) then I think I'd be totally satisfied, otherwise 2 of the 3 and a couple misc. nanos would be fine too, so trying to figure out if that combo would work and go from there. Anthias would also be awesome but seem to be more better for a 75+ than a 55.

As always if anybody has any thoughts I'd love to hear 'em!

Just some general notes, since I dont want to stomp on your dreams too hard :(

A trio of flashers will be ok - assuming that you can get three different species. They will all become males eventually, so if you are willing to wait you can purchase females and save a few bucks - however flashers are often mislabeled from vendors, and picking up two similar looking species you can end up with two of the same species (example: I bought a yellow fin and a carpenter and ended up with two carpenters - that ended up as one carpenter). Adult males are easier to tell apart, particularily if you read up on threads and articles by @evolved and @eatbreakfast - two users here that really know their wrasses.

Pistol/Goby combos are cool, but you may never see them in a 55. Also, they can require some larger stones to build their burrows, as all similar grain sized sands typically cause them to "steal" other items to block up their burrow (frag plugs, snail shells, mushrooms and zoas, etc)

Mandarins - Im not going to harp on this one. If you can find one that eats frozen or pellets, buy it and enjoy it. Otherwise, its a LOT of work to keep one fish in your size of a tank. There are numerous other fish that would be similar to these, but without the difficulty feeding and sustaining. Though, I'll be the first to admit they arent as visually stunning. The Starry Blenny is a great fish for this type, as are clown gobies.

Anthias.... since they are pelagic and feed on plankton, these fish need large systems that can support their swimming and feeding habits. Some of the species in this group are less active and more "deep water" dwellers, so they can live in a smaller tank. Fathead Sunburst Anthias (Serranocirrhitus latus) would be my go to for a tank that size. Its a really really pretty fish and is a bit more cryptic than most of the other anthias. They can be kept singly and develop a unique personality from the ones I have observed.

In reality, you can try whatever you like, and if you put in some effort, you could keep any of those fish you mentioned. Just wanted to share some observations from someone thats experiemented with most of those fish before, with some of the same limitations. :)

 

[DT Prime]

Just some general notes, since I dont want to stomp on your dreams too hard :(

Stomp away!

I see what you mean on the wrasses, trio is indeed a dream but single one would be fine in reality. Would you think one wrasse and one fathead anthias would be ok together? If not I'll stick with one or the other.

Shrimp/goby I'm hoping would hang out in the left rock pile but I have pretty good views on both sides of the tank so hopefully the goby wouldn't just decide to hang out in the one back corner I can't see. It's built on big enough rocks I don't think the shrimp could move them but there's lots of extra rock rubble from the shipment and I have a ton more bagged up still. If it's mostly a question of visibility I'd probably take the shot.

Left pile:

Left side:

Right pile:

Right side

Mandarin I would definitely wait for a captive bred or one that was otherwise taking frozen food, and I'd probably go through a local guy unless there was a solid source of them out there. My other concern was the amount of flow since I'm running 2 mp40's and ultimately the goal is to eventually grow mostly SPS, seems like a fish that could get easily buffeted...

Thanks as always for the first hand experience!

 

[ksfulk]

Stomp away!

I see what you mean on the wrasses, trio is indeed a dream but single one would be fine in reality. Would you think one wrasse and one fathead anthias would be ok together? If not I'll stick with one or the other.

Shrimp/goby I'm hoping would hang out in the left rock pile but I have pretty good views on both sides of the tank so hopefully the goby wouldn't just decide to hang out in the one back corner I can't see. It's built on big enough rocks I don't think the shrimp could move them but there's lots of extra rock rubble from the shipment and I have a ton more bagged up still. If it's mostly a question of visibility I'd probably take the shot.

Left pile:

Left side:

Right pile:

Right side

Mandarin I would definitely wait for a captive bred or one that was otherwise taking frozen food, and I'd probably go through a local guy unless there was a solid source of them out there. My other concern was the amount of flow since I'm running 2 mp40's and ultimately the goal is to eventually grow mostly SPS, seems like a fish that could get easily buffeted...

Thanks as always for the first hand experience!

My experience with a shrimp/goby pairing is that they will always pick the most secluded spot to start off in. Heck, even unpaired these guys seem to like their privacy. My clown goby and fire shrimp - who are in no way paired - both have decided to live inside of my large rock island, only peeking out of the top in a place that I cant see unless Im looking down into my tank! The shrimp/goby pairs will move around and you might eventually have them visible - but in reality its the luck of the draw.

The flasher and anthia shouldnt be an issue together - generally you have issues when fish have similar body shapes and colors. The fathead is much less streamlined than any of the flashers and not the same in coloration, so I dont see an issue with that. Some wrasses can be jerks, but typically I find that the wrasses in the flasher family dont start off that way. If you can find one thats eating prepared foods, leopard wrasses are quite hardy and gorgeous to boot. Getting one thats eating and doesnt have damaged mouth parts can be a challenge though.

Something to think about that I didnt on my first few tanks - think of your tank as divided into three sections: sand, low level rock and open water. Generally, Id want something to inhabit all of those areas in my tank. I like movement, so I tend to stock heavier on the open water area than on the others, but I found that without something to occupy those other areas, the tank was missing "something". Just something to think about when researching your livestock :)

Good luck on your mandarin hunt! :) I dont know that the movement buffeting the fish is really an issue. Nearly all fish are well versed at adjusting their bodies to the change in water movement. Your real issue will be feeding if you have too much current blowing around and potential sandstorms if the sand is too fine of a grain. But if the fish are healthy and not being bullied, there shouldnt be too much of an issue with flow - you'll have issues with coral, substrate and water being on the floor before the fish get too upset.

 

[DT Prime]

My experience with a shrimp/goby pairing is that they will always pick the most secluded spot to start off in. Heck, even unpaired these guys seem to like their privacy. My clown goby and fire shrimp - who are in no way paired - both have decided to live inside of my large rock island, only peeking out of the top in a place that I cant see unless Im looking down into my tank! The shrimp/goby pairs will move around and you might eventually have them visible - but in reality its the luck of the draw.

Definitely, seems like a lot is based on personality/luck, there's a guy who lives near me with a JBJ 30 and his shrimp/goby pair hang out front and center constantly. Thanks as always for the insight!

Working list now is 2 male Flasher/Fairy Wrasse, Pink Bar Goby and Tiger Shrimp Pair, Cave Transparent Goby (reminds me a bit of the Mandarin, which I'm holding off on). Those will all need a lid, so in the meantime for a first fish I'm thinking either a Royal Gramma or Gold Assessor Basslet. Would love to add both but guessing they're too similar to be friendly. Then if there was room after all that would probably go with the Sunburst Anthias, unless that was too late to add it. Figure it would be the biggest thing in the tank at 5"-ish so might be good to get everyone else settled first anyway? So like this for order:

1st.) Royal Gramma/Gold Assessor Basslet 3"/3"
Receive Lid
2nd.) Pink Bar Goby/Tiger Shrimp 4"
2nd.) Cave Transparent Goby 3"
3rd.) 1 of McCoskers/Filamented/Blue Flasher Wrasse 3"/3-1/2"
and
3rd.) 1 of Red Velvet/Hooded/Orange Back Fairy Wrasse 4"/3-1/2"
Potential 4th.) Fathead Sunburst Anthias 5"

 

[North Borders]

Gonna do an Apex on this?!