Bryopsis Cure: My Battle With Bryopsis Using Fluconazole

[edosan]

It was the only different thing I didn't have done before, and I have a frag tank, I always do the same to both, this time no fluc in the ft, and no problems there at all (milleporas included).
But if you ask me if I am sure? No i am not, is just the suspect number 1.

 

[ksanfranfan]

It was the only different thing I didn't have done before, and I have a frag tank, I always do the same to both, this time no fluc in the ft, and no problems there at all (milleporas included).
But if you ask me if I am sure? No i am not, is just the suspect number 1.

Ok, I wasn't sure if you were solely stating that fluconazole was the only factor in the treatment.
I saw some other nutrient reduction and other methods that could or could not have played a factor as well.

 

[Madimod]

https://www.payless-petproducts.com/fluconazole200.html

Thank you ordered some Monday and it just arrived today

 

[edosan]

Ok, I wasn't sure if you were solely stating that fluconazole was the only factor in the treatment.
I saw some other nutrient reduction and other methods that could or could not have played a factor as well.

I do not think nut reduction was a factor here, since I have done this many times in order to check the optimun. And as long as it is slow there is no problems.

 

[ksanfranfan]

I do not think nut reduction was a factor here, since I have done this many times in order to check the optimun. And as long as it is slow there is no problems.

I understand, however you did make several changes that were involved with this treatment that could have contributed to the less than optimal conditions for your tank.
It would be easier to suggest that the medication was responsible if it was the only change.

 

[edosan]

Actually, the changes I made before the treatment was exacly the opposite, was a fine tune in order to leave the tank in Optimal Conditions in order to check the impact on Fluconazole. I know my tank and I know what works or not. And like I mention before, I did nothing that I haven´t done before, but Fluconazole.

But of course is all based in observations, ad I might be wrong. The fact is that I did loose Milleporas. (one was a 2 year old millepora)

 

[ksanfranfan]

Actually, the changes I made before the treatment was exacly the opposite, was a fine tune in order to leave the tank in Optimal Conditions in order to check the impact on Fluconazole. I know my tank and I know what works or not. And like I mention before, I did nothing that I haven´t done before, but Fluconazole.

But of course is all based in observations, ad I might be wrong. The fact is that I did loose Milleporas. (one was a 2 year old millepora)

Alright, I'm just not understanding how you came to your conclusion. Your thread about dosing bleach coincides with the time of this treatment. You said you reduced or eliminated vinegar dosing and shut down uv.
I'm not trying to say I know your tank better than you but it's hard to see how fluconazole was the only change made. It's been stated many times that the die off from bryopsis can increase nutrients with fluconazole treatment.
Anyways, hopefully others who are trying to decide if this treatment is worth trying or not will read the info from the first page as a guideline. Then see what others did prior to, during and after the treatment as successful methods.

 

[edosan]

Alright, I'm just not understanding how you came to your conclusion. Your thread about dosing bleach coincides with the time of this treatment. You said you reduced or eliminated vinegar dosing and shut down uv.

How can you even think that I use bleach in a tank while I was treating with Fluconazole... wonder where that come from? why you are getting conclusions that I made that in the same time? or the same tank? I have more than 1.000 gal in over 6 tanks

I'm not trying to say I know your tank better than you but it's hard to see how fluconazole was the only change made. It's been stated many times that the die off from bryopsis can increase nutrients with fluconazole treatment.

You are getting it worong, I said is the only change I made that I DID NOT MADE BEFORE.
And nutrients where pretty stable on my tank during Fluconazole treatment and Bryo Dying... Nitrates came up to 5 - 10 and po4 arround 0.06 no acro will die for that.

Anyways, hopefully others who are trying to decide if this treatment is worth trying or not will read the info from the first page as a guideline. Then see what others did prior to, during and after the treatment as successful methods.

If you read my posts I am saying that Fluconazole WORKS in 98% of the tanks. And I have never say is not worth trying, just giving my experience and is up to the reader to take it or no.

Before jumping into conclusions about other tanks, will be nice to see what type of tanks are we talking about.

Cheers!

 

[ksanfranfan]

How can you even think that I use bleach in a tank while I was treating with Fluconazole... wonder where that come from? why you are getting conclusions that I made that in the same time? or the same tank? I have more than 1.000 gal in over 6 tanks

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/using-bleach-naclo-in-a-reef-tank.296459/
From your thread. you stated that you were dosing multiple tanks. As you stated here in an earlier post you stopped prior to fluconazole treatment as well as other methods.

You are getting it worong, I said is the only change I made that I DID NOT MADE BEFORE.
And nutrients where pretty stable on my tank during Fluconazole treatment and Bryo Dying... Nitrates came up to 5 - 10 and po4 arround 0.06 no acro will die for that.

I agree.

