Pro Reef salt from Turkey

FragQueen

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Hey, OP here - I want to thank everyone who has come to this thread to raise some of the same, and additional, concerns they have seen with the Turkish made salt. I want to say this thread was not created to bash or discredit TM in anyway.

As a long time reefer and long time users of TM salt (before it ever got popular by BRS, it used to be the odd man out salt back in the day), when I opened a new box of Pro salt the distinctive strong acidic smell (which I have never EVER had experienced before for the 15+ years of using TM salt) hit me I knew something was different. Looking at the box I saw this was one of the new Turkish batches, and the first batch of Turkish salt I had received. After mixing it the physical properties, smell, and sludge were all new and I knew something was not right.

This then led me to searching the issue out online which I found some complaints about the Turkish made salt scattered around the interwebs. That is why I decieded to start this thread, to see if others have also been experiencing issues and for TM to weigh in on the matter. Again, I approached this first that this could of been simply a change in raw chemical that only Turkey is getting based on supply chains, etc. I was looking for TM's confirmation that yes the properties were normal for the Turkish facility, or no they are not and could potentially be a bad batch. I was initially disappointed by TM's initial response of taking a defensive stands that nothing is wrong with the turkish salt, however Lou has been very helpful and genuinely concerned. He sent me a shipping label to send him a sample of the salt, which I have along with a sample of my tried and true German made batch.

I cannot attest to any ill effects to livestock as I did not use the mixed water in my tank, the physically properties being off and enough examples I found of people with negative experiences held me off from its use. I hope with my sample, and with others that have come to this thread, TM can pinpoint the issue.

As far as a consumer prospective goes, I do share the same sentiment that others have mentioned, with no disrespect, that if I'm buying a German made product I expect a German made product. Turkey is not known for great quality standards and Germany is the exact opposite as a pinnacle of those standards. TM is a premium product at a premium price, and as a such I expect it to be made in Germany. Its like you bought a Mercedes, expecting German made, but find out it was assembled in Mexico.
The smell.....the smell was literally the only reason I had cause for concern to begin with. The smell was the only reason I created a R2R account and have become a member of this community (you can thank my wife for the ridiculous username). a little recap:

Bought 2 boxes of TMP when it was on sale from BRS back in Nov2021. I have been using Brightwell for the past 2 [successful] years of reefing with some RedSea blue bucket as a backup for supply issues. Had never tried TM products but was very excited. I currently have a 250gal display and my project was to plumb in a 50gal low-boy frag tank to the existing systemy creating a 300gal system, figured it would be like doing a medium sized water change. And of course I do this over New Years weekend when no one is available at customer support anywhere and stores are closed... what could go wrong.

So I open up the first box of TMP salt and instantly smell a lemony/citrusy/whatever you wanna call it, it doesn't smell like salt. It just simply does not smell like nothing, it smells like something other than salt. I figure since I've never used any TM products before, that I shouldn't judge yet, maybe this is just how TM smells. I bring my 0 TDS RODI water up to temp first, then start adding salt a few cupfuls at a time, over the course of 15 minutes or so. The citrusy smell is still VERY detectable as its mixing, but again I wasn't sure if maybe thats just how TMP is. I let pump run for about 90 minutes, come back and the water is still cloudy. Ok, I'll give it the benefit of the doubt, maybe mixing a large-ish water volume takes longer. I let it mix overnight and the next morning the water has a haze to it. Its not crystal clear, but its not alarmingly cloudy either. I see the brown sludge at the bottom of the container that everyone has been complaining about. To be honest, I don't care at all about a little brown, I just wanted really great salt water. The saltwater still has this sweet citrusy smell to it as well. The salinity using a calibrated and clean refractometer is 1.025. The Alk was at 6.5 and all other parameters were slightly lower than advertised/expected. Again, this was after mixing overnight, so I wouldn't expect any reactions are still occurring. No big deal, I just supplement the Alk to 7.5 to match my system as well as up the Ca and Mg a bit. I move the water into the empty 50 gal tank.

