Black Bugs - An Acro keepers worst nightmare?

MarsWulf5

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 26, 2019
Messages
145
Reaction score
192
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
This is going to be a difficult post for me to write, bear with me.

Last night after 3 days of research, discussion with other reefers, testing treatments under a microscope, and bringing myself to actually do it; I tore down my Acro tank. Not a hurt acro tank, but a beautiful growing acro tank that had been up for approximately 8 months with acros and 2 years total. I chopped up all my encrusted frags and colonies and basically chucked them in the trash keeping a tiny 1-2" frag of the healthiest corals to not loose the bloodlines.

It all started about two weeks ago when I noticed my alkalinity staying stable for once, which is weird for my tank. It's always going low because my tank was transitioning from its "bunch of frags stage" to the "every frag is taking off into a colony stage". I noticed I didn't have to make my weekly adjustment dose and then up my daily dose and I noticed a few corals looking like the edges of the encrusting part where white and maybe beginning to STN. I didnt think much about it and attributed it to no water changes for 3 months. While parameters were perfect I figured my trace elements were getting out of wack finally. So I did two 20g water changes back to back in my 90g tank with 30g frag tank.

A few days later I noticed 3 of my Acros where now actually STNing. That day another more experienced SPS reefer swung by my house to get some stuff and saw my tank. He immediately told me something was very wrong. And that my issue wasn't water parameters, trace elements, low phosphates, etc. He said something was attacking them. My first thought was AEFW. I started researching and decided to let them stay in the tank and try out the KZ Flatwork Stop and Wrasse Technique. I figured those corals were stressed from something else or a combination of things and well I basically didnt know what was going on. I have been dosing KZ Coral Booster for a while and several people told me with that product, corals can actually withstand a AEFW infestation and you wont see it, you'll just see bite marks here and there and you'll see growth slow, colors fade, etc.

So I posted to SPS Junkies on facebook group a picture of my STNing RR Pink Floyd and a guy from California immediately messaged me saying, "Im sorry to say this but I'm 99% sure you have black bugs, the absolutely worst Acro pest" I called him up and we talked thru IDing them. I pulled the Pink Floyd out and dipped it in 2 cap fulls of Revive in 16oz of water which is approximately 4x strength. Immediately a bunch of little black bugs emerged from the coral.





At this point everything is spiraling downward incredibly quickly. In the course of a week I went from a few sick corals to loosing thousands of dollars worth of Acros. A whole section of frags on a frag rack are obviously being eaten alive by these bugs and it all hits me, HOLY CRAP I gotta do something NOW. Basically the lower half of the tank along with the frag racks where all STN/RTNing. Since I can't see them with the naked eye, I bust out my camera and macro lens and start taking pictures so I can zoom in on them and inspect which corals need to be cut out first.. Thats when I discover I ALSO HAVE AEFW when I see their bite marks on some corals. Double Whammy. The crazy part is that no new corals had been added to the tank since RAP in April.



In my research I found that most people do not beat them. Lots of people didn't even want to discuss it with me. One guy even told me, kiss your tank good bye. A few others had experimented with extreme dipping methods. It seemed a few people had success with cutting bases off corals, dipping at 4x dose revive for 5 minutes.. Every week for 8 weeks and leaving the tank fallow of acros for 4-6 months to destroy the entire lifecycle before replanting frags. I experimented with Bayer, even super concentrated did nothing to them at all.

So thats what Im doing at the moment. Experimenting and dipping. But I had to tear down the tank. :(



I'm not sure I will revisit sticks again after this. Thank god I'm single and young, no wife/no kids. No wife would stand for the amount of money I spent on frags this past year and then deal with loosing 75% of them.

The death toll is serious:
RR Ultimate Orange Passion
RR Angry Birds
RR Lion King
RR Equinox
RR Diesel
RR Pink Venom
RR Badger
RR Inferno
RR WM Fusion
RR Red Velvet
RR Strawberry Fields
Vivid Confetti
PC Rainbow
SC Orange Passion
CB Beast Mode Acro
CB Gumdrop Acro
CB Wet Dreams
CB Miami Orchid
CB Sick Nasty
CB Fruity Pebbles
CB Birthday Cake
CB Rainbow Treasure
CB Valhalla
CB Big Papi
DJ Skitty's FHRITP
TCK Rainbow Matrix
TCK Candy Crush
TCK Mardi Gras

I managed to save:
Big R Walt Disney
JF Fox Flame
JF Homewrecker
RRC OG Jawdropper
RR Aussie Gold Tort
RR Rainbow Loom
HSF Leviathan Acro
CB Flaming Unicorn
CB Versace Acro
CB Icecap Acro
BC Bubblebath Unicorn (maybe, its hurt bad)
GARF Bonsai

One more note, I think these are rare. I think there are more than one kind, and I think each kind eats certain types of Acros. The one I have seems to eat acros with textured skin and passes on smooth skin acros. Not proven, just from observation.

