Supplementing All for Reef with NaOH

[Bucko]

My reef tank suffers from a chronically low pH of 7.9 due to non optimal ventilation in the living room.

I would like to experiment with raising it and hopefully improve coral growth rates.
Been dosing All for Reef and would like to continue to do so, now at 50ml daily in 800l total water volume.
Ideally I don't want to reduce the All for Reef dose too much so NaOH dosing seems like a good way to only boost pH without adding a huge amount of alk.

What I wonder is this:

1: Is adding Sodium ions problematic in the long run?

2: Is a 2M solution suitable for this? Don't want it too dilute in order not to mess with salinity. I have a chemical industry background so familiar with safe materials handling.

3: Any suggestions for failsafes? Don't want to dump my whole dosing container in my tank if pump stays stuck on. (Timer socket?)

4: If anyone has experience with this do you use a pH controller or set daily doses?

If this is a bad idea of course i'd also love to hear it. I've considered kalk in ATO but think this is less precise and will add too much alk forcing me to cut back on or eliminate All for Reef alltogether. Always open to alternative solutions.

 

[tzabor10]

Have you considered fresh air and co2 scrubbing

 

[Bucko]

Have you considered fresh air and co2 scrubbing

The windows that can be opened are open as much as possible. Have tried CO2 scrubbing but the impact was limited unfortunately.
Also not prepared to drill through the wall in order to place a fresh air line.

 

[rishma]

My reef tank suffers from a chronically low pH of 7.9 due to non optimal ventilation in the living room.

I would like to experiment with raising it and hopefully improve coral growth rates.
Been dosing All for Reef and would like to continue to do so, now at 50ml daily in 800l total water volume.
Ideally I don't want to reduce the All for Reef dose too much so NaOH dosing seems like a good way to only boost pH without adding a huge amount of alk.

What I wonder is this:

1: Is adding Sodium ions problematic in the long run?

2: Is a 2M solution suitable for this? Don't want it too dilute in order not to mess with salinity. I have a chemical industry background so familiar with safe materials handling.

3: Any suggestions for failsafes? Don't want to dump my whole dosing container in my tank if pump stays stuck on. (Timer socket?)

4: If anyone has experience with this do you use a pH controller or set daily doses?

If this is a bad idea of course i'd also love to hear it. I've considered kalk in ATO but think this is less precise and will add too much alk forcing me to cut back on or eliminate All for Reef alltogether. Always open to alternative solutions.

I’ve never done this, but I have considered it. I use kalkwasser instead (in addition to my AFR).

One thing I considered (which you probably have) is NaOH is providing alkalinity without calcium, magnesium, etc.

These are not exact numbers but close enough for the discussion…AFR is providing about ~10% more calcium than is being consumed. So you could dose ~10% of your alkalinity demand using NaOH and still keep calcium and alkalinity about in balance by reducing the AFR dose just a little to compensate for the NaOH alkalinity.

For your tank, you are only dosing about 0.35 dKH per day. So 10% of that is a really small dose of NaOH and I am not sure it would do much for pH. Any more than that and you’ll steadily decrease calcium and other elements over time, which is ok, but may require correction.

I dose about 60% of my alkalinity with AFR and the other 40% with kalkwasser. I think Kalkwasser is easier than NaOH because it also adds calcium and I only need to correct my magnesium.

P.S. I finally decided to drill a hole in my wall to get outside air…wish I had done it years ago.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You cannot literally mix them together, but dosing AFR along with hydroxide sources is common. Most folks use kalk, but my diy sodium hydroxide two part is also a good way to go. No need to reinvent the wheel. Use the diy recipe and calculators.

 

[Miami Reef]

You’ll need to use the calcium part in addition to hydroxide.

You may not get the full pH boost unless you switch the total tank consumption to hydroxide.

 

[Bucko]

You cannot literally mix them together, but dosing AFR along with hydroxide sources is common. Most folks use kalk, but my diy sodium hydroxide two part is also a good way to go. No need to reinvent the wheel. Use the diy recipe and calculators.

In this case would it then be better to drop AFR entirely and dose both parts the DYI NaOH two part? In order to avoid adding too little Mg/Ca when i have to reduce my AFR dose.

In this DYI two part where do trace elements come into play? Could I mix them together with the Ca/Mg part or dose seperately?

 

[Bucko]

I’ve never done this, but I have considered it. I use kalkwasser instead (in addition to my AFR).

One thing I considered (which you probably have) is NaOH is providing alkalinity without calcium, magnesium, etc.

These are not exact numbers but close enough for the discussion…AFR is providing about ~10% more calcium than is being consumed. So you could dose ~10% of your alkalinity demand using NaOH and still keep calcium and alkalinity about in balance by reducing the AFR dose just a little to compensate for the NaOH alkalinity.

For your tank, you are only dosing about 0.35 dKH per day. So 10% of that is a really small dose of NaOH and I am not sure it would do much for pH. Any more than that and you’ll steadily decrease calcium and other elements over time, which is ok, but may require correction.

I dose about 60% of my alkalinity with AFR and the other 40% with kalkwasser. I think Kalkwasser is easier than NaOH because it also adds calcium and I only need to correct my magnesium.

P.S. I finally decided to drill a hole in my wall to get outside air…wish I had done it years ago.

So you also dose a magnesium supplement daily?
How much of a difference did the hole in the wall make? Maybe if i'm stealthy my wife doesn't have to know that i drilled a hole through the house..

 

[rishma]

This thread has all you need to know about dosing DIY 2/3 part systems with trace elements.

DIY Balling Method Recipe

The Balling DIY supplement recipe utilize a 1:1:1 dosing ratio to maintain proper alkalinity. For instance, if you require 50 mL of the alkalinity solution, you should also add 50 mL of Calcium and Balling. Alkalinity (Choose One) : Option 1: Soda Ash Add 375 g soda ash to enough RO/DI to...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[rishma]

I’ve never done this, but I have considered it. I use kalkwasser instead (in addition to my AFR).

One thing I considered (which you probably have) is NaOH is providing alkalinity without calcium, magnesium, etc.

These are not exact numbers but close enough for the discussion…AFR is providing about ~10% more calcium than is being consumed. So you could dose ~10% of your alkalinity demand using NaOH and still keep calcium and alkalinity about in balance by reducing the AFR dose just a little to compensate for the NaOH alkalinity.

For your tank, you are only dosing about 0.35 dKH per day. So 10% of that is a really small dose of NaOH and I am not sure it would do much for pH. Any more than that and you’ll steadily decrease calcium and other elements over time, which is ok, but may require correction.

I dose about 60% of my alkalinity with AFR and the other 40% with kalkwasser. I think Kalkwasser is easier than NaOH because it also adds calcium and I only need to correct my magnesium.

P.S. I finally decided to drill a hole in my wall to get outside air…wish I had done it years ago.

So you also dose a magnesium supplement daily?
How much of a difference did the hole in the wall make? Maybe if i'm stealthy my wife doesn't have to know that i drilled a hole through the house..

I add some Mg every 2 weeks.

Aeration with outdoor air can have a significant impact. My pH is close to 0.3 higher, but I use a massive amount of air relative to my water volume.

My wife found out…wasn’t mad

 

[Miami Reef]

@Bucko Follow the recipe Rishma posted ^

That’s the complete system with NaOH.

 

[Bucko]

Thanks a lot for the replies, i'll dive into that thread and get educated

 

[FishLvR]

My most successful reef rank ran at 7.9 pH. Unless you are having issues I wouldn't chase it.