Before I open the valves and introduce this new water into my system irreversibly, I decide to google this strange smell and if there's a reason the water isn't crystal clear. I was relieved to finally stumble upon @poidog 's original post about the same smell I was experiencing. Then I see Lou providing some feedback and ultimately assuring everyone that TM is 100% safe and addressing some concerns. I finally open the valves and introduce the new TMP saltwater into my sump, where it mixes with the existing water and goes through my filtration etc.

After a few hours, I notice my acro, leptastrea, chalice, and cyphastrea all have white filaments exposed. Not like a feeding response, but similar to getting a coral dip/cleaning. I do not have very large SPS colonies, aside from a massive rock of cyphastrea, so this reaction didn't worry me too much. The next day (now Sunday Jan 2nd) my LPS never open, and are sucked tight to their skeletons. Acans look like a spiked ball and my trachy/welso is a near perfect round puck. My elegance is a hollow ice cream cone, goniopora is a tight ball, hammer and torch are just trunks. My SPS (with the exception of montipora, I don't know why) are all showing patchy exposed skeleton. My soft corals are normal.

First thing I check is Alk of my system is at 7 (overall drop of 0.5 overnight) so I do a small supplement of brightwell buffer. I decide the most effective thing I can do is a water change, but I only have enough backup RedSea to make 15gal. Monday I call the number Lou posted on this forum and he answers the call. He and I discuss my system setup, water production technique, and the responses I've seen in my corals. We keep in touch throughout the week. I experience severe pH and Alk swings the entire week, to the point that I had to run my skimmer air intake line outdoors as I found my pH to be in the upper 6's. My Alk dropped to 5.4 (tested several times) at one point and I burned through buffer tryin to slowly increase and stabilize. I know this Alk/pH instability is harmful to my system and is to blame for the subsequent die-off I experienced. However none of this instability was present before I introduced the new saltwater into my system. Ive had 2 years of smooth sailing with my chunk of the reef.

I sent Lou 8 cups of my salt (some of y'all got free shipping labels but I had to pay out of pocket) which he received this past weekend. With regards to the smell, he said he did not smell a difference between my sample and the German salt, but that his wife did agree that it "had a stronger salt smell". He sent a picture comparing two buckets of saltwater, one of my sample and one of a control, and both were crystal clear. I have asked for EXACT techniques he used to mix such as if the bucket was covered, how long it mixed for, what he used to mix (wave pump, return pump, manual, etc), if the water was aerated while mixing, water temp, yada yada so that I could make a small batch and replicate his process. So far I have not received a response but I'm sure he's busy. No comment on the saltwater smell yet either. To be VERY clear, I DO NOT CARE what country/factory makes my batch. I don't even really care about residue.

As of today I've lost a large rock of cyphastrea, lost most of my acro (I didn't have much to begin with, but still sucks) I've had polyp bailout of my hammer, my Goni's are still closed and losing flesh, my pride and joy trachy/welso was lost to brown jelly. I dipped what I could in polyp lab reef primer to stop RTN, so far so good. No fish/invert loss. I've spent money on a Hannah salinity meter to appease the trolls on here saying my refractometer is trash (got the same readings) and have burned through an entire bucket of Brightwell salt doing water changes. These massive water changes also require me to burn through my food more in order to keep nutrients above zero. I drove to WWC in Orlando just to buy the brightwell salt and EVEN THEY could smell something different with the TMP sample I brought...

Lou has been very receptive to my feedback and has provided responses with 24hrs. Im a pretty understanding person and was going to keep quiet but after seeing Hans-Werners responses I'm back to being pretty upset. Im upset that I do not know what I may have introduced into my system, upset at my die-off, upset at how much effort I've had to put into the system just to keep things stable, upset at how much extra I've had to spend when I thought I was getting the top tier product, and ultimately upset that my technique/husbandry is called into question when others don't smell what I smell and their water mixes clear....Im not a noob, this isn't my first rodeo, and I'm not making rookie mistakes.