I made this post so everyone can see what they look like. Discuss experiences, and be aware. These things make AEFW seem fun.

Jusg FYI... I just had 5 corals come in from WWC. I dipped. I looked under a microscope and saw this small black bug... Never heards of black bugs... So, I look them up - and here we are. Only SPS in the lot was a $5 birds nest... Must have come off of that. Also found an astarina starfish munching on the Galxia in the bag. Hmmm. You spend good money on a drag the size of a Nickle from a very reputable place... BAM. Black bugs and Astarina. dang. I'm not very happy. Glad they went into QT... Going out to buy Bayer Insecticide. dang. Can't believe they came in like this.
 

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,928
Reaction score
203,059
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
13   0   0
Jusg FYI... I just had 5 corals come in from WWC. I dipped. I looked under a microscope and saw this small black bug... Never heards of black bugs... So, I look them up - and here we are. Only SPS in the lot was a $5 birds nest... Must have come off of that. Also found an astarina starfish munching on the Galxia in the bag. Hmmm. You spend good money on a drag the size of a Nickle from a very reputable place... BAM. Black bugs and Astarina. dang. I'm not very happy. Glad they went into QT... Going out to buy Bayer Insecticide. dang. Can't believe they came in like this.
Bayer and dip generally do not work with these bugs. Either Interceptor pills from a veterinarian or Dr. G's on ebay will. They are very hard to combat and stubborn with dips.
Thats why we dip for things like this. Im shocked that they would send this along But likely did not know.
 

moreef

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jan 15, 2013
Messages
551
Reaction score
273
Location
Dallas,Tx
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
It is worth trying. I think I have some of that in the house. I am not feeling great about taking out all of my inverts. Maybe I will dip them and put them in a different tank while I try to catch the inverts I want to keep.

They move pretty fast and don't seem that committed to the frag they live on. I cut a frag from the colony to take in to the vet. I was careful to turn off all pumps and bag the thing underwater to make sure the bugs stayed on the frag. Either they all escaped during fragging, or the vet couldnt find them.

He prescribed interceptor and I will get it in the mail in a few days.

dang gotta get a prescription!!! Did they charge you an office visit? Lol sorry trying to cheer myself up from reading these horror stories.
 

hotdrop

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jan 29, 2019
Messages
608
Reaction score
567
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Jusg FYI... I just had 5 corals come in from WWC. I dipped. I looked under a microscope and saw this small black bug... Never heards of black bugs... So, I look them up - and here we are. Only SPS in the lot was a $5 birds nest... Must have come off of that. Also found an astarina starfish munching on the Galxia in the bag. Hmmm. You spend good money on a drag the size of a Nickle from a very reputable place... BAM. Black bugs and Astarina. dang. I'm not very happy. Glad they went into QT... Going out to buy Bayer Insecticide. dang. Can't believe they came in like this.
Wwc has a reputation but a pretty terrible one. They promote on brs but lots of horrible stories about them and highway robbery prices for common stuff. Just search this form and you will find a ton of examples.
 

LOVEROCK

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 22, 2018
Messages
1,289
Reaction score
607
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Jusg FYI... I just had 5 corals come in from WWC. I dipped. I looked under a microscope and saw this small black bug... Never heards of black bugs... So, I look them up - and here we are. Only SPS in the lot was a $5 birds nest... Must have come off of that. Also found an astarina starfish munching on the Galxia in the bag. Hmmm. You spend good money on a drag the size of a Nickle from a very reputable place... BAM. Black bugs and Astarina. dang. I'm not very happy. Glad they went into QT... Going out to buy Bayer Insecticide. dang. Can't believe they came in like this.
got pics of bugs under scope? was it visible to eye alone
 

MarsWulf5

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 26, 2019
Messages
145
Reaction score
192
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
got pics of bugs under scope? was it visible to eye alone
I cant get a pic... The camera cant perceive the image right - like how small the moon looks on a phones camera. Anyhow, these bugs have 6 legs. They are VERY tiny. I cannot see them even with my magnifying glass. I saw one crawling on a pod. They are about 1/20 th the size of a pod. Itty bitty. It matches pictures of black bugs under high magnification online. Its legs are tranlucent in the light as are its head - but inside its ladybug like body are the black lobe type structures... Kind of looks like grapes melted together... Which make the body black. It looks just like a dust mite... Or a chigger... It came off of a tiny frag of Muy Bueno Birds Nest.

I have a problem too. I have 5 frags that are dieing in QT... And I need to get them into my DT ASAP - but - these new frags just got put in there yesterday.

These 20G high quarantine tanks are impossible... And I dont have room for anything bigger for a quarantine.

I'm at my wits end. I quarantines my fish for 10 months... Copper... Hannah Checkers... Etc... And guess what? I saw an icy cyst on my black clown last night in my DT!

Now it has to be a UV sterilizer and a pump... Etc... Or tear apart my new plumb...

