Turf Algae Solution?

[CodyRVA]

Hey everyone, so i've been battling this stuff for months. Finally believe i've nailed it down to turf algae. I'll add some pics when possible for a valid ID. Assuming it is in fact turf algae, anyone have any recommendations on removal? I've been doing so manually, but the stuff doesn't like to let go and even when you pull it off the rock it just comes right back.

After a little bit of research, i'm finding that i'd have to lower my nutrients to crazy low levels to get close to wiping this junk out and would almost certainly hurt my coral in the process. I'm not one to add critters to solve these types of issues, but it seems like thats my only option.

I have trochus, hermits, nassarius and a single turbo for my CUC... to my knowledge with the exception of the hermits & my single turbo... none of these guys really touch turf algae. I've been contemplating getting a sea slug or some chitons. Sea hare's seem too complicated to keep and i'd rather not go that direction. I have a diamond goby, it's an 80G 4 foot tank... not sure if a lawnmower blenny would be the right choice either.

Anyone care to chime in?

 

[mcarroll]

I'd maybe consider a azure or yellowtail damsel or rabbitfish among the other options on your list...it's going to take something unconventional, IMO.

1 Turbo and how many hermits and how many trochus? Turbo snails are impressive, but I'm wondering if the CUC may be light to allow this to become established....not too many things will reliably mow down a mature stand of algae like this and snails can only cover so much surface area only so completely to keep the nubbins mowed.

Depending on how established the algae is, you might be the only CUC member that can do it. Try this: Algae Cure!! Spot Treating Algae With Peroxide The treatment starts at a very conservative level so you can ramp up as needed for tougher algae.

 

[CodyRVA]

I'd maybe consider a azure or yellowtail damsel or rabbitfish among the other options on your list...it's going to take something unconventional, IMO.

1 Turbo and how many hermits and how many trochus? Turbo snails are impressive, but I'm wondering if the CUC may be light to allow this to become established....not too many things will reliably mow down a mature stand of algae like this and snails can only cover so much surface area only so completely to keep the nubbins mowed.

Depending on how established the algae is, you might be the only CUC member that can do it. Try this: Algae Cure!! Spot Treating Algae With Peroxide The treatment starts at a very conservative level so you can ramp up as needed for tougher algae.

Thanks for the input! So, I have a Kole and a foxface, maybe I feed too much, but the kole picks at the rock, but definitely doesn't keep the tank clean. The foxface doesn't pick at anything, just hangs out and waits for nori. I feed half a sheet of nori in the AM and the other half in the PM. Too much? I can't say im overly ecstatic about the idea of buying a damselfish lol.

Current cleanup crew is probably about 14 scarlet hermits, 20+ trochus, my single turbo, and a handful of nassarius snails. I also have a coral banded shrimp.

Thoughts on chitons, lawnmower blenny, sea slug/lettuce nudi?

I've done some spot treating out of the tank, didn't think I would be able to spot treat peroxide directly in the tank like that. Any side affects or limits on how much I can target treat? The pain is every time I frag something the new plugs get covered in this stuff which is not something I personally want to sell to anyone.

 

[mta_morrow]

I had green turf algae in my last tank.

Given it was a 30 long, a tang or fox face was not an option, and they don’t really chow down on it enough to make it go away.

I also feel adding big fish to combat algae it totally wrong as the bioload they add is not worth the benefit.

I ended up using fluconazole to combat the turf algae. 1 treatment and GONE!

No I’ll effect on corals, fish , or inverts.

Gets my vote!

 

[CodyRVA]

I had green turf algae in my last tank.

Given it was a 30 long, a tang or fox face was not an option, and they don’t really chow down on it enough to make it go away.

I also feel adding big fish to combat algae it totally wrong as the bioload they add is not worth the benefit.

I ended up using fluconazole to combat the turf algae. 1 treatment and GONE!

No I’ll effect on corals, fish , or inverts.

Gets my vote!

So, I tried fluconazole twice about 6-8 months ago. The first time it kind of worked, but the algae eventually came back. The second time it had almost no affect. Quite possible whatever I have is not turf algae, but if it's not turf then idk what it is; it's def not GHA or bryopsis. Needless to say, I don't have much interest in trying fluconazole again, although i'm aware of many people having great success with it.

 

[BigJim]

I had a really bad red turf algae problem in the past in my old RSM 250. I bought a dozen mexican turbo snails and manually removed as much as possible. It only took a couple weeks before it was gone and I had to re-home most of the snails.

