Sitting at the airport waiting to pick up 200lbs of kp aquatics premium live rock how exciting !!!!

[((FORDTECH))]

You have an established system, right? Why not start pulling any macro hitchhikers (starfish, etc) that you want to keep and putting them in there instead?

The main benefit of ocean live rock is all the bacterial diversity. That's not going anywhere, that stuff's tough.

And, how bad the tap water would be depends on your tap. Some people have copper in their tap water, for one thing. Some people have tap water that isn't even safe to drink. Some have water that works fine for a reef, particularly if you don't mind algae. Most people have water somewhere in the middle.

Yes that’s exactly what I was just doing for the past hour pulled out a couple pencil urchins and a couple starfish and then decided to move about 30 to 40 pounds of the 200 is my system that runs through a filter sock hoping that it should catch anything that tries escaping the tank and going throughout the rest of my system. And as far as the tapwater I do drink the water without being filtered Chicago has some of the best water I’ve heard but it does have chlorine in it

 

[((FORDTECH))]

Was thinking by removing 30-40lb from the 200 will be less ammonia to remove from that system and that my main system could definitely handle the load. Made sure I cleaned my main system skimmer thinking it’s gunna pull some stuff out.

 

[Tavero]

@Tavero , with all due respect, can you dial it back a couple notches? You're totally detailing the thread.

Yeah sure. Lost in Sauce is telling me to buy american live rock because otherwise i don't know what im talking about, but i am derailing the thread when i try to tell Fordtech how to save this life rock. Lol.

You could have been at least honest, but i can take the hint either way.

 

[doubleshot00]

This is the first LONG thread I've read every post. And man i have the same anxiety as the OP. I would be as mad as fordtech. That's a lot of money to spend just to see issues. I mean what possibly could you have done different? Maybe have that brute pre-cycled IDK.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Yes that’s exactly what I was just doing for the past hour pulled out a couple pencil urchins and a couple starfish and then decided to move about 30 to 40 pounds of the 200 is my system that runs through a filter sock hoping that it should catch anything that tries escaping the tank and going throughout the rest of my system. And as far as the tapwater I do drink the water without being filtered Chicago has some of the best water I’ve heard but it does have chlorine in it

Prime, used as a dechlorinator, will help with your tap water. I wouldn't recommend relying on Prime to remove (or detoxify) any other substance though.

 

[Miami Reef]

Tap water itself may contain some ammonia. Plus all those metals (some places have up to 1ppm of copper in tap). I wouldn’t dare use tap with fresh KP rocks, unless I knew I lived in one of the few places that has really pure tap.

 

[Cell]

Seems like an awful lot of die-off when a premium was paid to ship in water. I thought the point of shipping in water was to avoid this kind of excessive death that would lead to an extended cure time upon arrival. This does not seem normal to me. All you can do at this point though is deal with it. I'd switch to IO salt for this process and save some money.

 

[xabo]

............

 

[Tired]

This is the first LONG thread I've read every post. And man i have the same anxiety as the OP. I would be as mad as fordtech. That's a lot of money to spend just to see issues. I mean what possibly could you have done different? Maybe have that brute pre-cycled IDK.

I don't think cycling the tub would make any difference. There's no plausible way to get more bacteria into the tub than would be on the rock already. It's not lack of bacteria that's a problem, it's volume of death vs volume of water.

(I mention water volume because a couple pounds of that rock in that size tub would be fine, not because you're at fault there. Looks like the biggest tub you could reasonably expect to have.)

I haven't read this entire thread; have you emailed KP Aquatics asking about/commenting on this? I know they say they remove stuff that's likely to die in shipping, sponges and the like, so maybe that didn't get fully done with this stuff.

 

[Cell]

Doesn't help your current situation, but for future reference and for others, never re-use shipping water.

 

[Floyd-]

Doesn't help your current situation, but for future reference and for others, never re-use shipping water.

Agreed! Even if its from the store straight home I dont reuse the water in the bags.

 

[areefer01]

Seems like an awful lot of die-off when a premium was paid to ship in water. I thought the point of shipping in water was to avoid this kind of excessive death that would lead to an extended cure time upon arrival. This does not seem normal to me. All you can do at this point though is deal with it. I'd switch to IO salt for this process and save some money.

Correct. Shipping fully submerged prevents die off. Or limits it. You unbox, inspect, and place. That is more or less it.

 

[MnFish1]

Denitrification Will lower ammonia and there is Thousands of times more denitrifying bacteria on those rocks, than a case of snake oil bacteria containing One unknown strain that cannot be tested and isn't disclosed by the manufacturers.

Denitrifying bacteria need to settle and reproduce which can take days to weeks to actually start doing their jobs in an effective manner. They will only settle on clean areas not already populated.

With a reading of 3ppm ammonia, that is Way too long and about everything will be dead. You could pour all of the fritz turbo start on your pet store shelves in the rock holding container and it will do nothing.