I will attach pictures of my coral's responses/losses over the past 2 weeks, as well as my mixing bin comparing TMP to control. I have introduced NO new corals, NO few fish, NO new rocks/structures since July 2021. My supplement/water change regimen hasn't changed in over a year. lighting and flow has been untouched since May 2021. I run no fancy equipment, just a skimmer, pH probe, carbon reactor.

tempImageuGi90o.png tempImageFNxQUB.png tempImageAFk2wu.png tempImagedlm0hO.png tempImage6S102X.png tempImagegyztNe.png tempImageDGbaEB.png
 
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jcdeng

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Hey gang. Maybe this is a good time to shut down the discussion for a while and let these guys finish the investigation? I understand why people aren't happy. I wouldn't be either. But at this point we seem to be reiterating the same complaints. Let's let TM do their work and you can judge the results.

Agreed?
On the contrary, I think this thread should be a sticky so people with adverse effects using TMPR salt can post in this thread instead of making a new one, (starting to get old thread after thread). And it can also make life easier for Lou and Hans to answer in a single thread instead of replying to multiple "problem threads" where people are experiencing similar issues.

It might further help them (Lou and Hans) that people can match the answers to their own question(s) with one of these common responses from TM:

A) We cannot replicate the issue.
B) Its normal, brown stuff is not harmful, just use it (maybe check your water)?
C) Send us a sample so we can run tests.
D) Hey if you are still not satisfied, fill this out and we will look into it; Tropic Marin Salt Questionnaire
 

jcdeng

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The smell.....the smell was literally the only reason I had cause for concern to begin with. The smell was the only reason I created a R2R account and have become a member of this community (you can thank my wife for the ridiculous username). a little recap:

Bought 2 boxes of TMP when it was on sale from BRS back in Nov2021. I have been using Brightwell for the past 2 [successful] years of reefing with some RedSea blue bucket as a backup for supply issues. Had never tried TM products but was very excited. I currently have a 250gal display and my project was to plumb in a 50gal low-boy frag tank to the existing systemy creating a 300gal system, figured it would be like doing a medium sized water change. And of course I do this over New Years weekend when no one is available at customer support anywhere and stores are closed... what could go wrong.

So I open up the first box of TMP salt and instantly smell a lemony/citrusy/whatever you wanna call it, it doesn't smell like salt. It just simply does not smell like nothing, it smells like something other than salt. I figure since I've never used any TM products before, that I shouldn't judge yet, maybe this is just how TM smells. I bring my 0 TDS RODI water up to temp first, then start adding salt a few cupfuls at a time, over the course of 15 minutes or so. The citrusy smell is still VERY detectable as its mixing, but again I wasn't sure if maybe thats just how TMP is. I let pump run for about 90 minutes, come back and the water is still cloudy. Ok, I'll give it the benefit of the doubt, maybe mixing a large-ish water volume takes longer. I let it mix overnight and the next morning the water has a haze to it. Its not crystal clear, but its not alarmingly cloudy either. I see the brown sludge at the bottom of the container that everyone has been complaining about. To be honest, I don't care at all about a little brown, I just wanted really great salt water. The saltwater still has this sweet citrusy smell to it as well. The salinity using a calibrated and clean refractometer is 1.025. The Alk was at 6.5 and all other parameters were slightly lower than advertised/expected. Again, this was after mixing overnight, so I wouldn't expect any reactions are still occurring. No big deal, I just supplement the Alk to 7.5 to match my system as well as up the Ca and Mg a bit. I move the water into the empty 50 gal tank.

Before I open the valves and introduce this new water into my system irreversibly, I decide to google this strange smell and if there's a reason the water isn't crystal clear. I was relieved to finally stumble upon @poidog 's original post about the same smell I was experiencing. Then I see Lou providing some feedback and ultimately assuring everyone that TM is 100% safe and addressing some concerns. I finally open the valves and introduce the new TMP saltwater into my sump, where it mixes with the existing water and goes through my filtration etc.