If you read my posts I am saying that Fluconazole WORKS in 98% of the tanks. And I have never say is not worth trying, just giving my experience and is up to the reader to take it or no.

Before jumping into conclusions about other tanks, will be nice to see what type of tanks are we talking about.

Cheers!

Not sure where you factored it works in 98% of tanks. At this time the current poll shows different. Right now for all we know is that it works in about 50% of tanks. I haven't jumped to any conclusions throughout this entire thread. I'm still not sure if this treatment will last long term or not. I've had to dose 1 tank twice for unknown reasons. Others have had to as well.
So, I haven't made any conclusions yet, including in my tanks. Your conclusion is that it works but only in 98% of tanks. How do you know that? Do you know other peoples tank as well? My point in asking you questions previously was to maybe point out some of the things that you were doing previous to the treatment or maybe during the treatment. Any information would be helpful to others going forward.
At this point I'm not going to continue with our discussion. Hopefully we will get some testing done for this treatment along with more follow up information from others.
I wish you good luck with your tanks.

 

[edosan]

Jajaj you are too literal ... 98% is just a way to say, be carefull it might do damage if you have delicates acros. Even when everyone is saying is safe.

The math is easy.I have arround 200 corals in my main reef (more or less) and 5 die, jaja so there you have the 2% (anecdotical info tho [emoji1] )
I never mix experiments, that is just dumb imo

Cheers!

 

[testertips]

Anyone have any luck using Fluconazole to combat slime algae?

 

[mcarroll]

@testertips Basic troubleshooting will clear up a cyano outbreak.

If you haven't opened up your own thread to troubleshoot, you should do that asap. Post a full tank pic as well as all your latest test results and a brief tank history.

 

[Acronuts]

Very happy and thrilled to say that after a 14 day treatment my reef tank no longer has any byropsis !!!

Pics taken on day 14




Nothing in tank seemed to be bothered by the use of the meds. I continued to feed and dose. Turned skimmer back on by day 5.
WC done by day 16.

Good luck to others whom are trying the treatment.

 

[JoeIII]

Flucon arrived in the mail today. 125G w/55G sump - I estimate my water volume at 150G. I did the math and the 3,000mg landed between the "low" dose for my highest volume estimate and the "high" dose for my lowest volume estimate, so I figure it's safe all around.


GFO reactor running, as usual.
Skimmer cup off, skimmer turned all the way down to avoid overflowing - will play this by ear, I have run without it for a week+ before, so no worries there.
Filter sock removed for a couple days - will replace when I begin to see dieoff
no GAC, biopellets, etc on system.

Mixed inhabitants, half a dozen varieties of snails, various crabs and hermit crabs, BTA, corals of all flavors, SPS, LPS, zoa, mushrooms, ricordea (florida and yuma), BTA, wrasses, tangs, clownfish, royal gramma, orchid dottyback, serpent and brittle starts (large and small), sea cucumbers -think that covers it.
Chaeto in refugium. Lit 24/7 with 96W LED grow light

I have a combination of Bryopsis and GHA, primarily in high-light areas. If this kills the Bryopsis I will be happy. I have beaten GHA before and can beat it again once the Bryopsis is not throwing my parameters out of whack. The pictures below show a FTS ad pictures of the two worst areas, at the top of each island, far left and far right.

Added 15 capsules with return pumps off to maximize initial contact time - will turn back on in an hour or two
DAY ZERO:

I believe that this medication works by binding with other substances in the algae, which is why some people get different results with different doses. It is not a matter of "X mg per gallon" but a matter of "X mg per gram of algae." If you have little algae and dose light you may have success, if you have lots of algae you may not and may have to dose again. This is assuming nothing else strips the medication from the water before it can be absorbed by the algae.

 

[Victoria M]

Fluconazole is working in a lot more than 50% of the time. the poll has a currently trying the medication that makes it off. there are very few people that reported it did not work ksanfranfan

 

[pastelball]

So 3 weeks later and 2 water changes after 14 days. Not running a skimmer just gfo. Siphoned the sand and baster on the rocks its looking free of bryopsis.

Before

After

 

[mcarroll]

Fluconazole is working in a lot more than 50% of the time. the poll has a currently trying the medication that makes it off. there are very few people that reported it did not work ksanfranfan

Statistics.... Polls are always subject to fundamental accuracy issues and personal interpretation.

Having such a high percentage "still testing" combined with a significant percentage "failures" means that the jury is really, really still out.

I agree that fluconazole "works as-advertised", but it doesn't work in a vacuum and it's not foolproof.

What's important about this situation is that fluconazole is a serious synthetic antibiotic....it is not an ephemeral substance like hydrogen peroxide or bleach that will naturally dissipate into more or less harmless constituents in a short amount of time. It also tends to cause microbial resistance, so future doses on every critter will be less effective.