I think you are totally wrong - there are products that will 'help' remove ammonia from day 1

 

[Tamberav]

Crazy to how I really see nothing in the container anymore!! I picked up a few rocks to fillip over and inspect and only seen 1 star was alive but barely moving. The 200 lbs is in 120 gallons of water been doing 50% changes every 8 hours and already been thru 300 gallons. I’m out of rodi at the moment making more. At this rate my 150gpd ro system is not keeping up. I got 40 gallons now maybe will have 200 by after work tomorrow. Yes I’m still skimming wet orangish brown slime

When I did it, I put it in as little water as possible and changed 100% a day. Ammonia was pretty high at times. I picked out as many dead things as I could find since that is what is fouling the water.

Bottled bacteria doesn't help. I had some biospira so added a bottle of it... it did nothing measurable anyways.

Lots of stuff survived, I didn't know what all lived though... until many weeks after the rock was in the tank... stuff more or less came back to life.

I lost many of the bigger things like starfish, crabs, etc but bacteria, tunicates, coralline, feather dusters, and some snails all showed up/returned eventually.

Basically the important stuff for maturing a tank lived so try not to freak out

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

I think you are totally wrong - there are products that will 'help' remove ammonia from day 1

There are. Bottled bacteria are not those products.

If bottled bacteria could be relied on for this, you could (actually) instant cycle a tank with bottles and dry rock. Pour it in, add fish, no problem.

Some of the directions even tell you to. We know that doesn't work. Seneye testing has given us that data multiple times over. 5 days has been about what I've seen reported back consistently.

OP also has no lack of bacteria so adding more would not be a helpful solution.

 

[MnFish1]

There are. Bottled bacteria are not those products.

If bottled bacteria could be relied on for this, you could (actually) instant cycle a tank with bottles and dry rock. Pour it in, add fish, no problem.

Some of the directions even tell you to. We know that doesn't work. Seneye testing has given us that data multiple times over. 5 days has been about what I've seen reported back consistently.

OP also has no lack of bacteria so adding more would not be a helpful solution.

It works for me lol. I'm not sure which product you're talking about. But - they work. IF they don't keep the 'total' ammonia at zero - right away (and I agree I tend to add the fish on the second day) - they keep the free ammonia far below toxic levels of 'free ammonia'. IME

 

[MnFish1]

There are. Bottled bacteria are not those products.

If bottled bacteria could be relied on for this, you could (actually) instant cycle a tank with bottles and dry rock. Pour it in, add fish, no problem.

Some of the directions even tell you to. We know that doesn't work. Seneye testing has given us that data multiple times over. 5 days has been about what I've seen reported back consistently.

OP also has no lack of bacteria so adding more would not be a helpful solution.

1. I do not trust the Seneye to be as completely accurate as apparently you do.
2. But - maybe I'm wrong - can you send me to a link - where person xxx has added fish, and bacteria on day 1 - and the Seneye has not shown a safe free NH3 level until day 5 - and that thats a repeatable fact?

The reason I'm asking - I just added a bottle of bottled bacteria - into a new tank - I added 7 about 4-5 inch Koi into a 72 gallon tank a day after running a filter - and adding a tank 'Quickstart'. Now - first - I'll grant you - koi are not as susceptible to ammonia as saltwater fish - BUT my Ammonia Alert badge continues to show 0 - despite feeding. I have performed this every fall for 20 years. I have also started multiple saltwater tanks using various bacterial products and fish on day 1 or 2 - so - Seneye or not - I'm not sure anyone (including myself) has proven anything

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

It works for me lol. I'm not sure which product you're talking about. But - they work. IF they don't keep the 'total' ammonia at zero - right away (and I agree I tend to add the fish on the second day) - they keep the free ammonia far below toxic levels of 'free ammonia'. IME

Alright, our experiences differ.

Do you believe there is a lack of nitrifying bacteria in the 200 pounds of ocean direct rock, and that is the issue that is allowing the ammonia to spike?

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

1. I do not trust the Seneye to be as completely accurate as apparently you do.
2. But - maybe I'm wrong - can you send me to a link - where person xxx has added fish, and bacteria on day 1 - and the Seneye has not shown a safe free NH3 level until day 5 - and that thats a repeatable fact?

The reason I'm asking - I just added a bottle of bottled bacteria - into a new tank - I added 7 about 4-5 inch Koi into a 72 gallon tank a day after running a filter - and adding a tank 'Quickstart'. Now - first - I'll grant you - koi are not as susceptible to ammonia as saltwater fish - BUT my Ammonia Alert badge continues to show 0 - despite feeding. I have performed this every fall for 20 years. I have also started multiple saltwater tanks using various bacterial products and fish on day 1 or 2 - so - Seneye or not - I'm not sure anyone (including myself) has proven anything

Unfortunately I cannot link you. I'm not a save for later guy. I'm a read all day and try to remember guy.

For the record, I dose straight ammonia to rock curing tanks and my anomia alert badges never change. Fun to have around, I question their efficacy as well. It would be amazing if they worked as described, especially in tenths of a PPM.

 

[piranhaman00]

Should not have used the water in the box first of all.

I would dose prime