Algae scrubber vs Skimmer

[Freenow54]

My question is after a Well known Member made a statement concerning an Algae Scrubber is meant to Replace a Skimmer. Is an algae scrubber meant to add the nutrients that a scrubber removes ? Can you or is it recommended to run one over the other ? are they separate approaches ? , or should you could you run both. Please feel free to comment on anything I might have Missed .

 

[Aquadude1]

I am not sure what is being asked by the second question (im a little this morning), but I think you can definitely use a scrubber in place of a skimmer. It does not remove exactly what a skimmer does but it can bind an remove some pollutants as well as obviously nitrate and phosphate.

I like to run a scrubber and an air stone and do small weekly or bi weekly water changes. I feel for the stocking level most people keep their tanks at, the modern skimmers are just too effective unless run very dry.

As to running both, I would only do it with a very heavy fish load with heavy feading and uncontrolled nutrients. I would not start with both. I would pick and start with one or the other (in my opinion the scrubber) and see if thats enough. Then only add the other if needed.

This what i have found to work for me. On my new tank i haven't even had to start the scrubber up just the water changes have been enough.

 

[VintageReefer]

They are two different means of nutrient control. You can run one, or the other, both, or none

The basic differences is in the approach

A skimmer does not remove phosphates or nitrates from the water. A skimmer helps prevent them from forming. A scrubber directly removes these items from the water and reduces their levels

The easiest way to think about removal from skimmers is to think about food.

Food is "organic"
Nutrients, are "inorganic"

Scrubbers and refugiums remove inorganics from the water: ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc, but they do not remove food particles.

Scrubbers and refugiums add certain organics to the water: Glucose, amino acids, Oxygen and copepods too.

Protein skimmers, however, do the opposite. That's why they have the word "protein" in the name.

Skimmers remove food particles and sometimes copepods from the water, but do not remove ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc.
Skimmers also add oxygen to the water.

So the skimmer approach is to remove organics - fish waste and excess food before they have a chance to turn into the inorganics mentioned above. These organics, however are food for corals. Scrubbers allow the food to be present for corals and remove the excess.

 

[Freenow54]

They are two different means of nutrient control. You can run one, or the other, both, or none

The basic differences is in the approach

A skimmer does not remove phosphates or nitrates from the water. A skimmer helps prevent them from forming. A scrubber directly removes these items from the water and reduces their levels

The easiest way to think about removal from skimmers is to think about food.

Food is "organic"
Nutrients, are "inorganic"

Scrubbers and refugiums remove inorganics from the water: ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc, but they do not remove food particles.

Scrubbers and refugiums add certain organics to the water: Glucose, amino acids, Oxygen and copepods too.

Protein skimmers, however, do the opposite. That's why they have the word "protein" in the name.

Skimmers remove food particles and sometimes copepods from the water, but do not remove ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc.
Skimmers also add oxygen to the water.

So the skimmer approach is to remove fish waste and excess food before they have a chance to turn into the inorganics mentioned above. These organics, however are food for corals. Scrubbers allow the food to be present for corals and remove the excess.

A very clear explanation Thank You.

 

[VintageReefer]

A very clear explanation Thank You.

The reason you may see someone say you don’t need a skimmer if you have a scrubber, is because they found one to be more effective than the other and don’t need both. That doesn’t mean it will work the same for everyone.

Both have their strengths. I’m a scrubber fan and it’s my primary form of nutrient control. But when I got soap in my tank, I sure as heck was plugging in my skimmer!! Algae won’t consume soap!

 

[Freenow54]

The reason you may see someone say you don’t need a skimmer if you have a scrubber, is because they found one to be more effective than the other and don’t need both. That doesn’t mean it will work the same for everyone.

Both have their strengths. I’m a scrubber fan and it’s my primary form of nutrient control. But when I got soap in my tank, I sure as heck was plugging in my skimmer!! Algae won’t consume soap!

I because of your advice will run both. I needed another DIY Project, Was it not you that I was talking about working with acrylic to ?

 

[atoll]

I run both and have done for many years. I don't see a reason why not. My skimmer produces, my ATS works just fine. Both work together not against each other.

 

[VintageReefer]

I have both. I have the skimmer running constantly but I keep the foam level low, so that the skimmer cup does not actually collect any skimmate. I do this for added aeration and slight ph boost for the system. My scrubber handles my phosphate and nitrates just fine.

If I’m in a situation where I need the skimmer also, I just turn the adjustment wheel a few times and then I have the skimmers help - for accidental overfeeding, contaminant, etc

This works for me, based on my system, bio load, feeding, model/size skimmer and scrubber…there’s a lot of variables. The principles I discussed are universal. The end result is unique to each persons system and gear

 

[VintageReefer]

I because of your advice will run both. I needed another DIY Project, Was it not you that I was talking about working with acrylic to ?

I know scrubbers. I don’t know much about working with acrylic.

If I gave advice on acrylic - don’t take it without double checking haha

 

[69cam]

They are two different means of nutrient control. You can run one, or the other, both, or none

The basic differences is in the approach

A skimmer does not remove phosphates or nitrates from the water. A skimmer helps prevent them from forming. A scrubber directly removes these items from the water and reduces their levels

The easiest way to think about removal from skimmers is to think about food.

Food is "organic"
Nutrients, are "inorganic"

Scrubbers and refugiums remove inorganics from the water: ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc, but they do not remove food particles.

Scrubbers and refugiums add certain organics to the water: Glucose, amino acids, Oxygen and copepods too.

Protein skimmers, however, do the opposite. That's why they have the word "protein" in the name.

Skimmers remove food particles and sometimes copepods from the water, but do not remove ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, CO2, copper, etc.
Skimmers also add oxygen to the water.

So the skimmer approach is to remove fish waste and excess food before they have a chance to turn into the inorganics mentioned above. These organics, however are food for corals. Scrubbers allow the food to be present for corals and remove the excess.

You convinced me to finally try a scrubber on my system. :)

What brand would you advise?

 

[JoJosReef]

I only have experience with Santa Monica scrubbers (about to get my third). I've been happy with them. The SURF line is the most convenient in my opinion. Just open lid, harvest, feed foxface, throw rest. About to try a DROP on an AIO chamber.

 

[atoll]

You convinced me to finally try a scrubber on my system. :)

What brand would you advise?

Turbo scrubbers if you can find one secondhand. I would stay clear of the Santa Monica ones from personal experience . ATS's are few and far between in the UK, most are homemade. Not sure what brands you have there now, more than in the UK thats for sure.

However, with sizing much depends on the size of tank, number and size of fish and how much you feed as consisting an ATS. Many are based on cubes fed a day.
This is my Turbo waterfall ATS I have had for quite a few years and still going strong.
I have it front to back across my sump, its lit from both sides of the inner screen.

 

[VintageReefer]

You convinced me to finally try a scrubber on my system. :)

What brand would you advise?

Santa Monica. I run the Surf 2. Surf 2x came out after I got mine, it’s a small cost upgrade, and if it was available I would have bought the 2x.

These scrubbers are sizes/rated based on tire daily feeding amount + “how bad your situation is” lol if you need help picking one feel free to send me a dm