After a few hours, I notice my acro, leptastrea, chalice, and cyphastrea all have white filaments exposed. Not like a feeding response, but similar to getting a coral dip/cleaning. I do not have very large SPS colonies, aside from a massive rock of cyphastrea, so this reaction didn't worry me too much. The next day (now Sunday Jan 2nd) my LPS never open, and are sucked tight to their skeletons. Acans look like a spiked ball and my trachy/welso is a near perfect round puck. My elegance is a hollow ice cream cone, goniopora is a tight ball, hammer and torch are just trunks. My SPS (with the exception of montipora, I don't know why) are all showing patchy exposed skeleton. My soft corals are normal.

First thing I check is Alk of my system is at 7 (overall drop of 0.5 overnight) so I do a small supplement of brightwell buffer. I decide the most effective thing I can do is a water change, but I only have enough backup RedSea to make 15gal. Monday I call the number Lou posted on this forum and he answers the call. He and I discuss my system setup, water production technique, and the responses I've seen in my corals. We keep in touch throughout the week. I experience severe pH and Alk swings the entire week, to the point that I had to run my skimmer air intake line outdoors as I found my pH to be in the upper 6's. My Alk dropped to 5.4 (tested several times) at one point and I burned through buffer tryin to slowly increase and stabilize. I know this Alk/pH instability is harmful to my system and is to blame for the subsequent die-off I experienced. However none of this instability was present before I introduced the new saltwater into my system. Ive had 2 years of smooth sailing with my chunk of the reef.

I sent Lou 8 cups of my salt (some of y'all got free shipping labels but I had to pay out of pocket) which he received this past weekend. With regards to the smell, he said he did not smell a difference between my sample and the German salt, but that his wife did agree that it "had a stronger salt smell". He sent a picture comparing two buckets of saltwater, one of my sample and one of a control, and both were crystal clear. I have asked for EXACT techniques he used to mix such as if the bucket was covered, how long it mixed for, what he used to mix (wave pump, return pump, manual, etc), if the water was aerated while mixing, water temp, yada yada so that I could make a small batch and replicate his process. So far I have not received a response but I'm sure he's busy. No comment on the saltwater smell yet either. To be VERY clear, I DO NOT CARE what country/factory makes my batch. I don't even really care about residue.

As of today I've lost a large rock of cyphastrea, lost most of my acro (I didn't have much to begin with, but still sucks) I've had polyp bailout of my hammer, my Goni's are still closed and losing flesh, my pride and joy trachy/welso was lost to brown jelly. I dipped what I could in polyp lab reef primer to stop RTN, so far so good. No fish/invert loss. I've spent money on a Hannah salinity meter to appease the trolls on here saying my refractometer is trash (got the same readings) and have burned through an entire bucket of Brightwell salt doing water changes. These massive water changes also require me to burn through my food more in order to keep nutrients above zero. I drove to WWC in Orlando just to buy the brightwell salt and EVEN THEY could smell something different with the TMP sample I brought...

Lou has been very receptive to my feedback and has provided responses with 24hrs. Im a pretty understanding person and was going to keep quiet but after seeing Hans-Werners responses I'm back to being pretty upset. Im upset that I do not know what I may have introduced into my system, upset at my die-off, upset at how much effort I've had to put into the system just to keep things stable, upset at how much extra I've had to spend when I thought I was getting the top tier product, and ultimately upset that my technique/husbandry is called into question when others don't smell what I smell and their water mixes clear....Im not a noob, this isn't my first rodeo, and I'm not making rookie mistakes.


I will attach pictures of my coral's responses/losses over the past 2 weeks, as well as my mixing bin comparing TMP to control. I have introduced NO new corals, NO few fish, NO new rocks/structures since July 2021. My supplement/water change regimen hasn't changed in over a year. lighting and flow has been untouched since May 2021. I run no fancy equipment, just a skimmer, pH probe, carbon reactor.

tempImageuGi90o.png tempImageFNxQUB.png tempImageAFk2wu.png tempImagedlm0hO.png tempImage6S102X.png tempImagegyztNe.png tempImageDGbaEB.png

So sorry for your loss, I can imagine your pain... and thanks to threads like this, I only have to imagine your pain and not actually live through it.
 

