Wrasse not going to make it and I'm totally stumped

bigcheese

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Hey all, I'm in a bit of a pickle here.
I have a Yellowband Velvet Fairy Wrasse (Cirrhilabrus Luteovittatus) the wife picked up on Friday. He's having a tough time staying upright and breathing very heavy, not swimming. I spent the last two hours holding him and moving him back and forth to keep water flowing over his gills.

Here's the sitch so far:
10G primary and secondary QT tanks
Temp at 77.2, Sal 1.026 (34ppt)
First QT was DT water (SG 1.026 / Nitrates ~2 / 0 Ammonia / Ca 400 / Kh 8.5 / Po 0.06 / Mg 1380)
Second (current) QT is fresh Red Sea Coral Pro / 1.026 (34ppt), always use RODI, everything functioning properly there.
Each DT has its own filter, heater, airstone, ammonia alert badge, thermometer, airline. Only shared equipment is the air pump itself (with check valve). First QT had sponges in the HOB seeded from the sump on the DT. At no time did the AA badges show any color but yellow (one was a new AA badge, the other is about 2mo old and never dried out).

On Friday:
  • FW Dip, flukes confirmed (the small wormy gill flukes, not sesame-seed shaped) along with some isopods (munnid, not that it matters... the wrasse ate them in seconds)
  • Had a little trouble coming out of the FW dip, a simple gentle hold and back-and-forth motion going into the SW and he was fine.
  • Ate like a pig (LRS Reef Frenzy with some Vita-Chem added) 2x (like 3pm and 8pm)
  • Normal, energetic swimming interspersed with 30-60 minute periods of chilling out in the PVC tube.
Saturday:
  • Ate well, fed 4x. Pooping observed, whitish but not stringy.
  • Started a round of GC instead of Prazi alone- Figured the Metro would help with a potential bac infection from the previous day's FW dip results and any subsequent fluke detachments.
  • Swimming a little less energetically but didn't seem like cause for concern.
  • No visible signs of Ich, Velvet, Brook, Worms or Uronema.
Sunday:
  • Still eating well but not coming out as often.
  • Noticed him having trouble staying upright, occasionally would go to the corner of the tank and go vertical, head up.
Monday (Today):
  • 2nd dose of GC in the (very early) AM.
  • Still eating, but not swimming much today. Popped in a cube of Rotifers and watched him go berzerk for about a half hour.
  • By mid-afternoon, was laying on his side, breathing heavily, barely moving.
  • Did second FW dip (temp matched, pH matched)
  • In between conference calls, I did "Fish PT", gently moving him back and forth through the water to get sufficient oxygen. 15 minutes of PT was about enough for an hour of semi-normal behavior.
  • By tonight (9 PM or so), he was headed downhill fast. Made the decision to TTM him into pristine water. Now he looks like this:
20190617_223510.jpg

Before I got him, he had spent a week in QT at a very reputable LFS. No issues with anything from there. Called the manager this afternoon, no other fish sharing the same tank or common tank infrastructure were showing any signs of infection.
Any thoughts, #Reefsquad ? What did I miss? My only thought is that the flukes did too much damage to the gills, I'll get some MB in the morning *if* he makes it through the night.
 

Mjrenz

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bigcheese

bigcheese

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Good call. I'll start now.
And, BTW, I followed your Petco rescue thread very closely. That's where I was headed as soon as I get the first QT cleaned.
Excellent work.. I'm in your debt.
 
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bigcheese

bigcheese

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SG now at 1.18, temp at 76.6 and coming down about 1 degree per hour.

Just noticed a cople of scales sloughed off, could be from the airstone, but I'm keeping my eye out for Brook. Would be the only one of the big four I haven't seen yet.

Will pick up formalin in the AM, but I'm a little mad at myself. I wrote a long time ago here about trying to use Chloramine-T / Halamid as an alternative... it's USDA approved and commonly used in fish farms to eradicate Brook and other ciliate parasites. I just didn't have a fish sick enough to try it on myself, so I never bought any. I can't source it locally, so there goes a golden opportunity to save a fish and posit a new protocol to help others.[emoji35]
 

Mjrenz

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SG now at 1.18, temp at 76.6 and coming down about 1 degree per hour.

Just noticed a cople of scales sloughed off, could be from the airstone, but I'm keeping my eye out for Brook. Would be the only one of the big four I haven't seen yet.

Will pick up formalin in the AM, but I'm a little mad at myself. I wrote a long time ago here about trying to use Chloramine-T / Halamid as an alternative... it's USDA approved and commonly used in fish farms to eradicate Brook and other ciliate parasites. I just didn't have a fish sick enough to try it on myself, so I never bought any. I can't source it locally, so there goes a golden opportunity to save a fish and posit a new protocol to help others.[emoji35]
I haven't had to deal with brook yet and hope I never do. After reading quite a bit about formalin it's something I'm not personally comfortable using, it typically shortens the fish's life and is a known carcinogen. If it's something that does pop up I'm going with the Ruby reef rally and cp or metro option
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/brooklynella.247938/
I hope that's not what he has
 

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Big G

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Woohoo! He made it through the night. Off to get some Rally or Formalin in an hour when the LFS opens.
Rally is my go too for both the 90 minute bath and for dosing into a QT. It has both antiseptic and antibiotic qualities that are very gentle on fish. Formalin products can be more harsh on fish and studies have shown kidney damage as a side effect, contributing to a shorter life span.
 
