HOW CAN I QUICKLY LOWER ALKALINITY?

[Dr. Jim]

I have some SPS frags turning pale in a relatively new (4 mo old) 40 gal tank. The alkalinity is around 9.5-10 Khd and I would like to lower it (about 0.5/day), thinking that is too high, especially when I'm struggling to get the phosphates above zero. (I know the combination of low or zero phosphates with high alkalinity is not good for SPS). I stopped daily AWC (with I.O. salt which I know is high in alk), stopped Triton 4-part dosing, and removed kalk from ATO water. I also slowed the DC pump on my skimmer so nothing is reaching the collection cup. I'm not sure if aeration is adding or removing CO2. I live in NJ with windows closed so I'm guessing it is adding CO2? And, I'm feeding heavily (3x/day; frozen, flakes and pellets).
Getting nitrates up is a bit of a struggle also, but I have them around 4; phosphates at zero are a bigger problem.
I have Brightwell BioFuel (organic carbons) but am reluctant to use it because it will aggravate the low NO3 and PO4 battle.
I know muriatic acid will lower the alk but I don't have any and want to do something quickly before I lose any frags. (One died overnight). Any suggestions are welcome!

Also, any recommendations for a salt with low alk would be appreciated.

Yesterday, I posted a thread about my SPS frags turning pale, with photos, (but didn't get any responses). If interested, you can view it here: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/p...ing-if-anyone-owns-these-specific-sps.712609/

Thanks for helping!

 

[Crabs McJones]

The best way to lower alk would be to let it fall on its own. Otherwise water changes with red sea blue bucket or instant ocean ( non reef crystals) both have lower alk of around 8.

 

[Dr. Jim]

I understand that the Alk will fall on its own but I'm trying to speed up the process before I lose any more frags. I know not to go too fast....but 0.5 dhk per day should be OK, I'm thinking.

I do use Instant Ocean (Original). It is very high in alk…. about 10.0. (which is why I want to find a different brand, low in alk).

 

[Marty's Reef]

Look into Tropic Marin Pro Reef Salt. Very good salt and lower DKH.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You risk burnt tips at higher alk and low nutrients, but the paleness is more likely from just the low nutrients alone.

I'd personally dose nutrients or feed more and let alk slowly fall, rather than solve only part of the problem by lowering alk fast.

To lower alk, IMO, it is a better plan to lower the alk in water change water using any mix you want (can lower to zero if you want), than to add things to the aquarium to lower alk because of the large pH drop that can be fixed in new salt water but not so easily in the tank.

 

[Dr. Jim]

You risk burnt tips at higher alk and low nutrients, but the paleness is more likely from just the low nutrients alone.

I'd personally dose nutrients or feed more and let alk slowly fall, rather than solve only part of the problem by lowering alk fast.

To lower alk, IMO, it is a better plan to lower the alk in water change water using any mix you want (can lower to zero if you want), than to add things to the aquarium to lower alk because of the large pH drop that can be fixed in new salt water but not so easily in the tank.

How would you suggest lowering the alk in the "water change" water?

 

[Dr. Jim]

Look into Tropic Marin Pro Reef Salt. Very good salt and lower DKH.

My plan was to look for some Tropic Marin Pro but it seems to be on back order everywhere. I picked up some Red Sea (blue bucket) yesterday and performed a 20% water change yesterday and again today. Alk dropped from 9.7 to 9.1 so I'm getting there.

Is anybody using Salifert and Hanna checker kits for ALK? If so, are you getting higher readings with the Salifert? This is what I measured yesterday:

Hanna: 9.7
Salifert: 10.5
GHL Director: 8.8 (I will recalibrate the probe later and retest all 3)

Thanks for helping!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

How would you suggest lowering the alk in the "water change" water?

I discuss how to lower alkalinity in these threads:

Sodium Bisulfate to Reduce Alkalinity in New Salt Water or in Display Tanks
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...in-new-salt-water-or-in-display-tanks.362825/

Reducing alkalinity ?
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/reducing-alkalinity.339109/#post-4214464

 

[Dr. Jim]

I discuss how to lower alkalinity in these threads:

Sodium Bisulfate to Reduce Alkalinity in New Salt Water or in Display Tanks
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...in-new-salt-water-or-in-display-tanks.362825/

Reducing alkalinity ?
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/reducing-alkalinity.339109/#post-4214464

Thank you for this info, Randy. One last question if you don't mind....
If the new saltwater is aerated long enough (after sodium bisulfate addition) is it possible to get the pH back up to where it started?

