Lyretail Anthias v/s Darts issue

[jpcaram]

Hi Everybody! I'm rather new to the hobby and have slowly been stocking my reef tank (65 gal) with fish. I had 2 clowns, 2 darts and 1 watchman goby. I decided to add a Lyretail Anthias, based on my understanding that they are peaceful. Unfortunately, she likes to chase the darts. Mostly when I show up (meaning food is coming). Now the darts hardly ever come out of their hideout. I haven't seen one of them out in about a week, but I think it is still alive. The other one I've seen out daily for a few minutes.

It seems I'm having to choose between them at this point since I don't think one of the darts will make it much longer. I'm okay having to make the choice, but I would like to understand better how to continue to pick fish such that they all get along. I'm afraid that if I choose to let go of the anthias, I may soon get other fish that the darts are afraid of. Maybe it is the darts that are too easily scared, and I should go for more active fish in general.

What are your thought on this matter? And is there hope that I can do something to improve the situation with my existing population? Thanks!

 

[blaxsun]

I haven't been this hobby as long as some, but during my intense exposure to the hobby I can relate that often fish that are supposed to be peaceful aren't and that fish that are supposed to get along don't (or vice versa).

I had 4 dartfish and they all ended up on the floor, so I suspect that you're right: at least one fish thought they were fun to chase.

Even when using fish compatibility charts there are so many factors to consider (rockscaping, water parameters, feeding, size of fish, etc.) that it's really impossible to tell if fish A will get along with fish B and fish C.

I love sixline wrasses. They've been awesome in my tanks. Throw a quarter and you'll hit someone who thinks they're the devil incarnate.

With respect to dartfish, my advice is this: anything that's shaped like a torpedo tends to act as such.

 

[jpcaram]

Thanks for the feedback @blaxsun !

Well, my "torpedoes" have been under the sand for a while. I would rather have them act like torpedoes (I have a lid) and eating.

Side anecdote: I used to have 3, but one of them "darted" into one of my powerheads!

Maybe I should try to narrow this down to the options I think I have:

1) Do nothing. Let the darts die or hope they will adapt. And continue stocking the tank with the understanding that it is just too hard to tell how fish will get along (with basic understanding of their behavior, of course).

2) Rescue the darts and trade them at my LFS. And in the future avoid fish that are too easily scared.

3) Rescue the darts and trade them at my LFS under the assumption that darts are this particular and other peaceful fish won't mind the anthias as much. Then continue to stock the tank without much concern.

4) Take the anthias back to my LFS. And continue to look for very passive species.

5) Take the anthias back to my LFS under the assumption that I got a specific individual that likes chasing other fish. Then continue to stock the tank without much concern.

6) Something else?

What would be your pick?

Here is the aggressor:

 

[blaxsun]

That's a tough one. For me, once they go into my tank good luck catching anything (unless it's by chance with a fish trap). If you're concerned that your dartfish won't make it and your LFS will take them back, I'd probably go with option #3. I have four anthias in my tank (two lyretail, two red fairy) and they get along with everything.

 

[jpcaram]

What is everything (in "they get along with everything")? I want to get an idea of your population and what I can look forward to put in my tank along with the anthias. And what size is your tank?

Oh, I've never tried to catch anything in my DT...

By the way, I've noticed the anthias a bit aggressive towards my clowns at times. No big deal. They mostly ignore her. I'm just throwing out there in case this is a case of an unusually aggressive individual.

Ok... so option 3... what if I can't catch them?

 

[Jubei2006]

I have 3 male lyretails in my 500 gallon. They dive bomb and chase the 5 females (initially bought 10 females and 3 changed) several times a day. The only time they try to bully anything in the tank is feeding time. I also have 2 purple firefish. The firefish are pretty skittish and take off no matter what swims near them (6 wrasses, 4 tangs, 2 blennies, Bellus angelfish, Mag. Foxface). Otherwise the anthias don't bother anybody.

 

[rtparty]

Probably not the "rule" but lyretail can definitely be super aggressive. Especially the males

 

[Jubei2006]

Tried the mirror trick yet on the anthia? Tape or place a mirror on 1 or both sides of the tank, works in my tank when I introduce new fish. The established ones are so busy trying to chase off conspecifics they forget about the other fish in the tank. You could also possibly try adding 2-3 female lyretails to redirect the male's attention (but anthias can also be real ******s to each other).