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bigcheese

bigcheese

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Rally is my go too for both the 90 minute bath and for dosing into a QT. It has both antiseptic and antibiotic qualities that are very gentle on fish. Formalin products can be more harsh on fish and studies have shown kidney damage as a side effect, contributing to a shorter life span.
Quick update...
Wrasse not out of the woods but looking a ton better. I'm not kidding when I say I thought he was going to the great reef in the sky before I got back from the store. Now he's swimming around a bit, alert and not huffing and puffing.

Made an oxygen generator this morning before I went out with an old brine shrimp hatch kit, a plastic bottle and some oxy-clean. I think hyperoxygenating the water won half the battle for me.

@Big G, me too. But neither LFS had any Rally. I ended up with Hikari Ich-X, aka formalin and malachite green. 60 minute bath, followed by a Methylene Blue dip, into a new QT at lowered temp / sg.

I did find one source of Acriflavine, bonus that it also includes Metro, which is part of the protocol. I decided to give the Tetra Parasite Guard a shot.

Fingers crossed, we're not out of the woods yet.
 
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bigcheese

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bigcheese

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Last update, I wish it were a cheery one, but it's not. He met his maker around 5pm despite my best efforts. It really stinks (not the NSFW phrase I'd normally use). Maybe if I started treating for brook earlier, or had RRR on hand, or... well, no sense in going there. All I can do is learn and make sure I do better next time.

Simply put, that's why I quarantine... I'd probably be selling all the gear or going back to FW tomorrow had I crashed my DT with brook.

Some bright spots:
I'll add the oxygen generator to the salvage protocol thread. Definitely a tool for the bag.
Talked to the LFS and they are cleaning house on that system, re-qt'ing and treating the fish in there. Just a great crew there.
My youngest was entertained by my blue hands because I totally forgot to put gloves on before the MB dip. He teased a smile and laugh out when I needed it most. (Side note: When does this eventually wear off?)

Thanks again, #Reefsquad and especially @Mjrenz, @Big G and @Xam .

And of course, @Humblefish and @alprazo for their amazing work on those protocols.
 

Xam

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Last update, I wish it were a cheery one, but it's not. He met his maker around 5pm despite my best efforts. It really stinks (not the NSFW phrase I'd normally use). Maybe if I started treating for brook earlier, or had RRR on hand, or... well, no sense in going there. All I can do is learn and make sure I do better next time.

Simply put, that's why I quarantine... I'd probably be selling all the gear or going back to FW tomorrow had I crashed my DT with brook.

Some bright spots:
I'll add the oxygen generator to the salvage protocol thread. Definitely a tool for the bag.
Talked to the LFS and they are cleaning house on that system, re-qt'ing and treating the fish in there. Just a great crew there.
My youngest was entertained by my blue hands because I totally forgot to put gloves on before the MB dip. He teased a smile and laugh out when I needed it most. (Side note: When does this eventually wear off?)

Thanks again, #Reefsquad and especially @Mjrenz, @Big G and @Xam .

And of course, @Humblefish and @alprazo for their amazing work on those protocols.

Aw, sorry man. Hate to hear that. Have you been keeping the lfs updated? Would they compensate?

As for your hands... it wears off in time. Might try lava soap... that stuff is amazing. Maybe one of the vets knows a trick.
 

Mjrenz

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Last update, I wish it were a cheery one, but it's not. He met his maker around 5pm despite my best efforts. It really stinks (not the NSFW phrase I'd normally use). Maybe if I started treating for brook earlier, or had RRR on hand, or... well, no sense in going there. All I can do is learn and make sure I do better next time.

Simply put, that's why I quarantine... I'd probably be selling all the gear or going back to FW tomorrow had I crashed my DT with brook.

Some bright spots:
I'll add the oxygen generator to the salvage protocol thread. Definitely a tool for the bag.
Talked to the LFS and they are cleaning house on that system, re-qt'ing and treating the fish in there. Just a great crew there.
My youngest was entertained by my blue hands because I totally forgot to put gloves on before the MB dip. He teased a smile and laugh out when I needed it most. (Side note: When does this eventually wear off?)

Thanks again, #Reefsquad and especially @Mjrenz, @Big G and @Xam .

And of course, @Humblefish and @alprazo for their amazing work on those protocols.
I'm sorry to hear that he didn't make it but it is good that you didn't introduce something like that into your dt.
 
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bigcheese

bigcheese

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Aw, sorry man. Hate to hear that. Have you been keeping the lfs updated? Would they compensate?

As for your hands... it wears off in time. Might try lava soap... that stuff is amazing. Maybe one of the vets knows a trick.
Gave them a couple updates, they were in 100% agreement with the protocol and invested in the outcome, even offered up some peracetic acid as an alternative to formalin.
LFS will hook me up with a new one.. when I'm ready. I'll be taking a break from introducing new fish until after summer when my workload lightens up.
That side note was a little attempt at comedy... GoJo FTW!
 

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