 

[CodyRVA]

I had a really bad red turf algae problem in the past in my old RSM 250. I bought a dozen mexican turbo snails and manually removed as much as possible. It only took a couple weeks before it was gone and I had to re-home most of the snails.

Good deal; I was wondering the same. If I buy something that relies on this algae and they wipe the algae, I'm going to have to rehome them. My rock work isn't really that bad, makes me think the hermits are getting at it, just not fast enough to keep it mowed back. My frag rack is pretty much unreachable by the hermits, thus it's no surprise that my frags get covered in the junk. My sump has become loaded with the stuff, which is fine... let it grow there idc, but i'm worried about it making its way back to my display. This BS seems to grow on anything and everything in the tank.

 

[ihavecrabs]

My recommendation would be to:

1. Give it a more favorable place to grow (think algae turf scrubber with more light 16+ hours and exposure to air and water)
2. Give the CUC some time and some assistance with a nylon scrubbing brush

At the end of the day, having algae as part of your system is beneficial. Having algae under control is the best outcome

 

[Jose Mayo]

There is a fish on the Brazilian shores, known here as "Canhanha", whose scientific name is Archosargus rhomboidalis, whose preferred food, in nature, are precisely the GHA and small crustaceans, and the algae are used as "bait" to capture it .

It's not beautiful, but it's very efficient ... it's unfortunate that it grows fast:

Archosargus rhomboidalis

Regards

 

[CodyRVA]

My recommendation would be to:

1. Give it a more favorable place to grow (think algae turf scrubber with more light 16+ hours and exposure to air and water)
2. Give the CUC some time and some assistance with a nylon scrubbing brush

At the end of the day, having algae as part of your system is beneficial. Having algae under control is the best outcome

Thanks for the feedback! Maybe a dumb question, but any tools you can suggest for manual removal? I'm really speaking to my frags; I'd love to find something strong enough to clean the algae off the plugs, but gentle enough to not harm the coral itself. Maybe just a small brush head and finesse?

Also, I do run my fuge light from 4 pm to 10 am; my chaeto still grows pretty fast so there's obviously nutrients in the water. This "turf?" algae has started to latch onto the sides of my sump as well. I've recently changed food type; i think the frozen I was using was too fine and much of it was left behind vs being eaten. Have been running gfo for some time, but recently added pellets back to the system within the last 6 weeks. Trying to make subtle changes over time as to hedge against any ill affects from one large change.

 

[ihavecrabs]

Thanks for the feedback! Maybe a dumb question, but any tools you can suggest for manual removal? I'm really speaking to my frags; I'd love to find something strong enough to clean the algae off the plugs, but gentle enough to not harm the coral itself. Maybe just a small brush head and finesse?

Also, I do run my fuge light from 4 pm to 10 am; my chaeto still grows pretty fast so there's obviously nutrients in the water. This "turf?" algae has started to latch onto the sides of my sump as well. I've recently changed food type; i think the frozen I was using was too fine and much of it was left behind vs being eaten. Have been running gfo for some time, but recently added pellets back to the system within the last 6 weeks. Trying to make subtle changes over time as to hedge against any ill affects from one large change.

Yeah unfortunately small brush head and finesse I have to say.. This is unfortunate for me as well since finesse is not my strong suit.

I have been using some HDX brand nylon bristle plastic tools from home depot. They have a larger pad on one side and a small head on the other and they work very well. some turf algae requires an exacto knife though.

 

[CodyRVA]

Anyone know of a peroxide dip solution makeup that I could dip my frags in that would kill the algae, but not harm the coral? In the past i've just used a dropper to spot treat the frags directly vs dipping them.

 

[mcarroll]

The foxface doesn't pick at anything, just hangs out and waits for nori.

Try withholding nori for a week or two....could even cut back on other foods. They can be picky just like us....in studies, herbivores took prepared foods by preference to mysis shrimp...which in turn they took in preference to tasty algae....which was taken in preference to nasty algae (i.e. bryopsis and other unpalatables). So withholding food you add to the tank is a legit strategy in this "battle"....the fish may just need to be motivated since you alread have at least one candidate! The Kole I'd regard as a detriatavore, but if your turf has been picking up a lot (it's designed to) then he may decide to go to town on it if he gets a little hungry. (It's also suspected that many herbivores only go for the greens for the epiphytes, detritus and other critters that accompany it....it's possible they use the presence or lack of some of these same criteria to avoid algae.)

