ATO and return chamber issues

[bshake]

After an incident that caused my 125G tank to crack back in March. I set up new and it has been running since the end of April. Moved over all my corals but started the tank from scratch. Bleached everything, new sand bed and now put in a sump. I noticed the evaporation is so much more than just a standard 125 with. I ordered a Tunze osmolator 3 and just installed it yesterday . The sensor in the return chamber of the sump with the fill tube also in the return chamber. Today around midday I was looking at the tank and noticed the water volume in the display was very heigh. So I looked at the ATO reservoir and about half of the 5 gallons container was gone. I noticed the my return chamber water volume fluctuates throughout the day which triggers my ATO to kick on filling water when it’s not needed. Any advice? On how to keep the level steady?
It’s a 125 gallon aqueon reef ready with a trigger systems 36 sump running duel drains, 1 emergency and 1 return all 1 inch PVC

 

[UncommonSense]

Any advice? On how to keep the level steady?

Hey there! I’m sorry to hear about the tank breakage, that really, really sucks…

This return chamber level fluctuation is likely due to plumbing, or plumbing tuning!

— Is the primary drain pipe submerged underwater in the sump during operation?

— has the gate valve on the primary drain been tuned to a full siphon? (No air bubbles spitting out into sump from drain?)

It isn’t uncommon for the primary drain to start and stop siphoning water repetitively when the drain isn’t tuned/submerged in the sump; this will cause a constantly changing overflow box water level, subsequently making the return pump chamber water level fluctuate!

 

[bshake]

Any advice? On how to keep the level steady?

Hey there! I’m sorry to hear about the tank breakage, that really, really sucks…

This return chamber level fluctuation is likely due to plumbing, or plumbing tuning!

— Is the primary drain pipe submerged underwater in the sump during operation?

— has the gate valve on the primary drain been tuned to a full siphon? (No air bubbles spitting out into sump from drain?)

It isn’t uncommon for the primary drain to start and stop siphoning water repetitively when the drain isn’t tuned/submerged in the sump; this will cause a constantly changing overflow box water level, subsequently making the return pump chamber water level fluctuate!

Hey buddy thanks for the reply. You were the one who helped me plumb my new tank back in April. The tank has been running since, had to take the fish out today because of ich…. Again lol I’m just always getting hammered. Anywho

Yes both drain returns are submerged about an inch or 2 under the water so that it’s as quiet as possible.

Both the drains are tuned with gate valves and produce full siphons, if i leave one completely open it’s super loud and the Mrs will kill me.

I honestly don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Maybe the flow isn’t enough. I got the Sicce syncra 7.0 and run it at 60% maybe i need to increase it and open the drains more?

 

[D'sreef]

Any advice? On how to keep the level steady?

Hey there! I’m sorry to hear about the tank breakage, that really, really sucks…

This return chamber level fluctuation is likely due to plumbing, or plumbing tuning!

— Is the primary drain pipe submerged underwater in the sump during operation?

— has the gate valve on the primary drain been tuned to a full siphon? (No air bubbles spitting out into sump from drain?)

It isn’t uncommon for the primary drain to start and stop siphoning water repetitively when the drain isn’t tuned/submerged in the sump; this will cause a constantly changing overflow box water level, subsequently making the return pump chamber water level fluctuate!

Hey buddy thanks for the reply. You were the one who helped me plumb my new tank back in April. The tank has been running since, had to take the fish out today because of ich…. Again lol I’m just always getting hammered. Anywho

Yes both drain returns are submerged about an inch or 2 under the water so that it’s as quiet as possible.

Both the drains are tuned with gate valves and produce full siphons, if i leave one completely open it’s super loud and the Mrs will kill me.

I honestly don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Maybe the flow isn’t enough. I got the Sicce syncra 7.0 and run it at 60% maybe i need to increase it and open the drains more?

I don't think increasing the return pumps flow is the answer, sound like you just need to play with the valve tuning on the drains.

 

[UncommonSense]

Hey buddy thanks for the reply. You were the one who helped me plumb my new tank back in April. The tank has been running since

Yessir! Does this tank still has the bean animal drain configuration in two overflow boxes: primary/emergency, and secondary/return?

Or did you reconfigure to dual Herbie drains with return plumbing on the exterior of the tank?
Or is it just two drains total now, and how many returns?

The tank has been running since, had to take the fish out today because of ich…. Again lol I’m just always getting hammered.

Ouch!!! That’s rough… when it rains it pours, I suppose…

Both the drains are tuned with gate valves and produce full siphons, if i leave one completely open it’s super loud and the Mrs will kill me.

Sounds like it got reconfigured to dual Herbie with external return… unless you added an extra gate valve that shouldn’t be there on the bean animal configuration? Or something on the emergency drain of a single Herbie?

Current plumbing configuration needs some clarification!

I honestly don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Maybe the flow isn’t enough. I got the Sicce syncra 7.0 and run it at 60% maybe i need to increase it and open the drains more?