 

[svanur]

I had them in my last tank and the male was very aggressive

 

[jpcaram]

This one is not a male (yet).

@Jubei2006 , so you think maybe having a pair would help by having them pay more attention to each other? I can't add too many fish though, my tank is an AIO 65 gal, so the display is about 55 gal. What would be your choice among the options I listed in message #3 above?

Thanks!

 

[jpcaram]

Found this:

From Scott W. Michael, "Reef Aquarium Fishes", 2005.

So perhaps they are only to be kept in an ultra peaceful tank

 

[blaxsun]

What is everything (in "they get along with everything")? I want to get an idea of your population and what I can look forward to put in my tank along with the anthias. And what size is your tank?

Oh, I've never tried to catch anything in my DT...

By the way, I've noticed the anthias a bit aggressive towards my clowns at times. No big deal. They mostly ignore her. I'm just throwing out there in case this is a case of an unusually aggressive individual.

Ok... so option 3... what if I can't catch them?

42 fish (including the 4 anthias). My tank is 160-gallons. Fish they get along with: other anthias, angelfish, dwarf angelfish, basslets, wrasses, tangs, hawkfish, gobies, chromis, damsels, parrotfish, clownfish... Think that's everything. The flame hawkfish I have gave two *'s about the dartfish I had at the time.

I ignore my clownfish - they always have something up their *** about something to gripe about. Lately they've been defending a particular anemone like it's The Alamo.

 

[jpcaram]

It's tarting to sound like I need more fish in general!

 

[Tcook]

That anthias is definitely transitioning if not male already. If you like the anthias then get 2 more females. They will then spend most of their energy on themselves.

 

[Jubei2006]

This one is not a male (yet).

@Jubei2006 , so you think maybe having a pair would help by having them pay more attention to each other? I can't add too many fish though, my tank is an AIO 65 gal, so the display is about 55 gal. What would be your choice among the options I listed in message #3 above?

Thanks!

I was worried about three males in a 500 gallon tank. They are showing normal reef behaviors, without causing damage to each other. I see more aggression between my two firefish than with any other fish in the tank. They do take off with sudden movement in and around the tank. Personally, I'd get two to three females for the tank to distract the male. In addition Id put up mirrors to also distract the male.

 

[BVF]

My male Lyretail Anthias is by far the most aggressive fish in my tank, more so than the two spot bristletooth tang. He is constantly fighting with the diamond goby who is more than twice his size. Everything else is super chill.

 

[jpcaram]

@Jubei2006 , you have a 500 gallon tank!? Mine is 10 times smaller! I though an anthias would be the largest fish in the tank when it grows, so a single one would be my limit. But then 2 more?! @Tcook seems to have the same opinion. I love the appearance of anthias' in general. The lyretail is beautiful and I like what I've seen in pictures of other variants.

Is the mirror trick something temporary?

 

[Jubei2006]

@Jubei2006 , you have a 500 gallon tank!? Mine is 10 times smaller! I though an anthias would be the largest fish in the tank when it grows, so a single one would be my limit. But then 2 more?! @Tcook seems to have the same opinion. I love the appearance of anthias' in general. The lyretail is beautiful and I like what I've seen in pictures of other variants.

Is the mirror trick something temporary?

I run it for about a week or so, then take it down. So yes, but has worked out well so far. Plus my fairy wrasses show off in the mirror, man they are pretty! Can also rearrange some of the rock work if possible. It throws off their territory.

 

[Tcook]

@Jubei2006 , you have a 500 gallon tank!? Mine is 10 times smaller! I though an anthias would be the largest fish in the tank when it grows, so a single one would be my limit. But then 2 more?! @Tcook seems to have the same opinion. I love the appearance of anthias' in general. The lyretail is beautiful and I like what I've seen in pictures of other variants.

Is the mirror trick something temporary?

I have 5 lyretails and a bimac in my 120. You could easily do 3 lyretails in your tank.

 

[jpcaram]

I'm happy to report that the two darts are alive and have been spending a lot of time in the open. It seems that they got used to the anthias chasing them (it still does) and don't feel the need to hide for weeks at a time. Thank you all for the tips!