Lou Ekus

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I have asked for EXACT techniques he used to mix such as if the bucket was covered, how long it mixed for, what he used to mix (wave pump, return pump, manual, etc), if the water was aerated while mixing, water temp, yada yada so that I could make a small batch and replicate his process. So far I have not received a response but I'm sure he's busy.
I'm sorry that i have not seen where you have asked for this information. I am happy to provide it. I just have not seen your request for it anywhere in our correspondence. The answer is very simple. I do a very bare bones approach to testing to keep things basic and simple. I take a brand new, clean bucket. I use supermarket distilled bottled water. I do not heat the water, I use it at room temperature. I slowly add the appropriate amount of salt and stir with a wooden spoon. I do not add the variable of a pump impeller and chamber. I continue to add salt and check salinity until I get to 1.026. When the salt solution is done, I do cover it loosely for the period of time that I hold it.

upset that my technique/husbandry is called into question when others don't smell what I smell and their water mixes clear....Im not a noob, this isn't my first rodeo, and I'm not making rookie mistakes.
I don't believe that I have ever questioned your technique or husbandry in a way that is challenging to your experience and knowledge. If I have, I apologize. The reason I ask questions about how things have been done, is because that information is necessary for diagnosing an issue. Also, please understand that I work with all types of aquarists, everything from professionals in public aquariums to newbies with first tanks. Asking questions is how I am able to get a sense of the type of aquarists I am talking to. It is never meant to offend or question your knowledge.

We really appreciate your sending in the samples that you did. I'm sorry that you paid the postage. Although I have no way of reimbursing you for that. If there are any Tropic Marin products, other than the salt, that you are using and do have confidence in, I would be happy to send you some product to make up for that expense.

We are working very hard, around the clock in our attempts to diagnose the cause behind these complaints. We are not deterred in our efforts by the comments of people using Tropic Marin salt, mixed in our facility in Turkey, who are not having any issues. The most help that hobbyists can be to us, is to fill out the survey we have created, it only takes a very few minutes, to give us more data to work with. In the end, the compiled data will lead us to whatever the answer is.
Tropic Marin Salt Questionnaire
I hope this all makes some sense, and once again, we appreciate all the cooperation.
 

FragQueen

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Thank you for the detailed information on how you mix. I'll try this later in the evening.

My comments about my technique/husbandry being questions was not a jab at you, but rather other users on this forum and in their private messages. All of your questions and comments have been constructive and appropriate.

I'm indifferent regarding the $20 postage, but saddened by the loss of my LPS that I can't afford to replace with current market prices, and the setbacks I have with my SPS.

Yes, I filled out the Questionnaire that you emailed separately.

What do you recommend I do with the two boxes of TMP I have in the garage? I've contacted BRS but they only refer me to you.
 

Lou Ekus

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Thank you for the detailed information on how you mix. I'll try this later in the evening.

My comments about my technique/husbandry being questions was not a jab at you, but rather other users on this forum and in their private messages. All of your questions and comments have been constructive and appropriate.

I'm indifferent regarding the $20 postage, but saddened by the loss of my LPS that I can't afford to replace with current market prices, and the setbacks I have with my SPS.

Yes, I filled out the Questionnaire that you emailed separately.

What do you recommend I do with the two boxes of TMP I have in the garage? I've contacted BRS but they only refer me to you.
OK, Well I'm at least glad that it was not me that offended you. I never want to do that.

As for the two boxes of TMP that you have, I'm not sure what to tell you. What would be your preferred solution to that. As we are still working on trying to find an issue, and have not, as of yet, been able to identify any, it is difficult to say what would be best. I want you to be happy with whatever solution we work out for you. So I'm wondering what you are thinking would work for you.

As for this solution discussion, I would prefer to switch it over to my email, as it is much easier to deal with there. Would that be acceptable to you?
 

((FORDTECH))

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I have notice most posters here have mentioned that the salt they are having issues with was bought in the past 1-3 months. I want to add to this the 20 bags of tmp 220gallon store use only I bought was at least 6 months ago more like 8-10. Not sure if they have batch numbers on the large bag but will check. Later when I’m home I can provide proof of receipt of the day I got them to show you it was way longer ago then nov of 2021
 

GillMeister

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As the OP, I do not agree to locking this thread for several reasons. Nothing here has gone against the rules and this thread allows a collective source of information for both TM and consumers to hopefully pinpoint and rectify the issues.
I don't want to sound combative but this is going to sound combative. Unfortunately. Again, not my intent.