1” drains are only good for around 900gph each, so you’re pushing right at their max flow rate if you try to max out your pump!

 

[bshake]

Any advice? On how to keep the level steady?

Hey there! I’m sorry to hear about the tank breakage, that really, really sucks…

This return chamber level fluctuation is likely due to plumbing, or plumbing tuning!

— Is the primary drain pipe submerged underwater in the sump during operation?

— has the gate valve on the primary drain been tuned to a full siphon? (No air bubbles spitting out into sump from drain?)

It isn’t uncommon for the primary drain to start and stop siphoning water repetitively when the drain isn’t tuned/submerged in the sump; this will cause a constantly changing overflow box water level, subsequently making the return pump chamber water level fluctuate!

Hey buddy thanks for the reply. You were the one who helped me plumb my new tank back in April. The tank has been running since, had to take the fish out today because of ich…. Again lol I’m just always getting hammered. Anywho

Yes both drain returns are submerged about an inch or 2 under the water so that it’s as quiet as possible.

Both the drains are tuned with gate valves and produce full siphons, if i leave one completely open it’s super loud and the Mrs will kill me.

I honestly don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Maybe the flow isn’t enough. I got the Sicce syncra 7.0 and run it at 60% maybe i need to increase it and open the drains more?

I don't think increasing the return pumps flow is the answer, sound like you just need to play with the valve tuning on the drains.

Yes exactly i need to play around with the returns

 

[bshake]

Hey buddy thanks for the reply. You were the one who helped me plumb my new tank back in April. The tank has been running since

Yessir! Does this tank still has the bean animal drain configuration in two overflow boxes: primary/emergency, and secondary/return?

Or did you reconfigure to dual Herbie drains with return plumbing on the exterior of the tank?
Or is it just two drains total now, and how many returns?

The tank has been running since, had to take the fish out today because of ich…. Again lol I’m just always getting hammered.

Ouch!!! That’s rough… when it rains it pours, I suppose…

Both the drains are tuned with gate valves and produce full siphons, if i leave one completely open it’s super loud and the Mrs will kill me.

Sounds like it got reconfigured to dual Herbie with external return… unless you added an extra gate valve that shouldn’t be there on the bean animal configuration? Or something on the emergency drain of a single Herbie?

Current plumbing configuration needs some clarification!

I honestly don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Maybe the flow isn’t enough. I got the Sicce syncra 7.0 and run it at 60% maybe i need to increase it and open the drains more?

1” drains are only good for around 900gph each, so you’re pushing right at their max flow rate if you try to max out your pump!

Yes it’s still configured as a bean animal (drain, emergency in 1 and return and 2nd drain) but the gate valves are placed on the main and secondary drains so that i can tune them when i had them wide open it was like super noisy with gurgles and splashing in the sump and Emergency is open.

I believe the pump maxes out at 1900 gph but I have it set to 60% so prob around 1000GPH.

 

[UncommonSense]

the gate valves are placed on the main and secondary drains so that i can tune them when i had them wide open it was like super noisy with gurgles and splashing in the sump and Emergency is open.

This is unusual! The secondary drain gate valve should be left wide open, and all tuning should be done on the primary drain gate valve!

Your primary drain will max out around 900-1000gph, with the gate valve wide open… I recommend turning your return pump down even a bit more, that should help with noise substantially when coupled with the above tuning advice!

 

[bshake]

the gate valves are placed on the main and secondary drains so that i can tune them when i had them wide open it was like super noisy with gurgles and splashing in the sump and Emergency is open.

This is unusual! The secondary drain gate valve should be left wide open, and all tuning should be done on the primary drain gate valve!

Your primary drain will max out around 900-1000gph, with the gate valve wide open… I recommend turning your return pump down even a bit more, that should help with noise substantially when coupled with the above tuning advice!

I did have it wide open and the secondary was closed off quite a bit but there was so much air mixing with the water so it was very turbulent going through the sump.

Question 1
How do i know which drain is the main? I see the filter sock with the emergency fills the filter sock much faster so is that the main drain? Or that doesn’t matter just open one fully land make it the main?

If i do open one and play with the valves and pumps would that fix the fluctuation in the return chamber to fix the ATO from over filling?

 

[UncommonSense]

How do i know which drain is the main?

Main drain should be the lowest drain standpipe, it will be in the overflow box with the emergency (highest standpipe, at or above weir teeth) drain!

Secondary drain is in the second overflow box, with the return; its standpipe should be right at the bottom of the overflow teeth!

If i do open one and play with the valves and pumps would that fix the fluctuation in the return chamber to fix the ATO from over filling?

Open secondary and emergency drain valves all the way and leave them there from here out!

Primary drain should start wide open, slowly close it until you stop getting bubble burping into the sump, and gurgling in the overflow box! — wait a few minutes between valve adjustments once you start getting close!

 

[bshake]

How do i know which drain is the main?