 

[mcarroll]

So, I have a Kole and a foxface, maybe I feed too much, but the kole picks at the rock, but definitely doesn't keep the tank clean. The foxface doesn't pick at anything, just hangs out and waits for nori.

It's not necessary to say that you feed too much for "ordinary circumstances", just that you'd like to make a small behavior change if possible.

Current cleanup crew is probably about 14 scarlet hermits, 20+ trochus, my single turbo, and a handful of nassarius snails.

I bought a dozen mexican turbo snails and manually removed as much as possible. It only took a couple weeks before it was gone and I had to re-home most of the snails.

I'd try to establish a population of Ceriths, and as BigJim recommended, a population of Turbos as well....given your current lineup, I'd probably add 10-20 Ceriths (black) and 5-10 turbos.

Thoughts on chitons, lawnmower blenny, sea slug/lettuce nudi?

Either no experience, bad stories or minimal luck with them....so not really.

I've done some spot treating out of the tank, didn't think I would be able to spot treat peroxide directly in the tank like that.

You can dip straight in peroxide if you can get the frag out of the tank for a few seconds. (Not all will tolerate the air exposure equally well.)

Read through the comments on the spot treating thread to see how much some have used in spot treating....fairly large quantities of 30% strength H2O2. Don't start there...or at least not because I told you to....but you can definitely work up to higher doses than what I suggest starting at in the thread. I'm starting at the max. safe value (IMO).

Maybe a dumb question, but any tools you can suggest for manual removal?

Finger tips. Toothbrush. Syrynges from 1 mL - 5 mL in size to apply H2O2....load a few up in advance so you're not going back into the H2O2 source with used syringes.

Also, I do run my fuge light from 4 pm to 10 am;

I don't think you're interested in pH control, seems like you'd want direct competition with the "daylight algae" in the display....run the fuge on the same light schedule as the display....maybe even start it 30 min early and leave it 30 min later than the display.

my chaeto still grows pretty fast so there's obviously nutrients in the water.

Certainly true. What do test kits say for PO4 and NO3?

I've recently changed food type; i think the frozen I was using was too fine and much of it was left behind vs being eaten.

This implies maybe not enough floe to keep it flowing around until it's eaten – this should be the goal.

Have been running gfo for some time, but recently added pellets back to the system within the last 6 weeks.

Do what you have to in the short run, but I would try to move away from the use of any of these things in the long run. Carbon dosing in particular is destabilizing....mature, stable tanks can handle it, but I wouldn't recommend it elsewhere or while you have issues going on.

Anyone know of a peroxide dip solution makeup that I could dip my frags in that would kill the algae, but not harm the coral?

You can dip them into straight peroxid up to the glue.

 

[CodyRVA]

It's not necessary to say that you feed too much for "ordinary circumstances", just that you'd like to make a small behavior change if possible.





I'd try to establish a population of Ceriths, and as BigJim recommended, a population of Turbos as well....given your current lineup, I'd probably add 10-20 Ceriths (black) and 5-10 turbos.



Either no experience, bad stories or minimal luck with them....so not really.



You can dip straight in peroxide if you can get the frag out of the tank for a few seconds. (Not all will tolerate the air exposure equally well.)

Read through the comments on the spot treating thread to see how much some have used in spot treating....fairly large quantities of 30% strength H2O2. Don't start there...or at least not because I told you to....but you can definitely work up to higher doses than what I suggest starting at in the thread. I'm starting at the max. safe value (IMO).



Finger tips. Toothbrush. Syrynges from 1 mL - 5 mL in size to apply H2O2....load a few up in advance so you're not going back into the H2O2 source with used syringes.



I don't think you're interested in pH control, seems like you'd want direct competition with the "daylight algae" in the display....run the fuge on the same light schedule as the display....maybe even start it 30 min early and leave it 30 min later than the display.



Certainly true. What do test kits say for PO4 and NO3?



This implies maybe not enough floe to keep it flowing around until it's eaten – this should be the goal.



Do what you have to in the short run, but I would try to move away from the use of any of these things in the long run. Carbon dosing in particular is destabilizing....mature, stable tanks can handle it, but I wouldn't recommend it elsewhere or while you have issues going on.



You can dip them into straight peroxid up to the glue.

Thanks for the feedback!

