The Blue Window - 500 G in wall, never ending build

[Dennis Cartier]

I mentioned the difficulty that I had in accessing my previous tank even though it was 1/2 the depth (front to back) of this one, mainly due to only being able to lean over the back side. Moving the lights out of the way on that one was also tedious. I decided that for this tank to be fun to work on, I needed to address these types of issues from the start and take measures to not have a repeat of last time. The solutions I came up with leverage some of my previous experiences with aluminum extrusions and motion control.

To deal with the difficulty of accessing the tank from above, the tank will have 2 aluminum rails running the length of the tank suspended above the euro bracing, with high density foam below each rail. These rails will serve a bunch of purposes. The main function is to allow me to have a 'creeper' that runs along the rails that I can lie on my stomach on and reach down into the tank from above. The creeper will be 2 extrusions on carriages that I can remove the platform from, and slide out of the way at the overflow end of the tank when I am not using them.

There will also be a 3rd extrusion, again running on carriages. This one will be able to position itself along the length of the tank (Y axis) and will have another carriage on the extrusion that can be positioned between the front and back of the tank (X axis). The carriage riding on the X axis will carry a camera. Probably an Raspberry Pi 8mp V2 camera. The RPI itself will be mounted off to the side on the Y axis carriage closest to the front of the tank. I plan to run the power and cabling through an energy chain mounted in a cableway on the extrusions at the front of the tank. The plan for this is to schedule daily time lapse photos from above, with the pumps off to capture growth over time. I know, I might be counting my chickens before they are hatched, or in this case my acros before they have grown, but I like to plan for optimism. My biggest concern with this idea, is keeping the motion control hardware both out of the way and dry.

Maybe some photos will help?

This is the first part of the rails and supporting structure going in. The 2x4's in the cutouts are screwed to the floor joist running above the bulkhead. The fittings attached to the 2x4 are aluminum, so I used brass 1/4" rod for suspension ties. The original plan was to have those front ties along with some rear supports that will be part of the walk platform to form the majority of the support. What became clear, is that 1/4" rods are pretty much like wet spaghetti when it comes to lateral force. So I altered the design so that they are not relied on as much (if at all).

When I was trying to position the fitting to make sure I lined up the top fitting for screwing, I found that a jig came in really handy.

This view with some of the extrusions in place will help visualize what the structure entails.

These are the carriages that will be used for all the movable fixtures (platform, camera. lights, etc).

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

This was during a leak test (early this year). At this point I had more of the supports in place. There is only one end complete in the photo, but the end supports will form the upright rails for the light rack to move up and down on are visible on the left side of the tank.

Happy to report, no leaks were detected.

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Ok, I am getting closer to real time updates rather than all things that already happened and were queued up. Hopefully progress and updates continue once the queue runs dry (or the idea of making a build thread as a means to encourage progress has failed!).

The light rack runs on the uprights on each end of the rail system that support the end of the rails using the floor joists above. In the photo below the loops where cables will attache are visible on the light rack. The upper central rail that will be used by the pulley system is not yet present at this point.

The upper rail, for the pulleys, and the pulleys are in place now.

For raising and lowering the light rack, a single linear actuator will be installed on the middle support at the rear of the tank. The vendor from eBay forgot to send both the controller and brackets for the actuator. I have since received the controller, but it seems the vendor does not have access to the brackets. I bought what I thought would fit locally, but the dowel turned out to be too big. I will keep looking.

Not the best photo for showing the light rack hardware. You can just make out the 1/8" cord that I installed to test with. I have since ordered in some 1/16" kevlar cord from Amazon. The new cord has a breaking point of 3000 lbs (1500 lbs per cord). I only expect to have to support 100 -150 lbs. This photo also sheds some light on the slow progress. My helpers are always sleeping on the job!

Dennis

 

[User]

I’m intrigued by your support gantry you plan to lie on to get access to the front of the glass. Do you envision having it support your chest, your belly? Your essentially building a moveable table you’ll lie on, right?


Is that a 24” actuator? Are you doing a tackle rig to multiply the travel distance or will that be enough to raise the lights high enough for access?

Great stuff.

 

[ihavecrabs]

Awesome build so far. Following along!

 

[jabberwock]

Awesome! And thank you, my wife now thinks I am less insane than she did before!

 

[Dennis Cartier]

I’m intrigued by your support gantry you plan to lie on to get access to the front of the glass. Do you envision having it support your chest, your belly? Your essentially building a moveable table you’ll lie on, right?