I wasn't suggesting that it be locked. Just seems that the same people keep adding to this to express their disappointment and it's the right time to stop piling on and let TM do to their jobs. How many threads are there about this issue right now? It's more than a few. It's well established fact that TM has a quality issue to work out and my guess is they have enough background from this forums input to start the investigation. Adding more here does nothing other than satisfy an urge to air grievances.
 
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Duffer

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I din't want to sound combative but this is going to sound combative. Unfortunately. Again, not my intent.

I wasn't suggesting that it be locked. Just seems that the same people keep adding to this to express their disappointment and it's the right time to stop piling on and let TM do to their jobs. How many threads are there about this issue right now? It's more than a few. It's well established fact that TM has a quality issue to work out and my guess is they have enough background from this forums input to start the investigation. Adding more here does nothing other than satisfy an urge to air grievances.
The problem with other threads out there is folks come to the site and make a new post about this issue without doing a search,so we can’t control that..what I have been trying to do the last few days is when I see a new thread I point them in this direction so TM and others can help
 

drawman

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I'm sorry that i have not seen where you have asked for this information. I am happy to provide it. I just have not seen your request for it anywhere in our correspondence. The answer is very simple. I do a very bare bones approach to testing to keep things basic and simple. I take a brand new, clean bucket. I use supermarket distilled bottled water. I do not heat the water, I use it at room temperature. I slowly add the appropriate amount of salt and stir with a wooden spoon. I do not add the variable of a pump impeller and chamber. I continue to add salt and check salinity until I get to 1.026. When the salt solution is done, I do cover it loosely for the period of time that I hold it.
I am no chemist but I wonder if the wave action of a pump or even the heat of a pump would facilitate the precipitation some are seeing (meaning you cannot replicate it)? Just trying to be helpful but again I am no chemist.
 

DHill6

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I have a box of TM that I got from BRS in November unopended it says made in turkey . should I ask brs to exchange the salt to German made I mean thats what I paid for made in Germany not made in turkey im just saying .
They won’t do it, they say it’s ok to use.
 

DHill6

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I have used a heater and circulation pump for the last 10 yrs., only had a problem once with the 200g buckets of TMPro reading 600Calcium. I spoke with Lou, I purchased the new food grade bucket, etc. to mix in. Lou sent a new bucket of salt, that one mixed fine. Now I have one box of TMPRO salt which smells like chalk, compared to box I’m using now which does have this smell. It also mixes with a slight brown color to water. I’ve never had this salt look like this. I checked some parameters before tossing the water out. 1.026 , 8.2 dkh using Hanna, .05 phosphate using the low range desk top Hanna, 502 CA using Hanna and their water. I’m not using this box, BRS referred me to Lou, they say it’s okay to use. It was purchased from them in November and also from Turkey. To add to this I bought 3 bottles of Carbo Calcium. When it arrived the box was wet inside from 2 of the 3 bottles not being sealed tight. BRS replaced the two leaking bottles. The liquid is brown not clear like all previous bottles. All are from the same lot. I’m afraid to use it. Once again BRS referred me to Lou, so I’m sending an email to Lou. Honestly, I really like the products when they’re clear. On the other hand I’m not happy with the wasted money.
 

hsosa

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They won’t do it, they say it’s ok to use.
what up reef addicts . I just spent 45mins reading thru the post. yes there s no made in Germany tag on the brs website. Im Clearly see German words on the bucket. you would assume made in Germany since TM is a German company . assumption is for idiots? TM pro is #2 on the site right behind Instant ocean. the last BRS review on TM salt was late December with 5 stars. I have been using TM PRO for about 1year came from Red Sea. blue . I have had no issues with TM salt over the year ive used TM. I love that it mixes clear and you can store it for long term . I like that it has low alk because you can add more alk if u wanted to. unlike other salts. all these are pluses for me in addition I build old Volkwagen and Porsche engines of course if its made in Germany it must be the best. In. my pursuit on what s new and updated info on TM I saw this tread because I purchased. a TM salt made in Turkey.


my last TMGerman water change was Jan 9 2022 I keep mainly SPS corals and fish .