I have 5 fish in QT now... So the fish and coral QT are full... And after 10 months
.. I cannt see going fallow.

Have a cyano outbreak... Been waiting for Chemiclean to arrive for 10 days... Its just been on thing after anorher.
 

moreef

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jan 15, 2013
Messages
551
Reaction score
273
Location
Dallas,Tx
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
Wondering what everyone’s procedure is for dipping and placing new frags? Im using bayer now but will add revive before rinsing coral and placing in DT. Do you cut the frag at the base of the plug or just try and break it free intact?
 

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,928
Reaction score
203,059
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
13   0   0
Wondering what everyone’s procedure is for dipping and placing new frags? Im using bayer now but will add revive before rinsing coral and placing in DT. Do you cut the frag at the base of the plug or just try and break it free intact?
Im strictly coralRX. After a few times when i saw what it pulled Vs revive and brightwell - I was sold on it
 

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,928
Reaction score
203,059
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
13   0   0
Wwc has a reputation but a pretty terrible one. They promote on brs but lots of horrible stories about them and highway robbery prices for common stuff. Just search this form and you will find a ton of examples.
Prices ?? - I have not purchased from them in 4 years as the prices Vs the size/type of frag is beyond insane. At trade shows- viewing their 25%off to see Kenyii tree frag at $21.25 after 25% off is a joke. Xenia frag with 3 pom pom for $36 ????
Absolutely Not !!!
 

drawman

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Feb 27, 2016
Messages
3,553
Reaction score
3,614
Location
Florida
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Kind of curious if anyone has noticed an effective dip. I currently use melafix and want to avoid bringing these guys in.
 

krak256

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 23, 2019
Messages
169
Reaction score
66
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Any other people's experience with using interceptor?

I have a 150g and i initially used 3 large dog pills and there seems to be no effect 18 hours later. As a result, I just added another pill to increase the dosage and plan to do a water change tomorrow so approximately 18 hours at 4x dosage and another 18 hours at 5.5x dosage

if all else fails, has anyone restarted their tanks? I might be headed down that route...
 

krak256

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 23, 2019
Messages
169
Reaction score
66
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Got a pic of the bugs? If they look more like flatworm black bugs this treatment will not work.
I see both? Both the more oval ones as well as ones that look like flatworms. What do you suggest to handle the flatworm like ones? I dosed flatworm exit last week and no impact.
 

krak256

Active Member
View Badges
Joined
Apr 23, 2019
Messages
169
Reaction score
66
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
does anyone know if leaving the tank empty of acros and/or all sps will kill off the black bugs?
 

Backreefing

Valuable Member
View Badges
Joined
Nov 29, 2018
Messages
1,282
Reaction score
1,135
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
does anyone know if leaving the tank empty of acros and/or all sps will kill off the black bugs?
Hello I may have something to add . But first off I never had your pests , so I know not of what I speak . Butttt
This sounds nuts ..... has anyone tryed induceing Dino’s to kill pests ??? I mean a bad case of them .
example my 20 gallon quarantine tank which has turned into a 20 gallon aquarium it had developed a horrible case of Dino‘s these Dino’s killed a coral that I know had flat worms on it and Asternia stars all dead , as well as all snails in hermits . Everything got killed by the dinos. There smothering, and toxic. I do know acropora don’t really care about dinos . But it smothered everything.
I hope this useless information is of value.
 

Cergoth

New Member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
2
Reaction score
0
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Hello, i personally stand that once you introduce that pest, its nearly impossible to avoid losing acros.

I tried everything. Dipping, cutting, moving to diffrent places in aquarium. I lost.

-That pest is active mostly at night.
-I think that it lays eggs inside skeleton, that is why dipping isnt enough.
-It spreads very fast and randomly. I still dont know how, but it may occur in completly diffrent part of aquarium in one day.
 

Attachments

  • greay_black_acrobug.jpg
    greay_black_acrobug.jpg
    110.6 KB · Views: 121

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,928
Reaction score
203,059
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
13   0   0
Hello, i personally stand that once you introduce that pest, its nearly impossible to avoid losing acros.

I tried everything. Dipping, cutting, moving to diffrent places in aquarium. I lost.

-That pest is active mostly at night.
-I think that it lays eggs inside skeleton, that is why dipping isnt enough.
-It spreads very fast and randomly. I still dont know how, but it may occur in completly diffrent part of aquarium in one day.
Dip will not work as you found. Interceptor pill from a vet is the surest bet
 

Reefing threads: Do you wear gear from reef brands?

  • I wear reef gear everywhere.

    Votes: 42 16.5%
  • I wear reef gear primarily at fish events and my LFS.

    Votes: 16 6.3%
  • I wear reef gear primarily for water changes and tank maintenance.

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • I wear reef gear primarily to relax where I live.

    Votes: 30 11.8%
  • I don’t wear gear from reef brands.

    Votes: 147 57.6%
  • Other.

    Votes: 19 7.5%
Back
Top