Is that a 24” actuator? Are you doing a tackle rig to multiply the travel distance or will that be enough to raise the lights high enough for access?

Great stuff.

Yes the gantry will be the equivalent of a mechanics creeper, except I will lie on it chest down with my arms extended on each side, or at least that is the idea. The issues that will make it a success or failure, will probably turn on how easy it is to use and how comfortable. Since the tank is 36" wide, and I plan to have a walk platform at the rear that is at the height on the tank bottom, I think that having something to support me more than just leaning over the tank may be a good thing. Unfortunately the rails do increase the required reach to access the bottom, so I suspect I am going to need to become adept at using minimal grippers and manipulators in any case.

I was toying with the idea of using the leftover FRP grating I have from the sheet I cut the walk platform from, to make a floating structure to hold all the rock work about 4" off the bottom of the tank, with branch rocks zip tied to the edges to hide the fact it is a 1" thick panel. Thinking about what would happen if frags fell between the rocks covering the grating, and how hard or impossible they would be to retrieve from the bottom under the grating, has me re-considering that idea.

Yes, the linear actuator is 20". I expect I only need about 15" at most before the bulkhead will impede the mounted lights. I originally wanted to be able to pull the light rack all the way to the ceiling, but as my lighting plans have changed, so has the mechanical limitations. The rigging is not multiplying the distance, though that would have been a good idea.

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Awesome! And thank you, my wife now thinks I am less insane than she did before!

LOL. Oh, well then you will definitely have to show your wife my next update about my lights. She will think of you as the gold standard of moderation and considered actions.

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

I have been thinking about how to explain my lighting choices and how they have shifted over the last 2 years, even before any of them got mounted. Probably just easier to show a group shot and then explain each stage of the process.

My original plan was to use 4 x 250W MH along with 4 x 60" T5 per end and 3 x AP700, 1 in the centre of the tank, and 1 per end between the MH. This pile represents most of that plan. I have all the T5 bulbs and MH bulbs on hand as well. This plan eventually started to shift to using only the AP700 units along with T5's.

At that point, the plan has shifted to using 5 x AP700 along with the 60" T5 retrofits. Each Ap700 would cover a 24" x 36" section of the tank.

Then the Aquatic Life fixtures came on the seen, and after using them on my frag tank, I decided they would be much easier to mount, and I could get a lot more T5 coverage from them. So I ordered 5 of them to go along with my 5 x AP700. They would be mounted front to back just like the AP700's were going to be. I also wanted to be prepared, so I ordered in 20 x 24" T5 bulbs (ouch).

After thinking about it some more, looking to see what some of the better known reefers use, and the fact that I have never been enamoured with the control capability of the AP700. It works, but seems far from polished. I decided to switch to a smaller cheaper light, where I can provide a wall of light. I am using 22 x AI Hydra 26 HD units (this is only 14, I have 8 more arriving this week). I will also be buying 2 more Aquatic Life 48" fixtures, ditching the end frames and using the T5 modules, 2 per end of tank to run in between the rows of 26 HD units. Each end of the tank will have 3 x 3 26 HD units and 2 x 48" T5 module. There will be 4 26 HD units in the center between the glass braces.

See @jabberwock, I am betting this makes you look down right conservative! Note to self, make sure my significant other never sees this post ....

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Let's talk about my plans for water flow in the tank. Rather than iterate through a bunch of different pump family purchases, I thought I would seek input from my fellow reefers. That is not to say that I did not have a plan for water flow and have the hardware already standing by (I do), but I would like feedback on my plans.

My original and still current goal was to have pumps only on the overflow end of the tank. I would like to have no pumps on the back glass or be limited to ones no further than 4" from the end panes. With this goal in mind, I planned to use Maxspect Gyres, 2 x XF280 and 2 x XF250. Both XF250 would be mounted vertically, close to the front and back glass. Creating a current running along the front and back glass. One XF280 would be mounted just below the weir. I had planned to mount the other XF280 on the far end of the tank and have the facade dip down there to hide it from the outside, but I am now thinking I do not want to do that just due to the aethstetics. I bought a spare XF250 and Xf280 to account for maintenance and downtime, so I have 3 of each already.

I also have a used Ocean's Motion 4 way valve that I was thinking about using to return water to the 4 corners of the tank. I plan to run 2 return pumps for redundancy anyway. Only 1 would be using the OM valve.