The turkey box is sitting in my garage unopened. I will post the lot number on the outside of the box. Now im in a weird paradox should I just say F! it and mix the TM turkey salt per the Salt mix instructions . I think alot of people miss this part mix at 77 degrees me included never had any issues with the German made salt. I can't say anything on the turkey salt because I haven't used it. let the salt mix sit for a few days and then do my normal water change.

On the other hand . I can be really paranoid and not use the turkey salt . and go buy German TM pro at my local lfs . I feel like im in the matrix . what do you reefing addicts think. thanks for the time. the good thing is I dont have to do a water change for another 2-3 weeks .
 

DHill6

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I didn’t like the odor of the new salt plus a few other factors. You could open the box, check for an odor, mix up a batch and see what you think. There’s always tossing it out. I have a lot of $ invested and not willing to risk it in my tank but that’s just my opinion. Agree that German products are usually made better. I’ve changed a couple things out to Royal Exclusive which has amazing build quality.
what up reef addicts . I just spent 45mins reading thru the post. yes there s no made in Germany tag on the brs website. Im Clearly see German words on the bucket. you would assume made in Germany since TM is a German company . assumption is for idiots? TM pro is #2 on the site right behind Instant ocean. the last BRS review on TM salt was late December with 5 stars. I have been using TM PRO for about 1year came from Red Sea. blue . I have had no issues with TM salt over the year ive used TM. I love that it mixes clear and you can store it for long term . I like that it has low alk because you can add more alk if u wanted to. unlike other salts. all these are pluses for me in addition I build old Volkwagen and Porsche engines of course if its made in Germany it must be the best. In. my pursuit on what s new and updated info on TM I saw this tread because I purchased. a TM salt made in Turkey.


my last TMGerman water change was Jan 9 2022 I keep mainly SPS corals and fish .

The turkey box is sitting in my garage unopened. I will post the lot number on the outside of the box. Now im in a weird paradox should I just say F! it and mix the TM turkey salt per the Salt mix instructions . I think alot of people miss this part mix at 77 degrees me included never had any issues with the German made salt. I can't say anything on the turkey salt because I haven't used it. let the salt mix sit for a few days and then do my normal water change.

On the other hand . I can be really paranoid and not use the turkey salt . and go buy German TM pro at my local lfs . I feel like im in the matrix . what do you reefing addicts think. thanks for the time. the good thing is I dont have to do a water change for another 2-3 weeks .
 

FishyFishFish

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You can see how TM are finding this difficult though. Someone mentioned an odd smell and now others are smelling it. But before it was citrus, and now it is chalk? Is it the same thing, something else or nothing?

And does anyone (other than TM) know where the German salt comes from? It could always have been mixed/prepared in Germany but sourced from somewhere else. There must be a reason why Turkey was chosen as a manufacturing facility. It could be financial, technical or location (or all of them). Turkey is by the Black Sea, which I guess could potentially be a good source for salt. There seems to be a suggestion that Germany is good but Turkey is bad, with no proof other than perception. Even if it is just the salt from Turkey having the issue, it might not be because it is coming from Turkey!

Whilst googling to try to find the answer to the question of the origins of TM salt, I stumbled across a forum from 2014, where someone was complaining about brown residue in the mixing bin from TM pro. Other people didn’t appear to have the same observations; that seems to be a bit like what is going on now. That forum then referenced an article from Randy Holmes-Farley that talked about precipitation in salt mixes.

I’m not saying that people aren’t experiencing something they weren’t before but maybe, as it is now being highlighted, others are looking to see if they have issues when they previously didn’t. If I said ‘do you have an itchy head?’ how many people now have itchy heads that didn’t before? Probably a bad example but if you’re looking to find something you probably will.
 

