Insane and unstable over 1 year.

[ChrisfromBrick]

Where is Randy? Can someone throw this guy a life line and explain his options? Surely, a few of you with chemistry degrees can explain what could be going wrong here other than him not listening to advice. The chemistry is above my pay grade. I just understand basic chem.

 

[Jake_v]

That might be why the 10 gallon is so stable…..I totally forgot that I did that actually. Ugh now I feel really stupid. I some some rocks and rubble shells and filter pads and added them to the 10 gallon to cycle it and left everything in there. And that’s actually when the 30 began having some issues.


Crap. I also took a small bag of established seachem matrix from the 30 and added it to the filter of the 10z

Why are you running seachem matrix if you have issues keeping nitrate and phosphate detectable?

 

[BlueBayouReefHTX]

is a skimmer necessary in a 30 gallon? I know some people said it wasn’t. I’m not using one on the 10. I was scared to not skim with the corals in the 30 LPS ones

The skimmer is nice from an oxygenation standpoint but if you're really having that much trouble bringing your nutrients up, you may try turning off the skimmer for awhile.

 

[BlueBayouReefHTX]

is a skimmer necessary in a 30 gallon? I know some people said it wasn’t. I’m not using one on the 10. I was scared to not skim with the corals in the 30 LPS ones

Are you doing water changes? Sorry if I missed that.

 

[Jake_v]

Where is Randy? Can someone throw this guy a life line and explain his options? Surely, a few of you with chemistry degrees can explain what could be going wrong here other than him not listening to advice. The chemistry is above my pay grade. I just understand basic chem.

I'm a chemical engineer, primary focus is in metallic plating and chemical/metal oxidations. I don't use things in my tank that I don't know the chemical make-up of. They can cause drastic ALK swings, nitrogen swings, calcium precipitation, etc..

If you can't measure for it, don't dose it..

 

[BeanAnimal]

Where is Randy? Can someone throw this guy a life line and explain his options? Surely, a few of you with chemistry degrees can explain what could be going wrong here other than him not listening to advice. The chemistry is above my pay grade. I just understand basic chem.

I am not sure what else there is to explain. He is regularly dumping algaecide into his aquarium to combat "dinos" and in the course of doing so is damaging other parts of the ecosystem. There are over a f 2,294 living dinoflagellate species. A subset of those algae are the symbionts in coral, and others part of the healthy algae and biofilms in the aquaria. The collateral damage, especially with repeated dosing, us likely significant and is likely affected everything from nutrient uptake and coral health and calcification to water chemistry. The system likely has a different "balance" than we would consider a "healthy" reef.

Add in other possible issues (source water) for example and the system may have other stressors throwing it off of what we would consider a "norma" balance.

 

[ShawnSaucier]

Thinking about it, since you have the 10g up and running, with no issues, you could move your corals there to be able to black out your 30 and not stress…

 

[IceNein]

The skimmer is nice from an oxygenation standpoint but if you're really having that much trouble bringing your nutrients up, you may try turning off the skimmer for awhile.

An option that is on the table, if you want the skimmer for oxygenation is to turn down the level so that barely any, if any at all skimmate makes it to the cup. Then you have much of the aeration without much nutrient removal.

 

[BlueBayouReefHTX]

An option that is on the table, if you want the skimmer for oxygenation is to turn down the level so that barely any, if any at all skimmate makes it to the cup. Then you have much of the aeration without much nutrient removal.

Good idea.

 

[smitten with ocean life]

i thought about randy too but figured if he wasnt interested in julian sprung why get randy involved! ;) it was very kind of all of you who tried to help!

 

[BeanAnimal]

I’m sure it has extended knowledge yet nothing backed by science.

This has reached an extreme level of silly.

You appear to want to argue about everything with everybody, to the point of discounting the writing and research of Julian Sprung as not backed by science, insulting the intelligence or credentials of those trying to help you -- let alone pedantically wanting to quibble about who started the hobby and clay pots in Egypt?

There is a lot of BS (your words) here, but it is not coming from the people kindly offering their time to help you.

People see you speaking as an expert refuting everything that has been offered, citing your experience, the advice of your LFS and some random "marine biologist" you met at said LFS, as excuses to discount the collective knowledge and experience of those in this hobby, including well regarded published scientists as not credible.

The product was created in a lab and therefore it was studied and proven by that study to work for what it is designed to do. That I know is fact.

You want "science" and "fact"?