I have HDPE panels cut to fit into the pockets created by the bottom bracing. I was doing this originally to avoid having the rocks sitting on the glass directly, but still with a firm base. I had planned to run a sand bottom, as I am going for a natural look. However with my plans swinging back to more towards SPS, I am wondering if the sand is going to be able to take the flow.

The other pumps that I am interested in are Tunze 3 and Panta Rhei. Do you think the 3 Gyres (all on the overflow end) and the OM Valve will give me enough random flow? Perhaps a couple of Sea Sweeps rotating in 2 of the corners (front Overflow and back short side) would help? Or maybe just have the OM return through 4 x 1" Sea Swirls (1 per corner)?

So, please provide feedback on what has worked well for you in larger tanks so I can head off the pile of pumps from forming.

Dennis

Here is what we have to work with so far.

 

[Muttley000]

what gpm are you going to push through the OM?

 

[Dennis Cartier]

what gpm are you going to push through the OM?

I was planning on a 10 x the tank volume flow rate (500 G x 10 = 5000 gph), and with 2 return pumps, that is about 2500 gph per pump, so I would be pushing 2500 gph through the OM. Mine is a used 4 port model, but it *should* handle that flow rate.

Dennis

 

[uncle luke]

Beautiful!

 

[Kmsutows]

Very cool build man! I've read all good things about pants rhei. Definitely need something to make the 10' distance. I've always liked the idea bbn of sea sweeps too, sounds great to me! I also like aquarium engineering for large tank equipment. You should really check them out if you haven't yet

 

[4FordFamily]

Holy crap what do you need with 22 hydra 26s??? Lol!

@HotRocks

You’re gonna melt the tank!

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Beautiful!

Thanks uncle luke!

Very cool build man! I've read all good things about pants rhei. Definitely need something to make the 10' distance. I've always liked the idea bbn of sea sweeps too, sounds great to me! I also like aquarium engineering for large tank equipment. You should really check them out if you haven't yet

I am pretty sure the XF280 can cover the 10' easily, but I am worried the flow may not be random enough. The Sea Sweeps would certainly help with the random aspects. After I mentioned the Sea Swirls above, I noticed that they are too tall to clear my rail system. The Sea Sweeps should just squeak under. The Panta Rhei are neat looking pumps. Very pricey though. I have looked at Aquarium Engineering before. Giant sized products for giant sized tanks. I would not be surprised to see their stuff in the local Ripley's Aquarium, where the tanks are measured in 10 of thousands of gallons.

Dennis

 

[Dennis Cartier]

Holy crap what do you need with 22 hydra 26s??? Lol!

@HotRocks

You’re gonna melt the tank!

Ha, death from above. Let me explain my thinking on the usage of that many HD 26 units. My first (modern) reef tank was a 120 G (60" x 18" x 26"). For that tank I constructed my own DIY LED panels. One panel was 24" x 12" and the other was 18" x 12". Each panel had a huge number of 10W COB modules and a few 20W modules for the more niche spectrums (420 nm, 430 nm). Because the aluminum plates that I used for mounting (and cooling) the COB modules had such a large footprint compared to the tank size, there was a lot of overlapping coverage even though it was LED. I was never able to run them full power, there was like 420W of LEDs, but it gave a nice smooth light and really caused the corals to pop with the actinic modules (20W 420 nm). Fast forward to now, and everyone is lamenting the loss of the even light spread that T5's were known for when going with LED. After using an AP700 on my frag tank, it made me realize how well my old DIY version worked. I have added 4 x 48" T5 to the frag tank to help fill in the shadows.

When the Philips Coral Care was announced, it sounded perfect and very similar to the same idea as my DIY version (lots of LEDs spread out over a large surface area). Unfortunately it does not look like they are coming to North America any time soon. They (Philips) takes steps to prevent them from being exported, so I gave up on buying 5 of those units for this tank.

While talking to a LFS owner about my plan to use AP700 units and my hesitation about the controllability, he suggested I look at Aqua Illumination as they have much better control features. While researching their products and thinking about the possibility of recreating the same effect as my DIY version from years ago, I ran across Stuart Bertram's tank on the AI site. I have followed Stuart's tank for years and have always thought it a great example of a good SPS tank. The AI site has pictures of Stuart's tank showing his light setup. His tank is a bit bigger (793G) and uses (20) 26 HD units. His front to back depth is greater than mine, so he is able to have a more straightforward mounting pattern. Due to the 2 centre braces getting in the way, I am going with (22) units, but if I did not have those braces, I probably could have got away with 18 or 21. I have a feeling the braces are going to pick up a lot of salt, so I am planning to not have to depend on light being unobstructed by them, by limiting what is shining through them (the T5 modules will shine through them).