 

[fishguy242]

hi have to ask where is your calcium and mag at?

 

[Dr. Jim]

hi have to ask where is your calcium and mag at?

Here are my parameters as of 9am this morning:
Ca 440 (perfect would be about 420 for alk of 8.6)
Mg 1400
Alk down to 8.6 (Hanna agrees with GHL Director exactly, after calibrating GHL.)
pH 8.01(at 9am); 8.11 (at 2pm)
Nitrates 4
Phosphates zero at 9am; dosing heavily though (every hour); they were 0.06 last night around 11pm so I reduced dosing during the night to every 2 hours but have it back to every hour now.
Added 20 new SPS frags yesterday. All look good except a Hawkins died during the night.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you for this info, Randy. One last question if you don't mind....
If the new saltwater is aerated long enough (after sodium bisulfate addition) is it possible to get the pH back up to where it started?

If the air has normal CO2, it will get very close.

 

[fishguy242]

sounds like your back on track,1 out of 20 ,pretty good i'd say ,happy reefing

 

[Smokey the reefer]

I discuss how to lower alkalinity in these threads:

Sodium Bisulfate to Reduce Alkalinity in New Salt Water or in Display Tanks
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...in-new-salt-water-or-in-display-tanks.362825/

Reducing alkalinity ?
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/reducing-alkalinity.339109/#post-4214464

Hi randy..I'm currently trying to lower my alk to 8dkh from 11 in my display ready for corals as the system they are coming from is 8.so I used this approach in a water change and it did take down my alk to about 5dkh and also took down my ph.
But as soon as my ph rose back up so did my alk level...is this right?
Thank you

 

[p1u5h13r4m24]

You risk burnt tips at higher alk and low nutrients, but the paleness is more likely from just the low nutrients alone.

I'd personally dose nutrients or feed more and let alk slowly fall, rather than solve only part of the problem by lowering alk fast.

To lower alk, IMO, it is a better plan to lower the alk in water change water using any mix you want (can lower to zero if you want), than to add things to the aquarium to lower alk because of the large pH drop that can be fixed in new salt water but not so easily in the tank.

How fast do you think I can safely raise nitrates with Neo nitrate? im 8.6alk .04 phos I raise nitrate from 3-5 since yesterday, but i think it’s should probably be higher. Or my alk should be 7.8-8.0

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

How fast do you think I can safely raise nitrates with Neo nitrate? im 8.6alk .04 phos I raise nitrate from 3-5 since yesterday, but i think it’s should probably be higher. Or my alk should be 7.8-8.0

I'd add 2 ppm per day for a few days and see what that does. You may need more to get a stable reading.

The alkalinity and phosphate are fine, but I agree boosting nitrate is a fine plan.

 

[p1u5h13r4m24]

I'd add 2 ppm per day for a few days and see what that does. You may need more to get a stable reading.

The alkalinity and phosphate are fine, but I agree boosting nitrate is a fine plan.

Thank you! It took a ton of research until I could figure out why I was getting white tips(that would than get algae). But I’m thinking low nitrate to high alk and also phos to nitrate may be unbalanced at some points after feeding. For example I check before my daily feeding starts and get .04, but I’d imagine after feeding; phos may get to be as high as .07-.1 and nitrates we’re only 3ppm (now 5ppm)

So between those two I had issues.
Anyway how high do you think I should bring nitrate? 10-20? My salt is fritz pro and I believe it mixes 8.0-9.0

Thanks randy I’m really glad to get a response from you!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

IMO, a few ppm nitrate is probably adequate to prevent burnt tips at 8.6 dKH. I do not think more than 10 ppm is desirable.

 

[p1u5h13r4m24]

IMO, a few ppm nitrate is probably adequate to prevent burnt tips at 8.6 dKH. I do not think more than 10 ppm is desirable.

Sounds good. Thank you!

 

[UnderseaOddities]

How would you suggest lowering the alk in the "water change" water?

You're overthinking it your base salt mix probably mixes at 8 to 8.6 dkh if using io reef Crystal's when mixed to 1.025

U don't want to lower alk instead figure out daily alk consumption by not dosing for a couple days record see the correlations in the swings and adjust accordingly

To me personally its sounds like u went hard on bottles how are u supplementing alk? Because why else would the alk be high?

Are u using 3 part bottles or kalk?

U got a pereistatic dosing pump or are u dosing by hand?

Also which salt do u use as a base?