We really need it to be a one-shot cure where Bryopsis doesn't come back.

If it turns out, for example, that there's 80% recurrence rate on the "I'm cured" tanks due to other issues like husbandry style, then even if "it works" hypothetically, then at the end of the experiment it's a terrible solution. Then there are the cases where someone loses a few corals or other critters or has some other side-effect, but calls it "a success" since he's not 100% sure the fluconazole was the cause.

So, the cases where fluconazole "fails" are actually extremely important – more important than the "I'm cured!" cases if you ask me. We need to find out why those "fail" cases happen.

2¢

 

[NCreefguy]

Statistics.... Polls are always subject to fundamental accuracy issues and personal interpretation.

Having such a high percentage "still testing" combined with a significant percentage "failures" means that the jury is really, really still out.

Don't forget the amount of people that have used the treatment but didn't enter their results on the poll. A lot of big names in our hobby have used or are currently using this treatment on their tanks and in their grow out facilities. If the poll showed a 50/50 result, then I would say that the jury is still out but having 20 people say that it didn't work(with some of them voting that way when I put the poll up before they even had a chance to use Fluconazole) out of the hundreds(many have PMed me saying it worked but didn't enter their names on the poll) that have said it does just doesn't really seem to take much intelligence to see that it's working. A bunch of the "treating my tank with it now" votes have been there from early on and have just not been updated. I understand that those results could go either way but in general when something doesn't work for them,people tend to tell someone about it.(they would vote no)

I agree that fluconazole "works as-advertised", but it doesn't work in a vacuum and it's not foolproof.

Nobody ever said it was "foolproof". What is in our hobby? I mean water changes can be performed incorrectly right? So water changes aren't "foolproof" are they? Yet everyone advises to do water changes all the time.

What's important about this situation is that fluconazole is a serious synthetic antibiotic....it is not an ephemeral substance like hydrogen peroxide or bleach that will naturally dissipate into more or less harmless constituents in a short amount of time. It also tends to cause microbial resistance, so future doses on every critter will be less effective.

What's important about this situation is that Fluconazole has helped a bunch of people finally to be able to enjoy their tanks or continue their business(some vendors have used it) without having to tear down their systems or lose everything from being smothered out and waste hundreds or thousands of dollars in the process.

If it turns out, for example, that there's 80% recurrence rate on the "I'm cured" tanks due to other issues like husbandry style, then even if "it works" hypothetically, then at the end of the experiment it's a terrible solution.

There are no recurrences from husbandry style unless you are talking about the reintroduction of more frags /rocks/anything else that had bryopsis cells on it into your tank. I had high nutrients in my tank for several months(battling dinos) and have not had any bryopsis return. Once you kill all of the bryopsis cells they will not return because of your tank params. I'll say this again because maybe the third time will be the charm...There is no such thing as spontaneous generation of Bryopsis. Seriously, you've looked everywhere trying to find something that would say otherwise and couldn't find anything. It has to come from an existing Bryopsis cells. Period.

Then there are the cases where someone loses a few corals or other critters or has some other side-effect, but calls it "a success" since he's not 100% sure the fluconazole was the cause.
So, the cases where fluconazole "fails" are actually extremely important – more important than the "I'm cured!" cases if you ask me. We need to find out why those "fail" cases happen.
2¢

Killing algae in your tank and having it release its toxins or nutrients may effect each tank/coral/invert/fish differently. Saying he's not sure if Fluconazole was the cause simply means he's not sure if the meds caused it directly. The "success" was getting rid of his bryopsis. The toxins or higher nutrients could have caused the loss.
You can tear down a tank and start completely over due to it being over-run with bryopsis and lose some corals/fish/inverts in the process of moving them around from one tank to another. It would still be a "success" in the fact that you have a new bryopsis free tank up and running when you're done....But hypothetically that would be a "terrible solution" as well since losses may occur.

We really need it to be a one-shot cure where Bryopsis doesn't come back.

It was for me and many others but if it takes two or even three treatments to get rid of the bryopsis for some then so be it. We don't need it to work in one treatment but it would be nice. For that matter, it would be nice to hug some trees in our yard and think happy little thoughts and have the bryopsis just melt away but that isn't going to happen so we're back to the real world and the reality of having to (or choosing to) do things that not everyone will agree with.
Not everyone agrees with the vehicles that we drive since they are negatively impacting our earth and our health with cancer causing hydrocarbons (not to even mention the dangerous/toxic wastes from manufacturing and disposal). Have you sold yours and started walking everywhere yet?

So often people want to save the world from others,just not from themselves.

 

[John kennington]

I'm currently using floconazole and I'm watching the bryopsis die off.

 

[mcarroll]

So often people want to save the world from others,just not from themselves.

Never got that PM.