Anyway, with 22 units of 2 pucks of 13 LEDs (per puck), that will give me 572 individual LEDs over the tank. The uniformity of light should be pretty good.

Dennis

 

[4FordFamily]

Ha, death from above. Let me explain my thinking on the usage of that many HD 26 units. My first (modern) reef tank was a 120 G (60" x 18" x 26"). For that tank I constructed my own DIY LED panels. One panel was 24" x 12" and the other was 18" x 12". Each panel had a huge number of 10W COB modules and a few 20W modules for the more niche spectrums (420 nm, 430 nm). Because the aluminum plates that I used for mounting (and cooling) the COB modules had such a large footprint compared to the tank size, there was a lot of overlapping coverage even though it was LED. I was never able to run them full power, there was like 420W of LEDs, but it gave a nice smooth light and really caused the corals to pop with the actinic modules (20W 420 nm). Fast forward to now, and everyone is lamenting the loss of the even light spread that T5's were known for when going with LED. After using an AP700 on my frag tank, it made me realize how well my old DIY version worked. I have added 4 x 48" T5 to the frag tank to help fill in the shadows.

When the Philips Coral Care was announced, it sounded perfect and very similar to the same idea as my DIY version (lots of LEDs spread out over a large surface area). Unfortunately it does not look like they are coming to North America any time soon. They (Philips) takes steps to prevent them from being exported, so I gave up on buying 5 of those units for this tank.

While talking to a LFS owner about my plan to use AP700 units and my hesitation about the controllability, he suggested I look at Aqua Illumination as they have much better control features. While researching their products and thinking about the possibility of recreating the same effect as my DIY version from years ago, I ran across Stuart Bertram's tank on the AI site. I have followed Stuart's tank for years and have always thought it a great example of a good SPS tank. The AI site has pictures of Stuart's tank showing his light setup. His tank is a bit bigger (793G) and uses (20) 26 HD units. His front to back depth is greater than mine, so he is able to have a more straightforward mounting pattern. Due to the 2 centre braces getting in the way, I am going with (22) units, but if I did not have those braces, I probably could have got away with 18 or 21. I have a feeling the braces are going to pick up a lot of salt, so I am planning to not have to depend on light being unobstructed by them, by limiting what is shining through them (the T5 modules will shine through them).

Anyway, with 22 units of 2 pucks of 13 LEDs (per puck), that will give me 572 individual LEDs over the tank. The uniformity of light should be pretty good.

Dennis

I do love my AI— I thought I had a lot of AI. I’ve got 3 Hydra 52HDs, 5 Hydra 26HD, and 1 Prime HD over a 180, 450, and a 34 (reefer 170) respectively. I don’t want to see your electric bill, haha!

 

[Dennis Cartier]

I do love my AI— I thought I had a lot of AI. I’ve got 3 Hydra 52HDs, 5 Hydra 26HD, and 1 Prime HD over a 180, 450, and a 34 (reefer 170) respectively. I don’t want to see your electric bill, haha!

That is a lot of AI units. So clearly they are working for you. Do you run any T5 supplementation as well?

I have big hopes that I am going to like them. I had better like them. I bought a ton of them. When I pick up the other (8) 26HD units, there should also be (10) Prime HD's with them. I am setting up a couple of Reefer 250 tanks next and want to put (4) Prime HD's over each one and then the remaining 2 over 2 Evo 13.5 tanks for quarantine tanks. When I am done, all my tanks except the frag tank will be using AI lights. Yes, I am a bit OCD

Dennis

 

[4FordFamily]

That is a lot of AI units. So clearly they are working for you. Do you run any T5 supplementation as well?

I have big hopes that I am going to like them. I had better like them. I bought a ton of them. When I pick up the other (8) 26HD units, there should also be (10) Prime HD's with them. I am setting up a couple of Reefer 250 tanks next and want to put (4) Prime HD's over each one and then the remaining 2 over 2 Evo 13.5 tanks for quarantine tanks. When I am done, all my tanks except the frag tank will be using AI lights. Yes, I am a bit OCD

Dennis

I’m OCD as well. All AI, all Ford, etc!

No T5. I don’t grow “high end” coral. Just inexpensive and easy coral, I’m more of a fish guy