Dry rock simple cycle question

[Garf]

It doesn’t and your right.

If it gives the reefer “piece of mind” then by all means.

We just don’t do it in our set up’s any longer.

Well ok, lol. I did a bit of stuff with Fritzyme 9 and it appeared to be full of heterotrophs, not true nitrifyers. I concluded that by the time it got to the UK it was pretty useless, link attached;

Fritzyme 9 modified cycle

It wasn't a criticism. - Just - trying to figure out what you're trying to prove? Nothin to prove, just a ramble, I find rambling sends me off in interesting tangents. I do find it interesting that the nitrifiers appear to still work though, once the carbon source is removed, not suffocated...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[brandon429]

Scuba

There are no simple dry rock cycle questions because we're mid- evolution in changing ways. A lot of procedural battles are in place vying for best practices options that's really what it comes down to. What we'll be using to cycle reef tanks 15 years from now will be fascinating to see.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Wait the time that makes you comfortable but the days of long cycle times are in the past.

Hi- “cycle times” have not changed other than bottled bacteria making them slightly faster.

The “old” recommend “wait” is both insurance and time for other aspects of the system to come into balance. It also fosters the right mindset for moving forward. Many of us don’t see the benefit of adding fish 5-10 days early in a hobby that should last years or decades.

Happy reefing!

 

[Uncle99]

We were months in the 80’s.
Even if you wait two weeks, that’s not slightly faster, but a lot faster.

 

[brandon429]

Agreed. Like Moores law governed computer speed i think a similar event happened to reef tank cycling. And now the top two methods of reef tank cycling, bottle bac ones and live rock transfer ones, have completion dates between 0-10 days if done within a rather forgiving range of prep standards.

 

[BeanAnimal]

We were months in the 80’s.
Even if you wait two weeks, that’s not slightly faster, but a lot faster.

I think you are confusing the recommendation for letting the system mature for the sake of coral and avoiding nuisance algae with the actual nitrogen cycle. That advice is still valid, there are many ways to move forward once water hits that tank. There always have been. I have kept aquariums since the late 70s.

 

[BeanAnimal]

To clarify my earlier comments: bio-spira was around for decades, as has been the practice of using sand or filter media from an established system to kickstart a new system. There may be new brands of bottled stuff, but in general nothing has changed other than the mushrooming impatience to add fish faster. As easy as it is to say things have drastically changed with this aspect of the hobby, they really haven’t all that much for 30 or more years..

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Aside from this “new cycling science”, is there any other product on the market that is agreed to be critical (as is the bacteria here) were we add it and just assume it worked without any sort of checking?

We monitor temperature despite heaters that may have temp markings on them.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Aside from this “new cycling science”, is there any other product on the market that is agreed to be critical (as is the bacteria here) were we add it and just assume it worked without any sort of checking?

We monitor temperature despite heaters that may have temp markings on them.

I can't think of any mission critical active product or additive that does not have a fixed action or reaction per measured or measured amount that would not be verified or tested.

Even then, most are tested be it pool additives, meat cure, baking (yeast), or any other element or compound that a process or safety relies on. Perishable additives even more so. Finished products or process are tested to ensure that the process is progressing as expected. Aquarium husbandry is a process.

 

[Uncle99]

I think you are confusing the recommendation for letting the system mature for the sake of coral and avoiding nuisance algae with the actual nitrogen cycle. That advice is still valid, there are many ways to move forward once water hits that tank. There always have been. I have kept aquariums since the late 70s.

It’s just easier for me to do small daily water changes rather than test what the ammonia level is with a test, that’s not really accurate.

I do the same in QT. Small daily change, vacum up leftovers, never once checked ammonia levels.

It’s what I do, doesn’t mean it’s right, and not for everyone.

I like to get the fish in as quickly as possible.

 

[Garf]

and not for everyone.

So, you would tend to agree that new folk should test ammonia? I'm making the assumption that these fall into your exemption category. Cheers.

 

[Uncle99]

So, you would tend to agree that new folk should test ammonia? I'm making the assumption that these fall into your exemption category. Cheers.

New, old, sure, if that helps them with their system I’d support that.

Then we get calls saying my API test says .25ppm for 45 days, can I add fish yet.

I may start testing ammonia if we start to kill things.

 

[Garf]

Then we get calls saying my API test says .25ppm for 45 days, can I add fish yet.

Indeed, but the myth perpetuated by one or two people on here that those levels are immediately toxic and indeed must be wrong, can easily be refuted, without immediately blaming faulty test kits.

 

[BeanAnimal]

I like to get the fish in as quickly as possible.

When teaching, mentoring or offering advice to a newcomer, I prefer to provide a fairly foolproof method that is both instructive and verifiable that also gives them a foundation of knowledge to build on.

What I may do personally in any circumstance in this hobby, electronics, woodworking, writing code, or any other process may include calculated risks or shortcuts based on experience or acceptable risk. That is a departure from what should be taught, IMHO.

 

[Uncle99]

When teaching, mentoring or offering advice to a newcomer, I prefer to provide a fairly foolproof method that is both instructive and verifiable that also gives them a foundation of knowledge to build on.

What I may do personally in any circumstance in this hobby, electronics, woodworking, writing code, or any other process may include calculated risks or shortcuts based on experience or acceptable risk. That is a departure from what should be taught, IMHO.

You’re absolutely right.
I will refrain in providing any future advice.
We shall leave that to the experts.

 

[Schulks]

The risk you face is disease import, not from cycling, nobody can link us a failed cycle to see where all the fish died. What we can see for losses are disease based and that has nothing to do with cycle type.

If you don't cycle right your fish might just get ammonia burn and if they don't die they get sick trying to heal. Bad cycling leads to sick fish down the line.

 

[Schulks]

If you can find Fritz Turbostart at a LFS in a refrigerator buy that. It is a lot more expensive but I believe it is the best way to cycle an aquarium. Well.. after just buying live rock. I use turbostart to fire up QT's on short notice.

 

[Ben's Pico Reefing]

Best way if using fritz turbo 900 is add and add livestock. I did this for many prior tanks no issues.

Safer way is to add bottle and corals or just corals. Corals if adding with rock attached or from skeleton will provide bacteria.

My question is how big of a tank and what is the setup. As depending on tank will determine better advice tuned for you. Since I don't know size I can't recommend to much. But water changes will not hurt do as big as you want as often as you want.

 

[BeanAnimal]

You’re absolutely right.
I will refrain in providing any future advice.
We shall leave that to the experts.

Nobody has asked you to stop providing advice. Thank you for the conversation and offering your thoughts and opinion. We simply have different opinions on the subject.