IT "was made in a lab" as pool algaecide and not "lab" developed to fight reef aquarium Dinos". In fact the original label was marketed toward algae (like vibrant) as "algae x". The label is not even forthcoming about the compound in the bottle, likely an attempt to hide exactly what it is. It is packed and marketed by an aquarium supply vendor, who by many accounts is less than forthcoming about what is in their products and appears to often "make up" impossible scientific explanations for how many of their products work. Creative marketing would be un understatement IMHO.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/dino-x.786375/post-8382457
The side effects are detrimental to a stable system, especially when used repeatedly, as you are doing. Conversation with you past that point has become impossible, but it is key to helping you.

Application of logic and knowledge, cause and effect, does not require scientific white papers to be valid or a scientist to relay said knowledge or science. The underlying science is there, be it posted directly in the forum or simply part of the collective knowledge being passed on to you.

You are too busy being the smartest guy in the room and repeatedly self excusing your abarassive responsees, combativeness and rudeness as "a good thing", to receive actual help. Not for lack of people overlooking the crap, and still trying to help you.

I was one that tried to help, but am beyond that. Your behavior is ridiculous. I am responding again to appeal to you to stop being abusive to the other people that are still (for whatever reason) trying to help you.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I did participate in the early stages of this thread, but when we got to trying to prevent algae in a 30 gallon tank with a puffer, I bowed out, hot having any useful ideas how to accomplish that.

 

[LPS_guy]

I did participate in the early stages of this thread, but when we got to trying to prevent algae in a 30 gallon tank with a puffer, I bowed out, hot having any useful ideas how to accomplish that.

I have an idea lawnmower blenny

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have an idea lawnmower blenny

I do not doubt others may have better ideas. The fish I know work well are too large and the inverts I know will likely be eaten.

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

I have an idea lawnmower blenny

What?! Lawnmower blenny isn't solving that problem.

 

[BlueBayouReefHTX]

Hey, Not that my opinion or experience equals to a certified Marine Biologist. This is just my suggestion and only hope to help.

I’ve skimmed through these pages, and it’s full of frustration, so skimmed is being used loosely. Dinos and other nuisance algae’s can be very frustrating and I hope you can get past the situation.

What I would do in if I was in this situation, which I’ve been in before, I think it stems from dry rock btw.

First, I believe you are seeing low nutrient is due to the algae’s consuming them quickly. Thus test results are showing up low.
To treat the system, I would do a series of Blackout, scrubbing rock with a toothbrush, consistent sock changes, mini water changes and obtaining some real live sand from the ocean.

Depending on how aggressive you want to go, my humble opinion would be to scrub rocks daily and allow the water to cycle and clear through your socks. Change socks and do a small water change.

If this is a bit much, you could do a scrub, change socks, water change followed by a 2-3 day black out. Before returning lights back on, scrub, change socks, small water change. Continue with scrubs, sock/water changes every 2-3 days. For the next month. If the rock is “clean” after the initial scrub/black out use a turkey baster to clean the rocks before the sock/ water change and use the brush on any new growth as needed.

Again I will say that I skimmed this thread, but I believe it was mentioned that this is a 30g AIO system? UV systems for this size tank in my opinion are kind of silly unless you are running a separate feed pump to know what you rate things are going through.


I recommend some real ocean live sand as it contains so much bacteria to help out compete algae and help the bacterial “ slime” coat your rocks. I am not sure how easy it is to get sand in Canada similar to Aqua-Biomics or Tamp Bay Saltwater products. The bagged stuff on most shelves and bottled stuff is very limited and great for helping start the path to a mature reef, but just a starting point. Additions of Pods can help as well, little mouths eating the tiny bits is always good.

I really do wish you luck on this fight, it can kill your day when the tank is an eye sore. Take a breath, get your hands wet, it’s just a temporary road bump. In the meantime I would refrain from purchasing any corals or adding some finned friends. This is a bit of a more natural approach and getting the chemicals out of your tank. Looking forward to seeing that puffer in pictures with a stunning backdrop. All of the best

This is exactly what i'm doing right now for my Dinos- it's been maybe two weeks since I'd call it an outbreak and i'm already seeing progress. Mine isn't much bigger at 50g with a smaller sump.

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

The more I read, the more I want to get a big piece or 2 of live rock directly from the ocean for my next build.

 

[BlueBayouReefHTX]

The more I read, the more I want to get a big piece or 2 of live rock directly from the ocean for my next build.

Expecting some Indo rock tomorrow- watch for my build thread :)

 

[alexanderthefishlover]

Are you doing water changes? Sorry if I missed that.

Yes I do water changes. Just found out my salinity climbed to 1.029 and apparently that can make hair algae grow faster. Interesting!

 

[alexanderthefishlover]

I did participate in the early stages of this thread, but when we got to trying to prevent algae in a 30 gallon tank with a puffer, I bowed out, hot having any useful ideas how to accomplish that.

I appreciate your candidness. I also appreciate that you are not backing the ideas being thrown at me left and right without enough statical data to prove it effective.