I've been looking at adding to my CUC so i'll take your suggestions into considerations when I place my order. I do have good PH control by running my fuge lighting in reverse. I would prefer to run it 24/7 vs turning it off at night, so I may try that. PO4 is undetectable with Hanna checker, NO3 never tests higher than 1 ppm; with all the algae in the sump I never expect my results to be honest. The food situation im referring to is very small mysis, frozen, the pieces are generally small, but this particular food is loaded with small tiny remnants of mysis. I'm starting to think this was at least apart of the issue; I've since switched to a different frozen mysis and this food is considerably cleaner. I have thawed and rinsed both foods before feeding. The system is about 3 years old, i've been running GFO for years, no intention of removing it. I've been more conservative with carbon dosing; I've only ever needed maybe 2 large tablespoons of pellets, add some pellets every few weeks.

The tank is by no means over run with the stuff, but like I said, any new frags quickly become covered with it. My guess is my hermits are primary cleaners and probably just can't get to my frag rack. I have no snails that eat the stuff besides my one lonely turbo. My sump on the other hand is getting packed full of this junk. Is there any difference between mexican turbos and regular turbos or are they all the same thing?

I have also cut my nori feeding in half, already seeing a difference in the kole and foxface's behavior. Will play it by ear and adjust accordingly.

Thanks again!

 

[mcarroll]

I would prefer to run it 24/7 vs turning it off at night, so I may try that.

You've got the right idea!!

PO4 is undetectable with Hanna checker, NO3 never tests higher than 1 ppm; with all the algae in the sump I never expect my results to be honest

Mostly just curious...chaeto growing well is a data point....these are a couple more data points. Always nice to see how they line up (or not).

've been more conservative with carbon dosing; I've only ever needed maybe 2 large tablespoons of pellets, add some pellets every few weeks.

With the numbers you posted above I just wonder why have the pellets online regardless of any potential downside? Seems like they may not be needed....have you tried going without anytime recently? (This is starting to feel familiar....think we may have crossed this ground before somewhere. )

The tank is by no means over run with the stuff, but like I said, any new frags quickly become covered with it. My guess is my hermits are primary cleaners and probably just can't get to my frag rack.

Seems like a winning clue to me...but kinda leaves you as the algae tender on the frag rack. Ceriths and other smaller snails would be ideal as far as snails go. Turbos and frag racks are somewhat notorious....but if this isn't a worry, then I'd vote turbos for quicker control.

I have also cut my nori feeding in half, already seeing a difference in the kole and foxface's behavior. Will play it by ear and adjust accordingly.

Nice!!

Love to see another tank shot!!

 

[CodyRVA]

You've got the right idea!!
With the numbers you posted above I just wonder why have the pellets online regardless of any potential downside? Seems like they may not be needed....have you tried going without anytime recently? (This is starting to feel familiar....think we may have crossed this ground before somewhere. )

Seems like a winning clue to me...but kinda leaves you as the algae tender on the frag rack. Ceriths and other smaller snails would be ideal as far as snails go. Turbos and frag racks are somewhat notorious....but if this isn't a worry, then I'd vote turbos for quicker control.

Backstory on the pellets... i used to run the small amount i notated above; I figured they weren't really doing anything so I took them offline. Shortly there after I ran into this issue; this tank has never had an algae issue before. That being said... it could have been me removing the pellets, but could have also simply been the change in food.

On a positive note, my acans have never looked better haha. You mentioned black ceriths, do they have to be this type or will any cerith do? Probably going to go with reefcleaners, not sure if i've seen black ceriths on there before.

Here are a few pixs of the junk i'm working with.

 

[mcarroll]

You definitely have it for it to be spreading around like that.

Any chance you're willing to try a UV filter to see if that keeps if from spreading while you're putting the effort in to knocking it back?

I don't see a lot of coraline in these photos either....that should be taking real estate from the green algae over time. Is that just my view through the photos or is coraline lacking??

 

[Kayvon]

I had a really bad case of turf algae in my tank recently. Every rock had a ton of the stuff, so manual removal and spot treatment wasn't the best option. I decided I'd try to kill it with Vibrant and increased nutrient export. A tank full of dying algae would definitely cycle back around into another outbreak, so I turned up my fuge light and began dosing vinegar a few days before the first dose. After a weeks or so I noticed that the algae was starting to melt off. I removed as much of it as I could by hand at that point. Problem has been solved save for a few bits. I'm working on managing the spread while my coralline takes off.

 

[Monkeytank]

I watched this BRS video series and got the Kessil light they tested. My chaeto grew an insane amount after I added it. Ever since I created something out-competing it in my refugium, I have ZERO nuisance algae in my display, not even on the flow nozzles way up close to my lights.