DHill6

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You can see how TM are finding this difficult though. Someone mentioned an odd smell and now others are smelling it. But before it was citrus, and now it is chalk? Is it the same thing, something else or nothing?

And does anyone (other than TM) know where the German salt comes from? It could always have been mixed/prepared in Germany but sourced from somewhere else. There must be a reason why Turkey was chosen as a manufacturing facility. It could be financial, technical or location (or all of them). Turkey is by the Black Sea, which I guess could potentially be a good source for salt. There seems to be a suggestion that Germany is good but Turkey is bad, with no proof other than perception. Even if it is just the salt from Turkey having the issue, it might not be because it is coming from Turkey!

Whilst googling to try to find the answer to the question of the origins of TM salt, I stumbled across a forum from 2014, where someone was complaining about brown residue in the mixing bin from TM pro. Other people didn’t appear to have the same observations; that seems to be a bit like what is going on now. That forum then referenced an article from Randy Holmes-Farley that talked about precipitation in salt mixes.

I’m not saying that people aren’t experiencing something they weren’t before but maybe, as it is now being highlighted, others are looking to see if they have issues when they previously didn’t. If I said ‘do you have an itchy head?’ how many people now have itchy heads that didn’t before? Probably a bad example but if you’re looking to find something you probably will.
It doesn’t matter where it’s made. It matters to me if there’s an odor that wasn’t there in other bags or buckets. It matters if it’s no longer mixing clear. That’s my opinion. I’ve used this salt for years. I haven’t changed the way I mix it. I have 6 smaller buckets in reserve that I plan on still using. If any product doesn’t smell or look right, I toss it, not try it in the tank.
 

DHill6

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You can see how TM are finding this difficult though. Someone mentioned an odd smell and now others are smelling it. But before it was citrus, and now it is chalk? Is it the same thing, something else or nothing?

And does anyone (other than TM) know where the German salt comes from? It could always have been mixed/prepared in Germany but sourced from somewhere else. There must be a reason why Turkey was chosen as a manufacturing facility. It could be financial, technical or location (or all of them). Turkey is by the Black Sea, which I guess could potentially be a good source for salt. There seems to be a suggestion that Germany is good but Turkey is bad, with no proof other than perception. Even if it is just the salt from Turkey having the issue, it might not be because it is coming from Turkey!

Whilst googling to try to find the answer to the question of the origins of TM salt, I stumbled across a forum from 2014, where someone was complaining about brown residue in the mixing bin from TM pro. Other people didn’t appear to have the same observations; that seems to be a bit like what is going on now. That forum then referenced an article from Randy Holmes-Farley that talked about precipitation in salt mixes.

I’m not saying that people aren’t experiencing something they weren’t before but maybe, as it is now being highlighted, others are looking to see if they have issues when they previously didn’t. If I said ‘do you have an itchy head?’ how many people now have itchy heads that didn’t before? Probably a bad example but if you’re looking to find something you probably will.
It also wouldn’t be the first batch of salt I’ve tossed. The buckets reading 600 CA went out as well years ago.
 

Hans-Werner

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Lou has been very receptive to my feedback and has provided responses with 24hrs. Im a pretty understanding person and was going to keep quiet but after seeing Hans-Werners responses I'm back to being pretty upset. Im upset that I do not know what I may have introduced into my system, upset at my die-off, upset at how much effort I've had to put into the system just to keep things stable, upset at how much extra I've had to spend when I thought I was getting the top tier product, and ultimately upset that my technique/husbandry is called into question when others don't smell what I smell and their water mixes clear....Im not a noob, this isn't my first rodeo, and I'm not making rookie mistakes.
I am very sorry about your feelings, this was not my intention, I am really sorry. I guess it is also the language barrier problem that I seem to lack some sensitivity.

I just wanted to avoid to draw premature conclusions and to fix the problem to a cause that maybe isn't the cause. In fact I find your hints more helpful than many others because they are more complete, go deeper into analysis and do not draw premature conclusions.

And yes, I already was more interested in your descriptions of smell, cloudiness and the reaction of the corals, which led me to the conclusion that the fixation to manganese and iron concentration is rather a dead end street.
 

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