Main drain should be the lowest drain standpipe, it will be in the overflow box with the emergency (highest standpipe, at or above weir teeth) drain!

Secondary drain is in the second overflow box, with the return; its standpipe should be right at the bottom of the overflow teeth!

If i do open one and play with the valves and pumps would that fix the fluctuation in the return chamber to fix the ATO from over filling?

Open secondary and emergency drain valves all the way and leave them there from here out!

Primary drain should start wide open, slowly close it until you stop getting bubble burping into the sump, and gurgling in the overflow box! — wait a few minutes between valve adjustments once you start getting close!

Perfect thanks buddy! I’ll give it a try this weekend when i have time to fiddle. Ill keep you updated

 

[UncommonSense]

Perfect thanks buddy! I’ll give it a try this weekend when i have time to fiddle. Ill keep you updated

Happy to help!

Here’s a great thread with inputs from the man himself on quieting a Bean Animal overflow in some configurations with a pair of elbows at the top of the primary drain standpipe to form a U shape, submerging the standpipe inlet during operation!

Bean Animal Elbow help please

I have a 50 lowboy, bean animal overflow Whats the point of the secondary drain having an elbow if all is going down there is just a trickle that makes 0 noise? Why do people put an elbow when you can leave it open? Even the main siphon why put anything? Its a full siphon

www.reef2reef.com

 

[D'sreef]

Happy to help!

Here’s a great thread with inputs from the man himself on quieting a Bean Animal overflow in some configurations with a pair of elbows at the top of the primary drain standpipe to form a U shape, submerging the standpipe inlet during operation!

Bean Animal Elbow help please

I have a 50 lowboy, bean animal overflow Whats the point of the secondary drain having an elbow if all is going down there is just a trickle that makes 0 noise? Why do people put an elbow when you can leave it open? Even the main siphon why put anything? Its a full siphon

www.reef2reef.com

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

 

[UncommonSense]

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

The challenge is getting them with no metal wetted parts… saltwater is very corrosive! There are some branded and sold for use in marine aquariums, but those are NOT cheap!

 

[bshake]

Perfect thanks buddy! I’ll give it a try this weekend when i have time to fiddle. Ill keep you updated

Happy to help!

Here’s a great thread with inputs from the man himself on quieting a Bean Animal overflow in some configurations with a pair of elbows at the top of the primary drain standpipe to form a U shape, submerging the standpipe inlet during operation!

Bean Animal Elbow help please

I have a 50 lowboy, bean animal overflow Whats the point of the secondary drain having an elbow if all is going down there is just a trickle that makes 0 noise? Why do people put an elbow when you can leave it open? Even the main siphon why put anything? Its a full siphon

www.reef2reef.com

Thank you for that link, I’ll take a look at it

 

[D'sreef]

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

The challenge is getting them with no metal wetted parts… saltwater is very corrosive! There are some branded and sold for use in marine aquariums, but those are NOT cheap!

You just need it temporarily, here is an all plastic for $15 https://a.co/d/fAl50DN

 

[bshake]

Happy to help!

Here’s a great thread with inputs from the man himself on quieting a Bean Animal overflow in some configurations with a pair of elbows at the top of the primary drain standpipe to form a U shape, submerging the standpipe inlet during operation!

Bean Animal Elbow help please

I have a 50 lowboy, bean animal overflow Whats the point of the secondary drain having an elbow if all is going down there is just a trickle that makes 0 noise? Why do people put an elbow when you can leave it open? Even the main siphon why put anything? Its a full siphon

www.reef2reef.com

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

Yea i bought one to see the flow rate for my UV but it keeps saying I’m pushing 110 GPH so idk if those work

 

[bshake]

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

The challenge is getting them with no metal wetted parts… saltwater is very corrosive! There are some branded and sold for use in marine aquariums, but those are NOT cheap!

I bought one that’s ment for a garden hose both the connectors are plastic but idk what’s going on inside.

 

[UncommonSense]

I bought one that’s ment for a garden hose both the connectors are plastic but idk what’s going on inside.

They will have a shaft and a spinning propeller-like device in-line… the propeller has a magnet in it which passes by a magnetic sensor outside the wetted part of the meter!

The shaft and at least a bushing inside the propeller are typically metal, often brass! — I’d guess the marine aquarium specific ones use either titanium, ceramic, nylon, or other plastic coated material for shaft and propeller bushings, and a plastic coated magnet!

 

[D'sreef]

You could use a couple of cheap flow meters, to figure out you exact input then throttle the pump to match, in theory it should make everything even.

The challenge is getting them with no metal wetted parts… saltwater is very corrosive! There are some branded and sold for use in marine aquariums, but those are NOT cheap!

I bought one that’s ment for a garden hose both the connectors are plastic but idk what’s going on inside.

The one I linked is made by rainbird, it was all plastic on the inside unless they changed it. I have exploded more than I like to admit on plumbing jobs due to underestimating water pressure on plumbing jobs.