Metal Halides are the bomb

[A. grandis]

Bombs Away!
Finally switched from 8T5's to my 2 lumen bright de minis running phoenix 14k 250 watts on m80 ballasts.
Its been about 2 weeks and the tank temp is the same, lol.
The reflectors are actually cooler to the touch than my old ati unit.
Really love the look and already seeing growth.
Dont think I will ever change.
I had these 15 months ago and went with T5's which produced good results.
The shimmer and overall light quality is still hard to beat.

Thanks for sharing! Lovely!

 

[outerbank]

Here is a video of the Hamilton Cebu Sun 6 foot triple 400 watt 10000k MHs and 4 80 watt 460 actinic T5s. I love the light. More importantly so do the corals. Dave at Hamilton was very helpful.

 

[Coralsdaily]

I used to run MH. Things grow like a jungle, but not so much in the color department (at least not for me). Also, I think if I have MH in my fish room the room will be hot like an inferno. I am actually happpy with today's LED technology, allows coral to still get decent growth but definitely help the colors pop much better

 

[Graffiti Spot]

Here is a video of the Hamilton Cebu Sun 6 foot triple 400 watt 10000k MHs and 4 80 watt 460 actinic T5s. I love the light. More importantly so do the corals. Dave at Hamilton was very helpful.

Love the tank! I think the frags on the bottom that were not growing or looking good with the leds and are now coloring and growing says a lot.

 

[oreo54]

Love the tank! I think the frags on the bottom that were not growing or looking good with the leds and are now coloring and growing says a lot.

About what?
I see 1520 watts of photons that replaced ?????????????????

 

[outerbank]

About what?
I see 1520 watts of photons that replaced ?????????????????

ATI T5 hybrids with 8 39 watt T5s, 2 XR 15s, 2 XR 30s. Not impressed with the LEDs. M. Caps grow slowly like stacked plates rather than vase like. Shaded SPS corals brown on shaded area with thin odd shaped branches and poor polyp extension. I am into shape and growing colorful tips and borders as much as overall color. Slow growth of SPS and LPS for me, virtually no growth without the T5s. LPS not fully expanded. Clams and anemones did fairly well. I have a PAR meter and Par was anywhere from 200 on the bottom to 1,000+ near the surface. I've had a reef tank for over 25 years. The clowns in the tank are 27 years old. The anemones are the original and 2 surviving splits from H Magnifica bought over 13 years ago. I've used my share of lights over the years.

 

[Nick428]

I’m a new metal halide user and it’s only been 2 weeks with them . But man these things rock . Every coral in the aquarium is likening these new lights. Mostly SPS.
A few weeks ago I was useing a BB/t5 combo. It was ok . The T5s were carrying all the weight IMO. And lately a acropora was receding at the base . the water parameters were good . I found the BB was turned down to 50-60% so I turned it up to 100% things tank wide improved a little. Then I lowered the BB and all 3 t5s things improved a tiny bit . Then I was literally hanging a 4th T5 on the front glass ( blue plus ) then things got good. The recession of that acropora stopped.
then I did a tank upgrade 37-90gallons and it went very well. Didn’t lose or stress anything . Cool!!
Then I hooked up the halides 4 hours a day to start . And from the first day with halides the corals have all responded very well. I cool the aquarium with fans . And it’s been 7-9 days at 4 hours a day and growth is becoming obvious . Like my spongodes monti is growing 1/16-1/8” every day. Pink birdsnest is covered in new growth tips . Everything! also the light is so strong (250watt DE) they can heat up your fries LOL . Happy camper here .

Yea i miss my DE 6500k iwasaki 250watt. With actinic supplements there my favorite color spectrum. There just too hot, too much electricity.

 

[oreo54]

ATI T5 hybrids with 8 39 watt T5s, 2 XR 15s, 2 XR 30s. Not impressed with the LEDs. M. Caps grow slowly like stacked plates rather than vase like. Shaded SPS corals brown on shaded area with thin odd shaped branches and poor polyp extension. I am into shape and growing colorful tips and borders as much as overall color. Slow growth of SPS and LPS for me, virtually no growth without the T5s. LPS not fully expanded. Clams and anemones did fairly well. I have a PAR meter and Par was anywhere form 200 on the bottom to 1,000+ near the surface. I've had a reef tank for over 25 years. The clowns in the tank are 27 years old. The anemones are an original and 2 surviving splits H Magnifica bought over 13 years ago. I've used my share of lights over the years.

soo roughly 900 Watts of light.. and not accounting for any dimming of the LED's

your halides/t5s are a 50% increase in light..

IF that is your video or are you combining 2 unrelated experiences?

 

[outerbank]

soo roughly 900 Watts of light.. and not accounting for any dimming of the LED's

your halides/t5s are a 50% increase in light..

IF that is your video or are you combining 2 unrelated experiences?

One video. The frags are doing better. Too soon to eval growth, but I am basing growth I have seen in the past with MH/VHO set up. However, the M Caps are already growing more vase like. Tired of higher dKh and LEDs killing corals where I never had that issue in the past. Watts are based on power consumption and not brightness. None the less, the LED hybrid system cost much more and was much more of a hassle programming, buying more LEDs, buying Hybrid set up, etc. I'm not a fan. They are sleek, quiet, and have less heat though.

 

[oreo54]

One video. The frags are doing better. Too soon to eval growth, but I am basing growth I have seen in the past with MH/VHO set up. However, the M Caps are already growing more vase like. Tired of higher dKh and LEDs killing corals where I never had that issue in the past. Watts are based on power consumption and not brightness. None the less, the LED hybrid system cost much more and was much more of a hassle programming, buying more LEDs, buying Hybrid set up, etc. I'm not a fan. They are sleek, quiet, and have less heat though.

Granted but L/watt or photons/watt are fairly equiv across the 3 form factors..

All about, in a visual sense , 90 lumens/watt..
Newer LEDs are pushing 2x that..

Thanks for the clarificiation

Sometimes one gets

" I ran 2 black boxes (at full 104w and 60-ish lumens/watt)
and replaced them w / 2 250W MH's and WOW did they do better"
Worst part is the bb's are dimmed at least 25%.

Which is ridiculous to the point of DUUHH and just clouds the issue..

 

[xtian]

Since this is already up decided to ask here instead of starting a thread. Back in the day I used to run 14k phoenix on a PFO hqi ballast which I love. I recently picked up a couple of those old school big box ballast but they are M58s for SE. From research it seems bulbs are extremely limited for this ballast. It looks like I can only run Hamiltons on it. Can someone correct me if I'm wrong or know a site that has more selection please. TYIA

Link to ballast: http://www.innovativelights.com/pfo-61014.html

 

[X-37B]

Since this is already up decided to ask here instead of starting a thread. Back in the day I use to run 14k phoenix on a PFO hqi ballast which I love. I recently picked up a couple of those old school big box ballast but they are M58s for SE. From research it seems bulbs are extremely limited for this ballast. It looks like I can only run Hamiltons on it. Can someone correct me if I'm wrong or know a site that has more selection please. TYIA

Link to ballast: http://www.innovativelights.com/pfo-61014.html

Coral view has 14k single end bulbs or here on ebay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/174311536773

 

[A. grandis]

ATI T5 hybrids with 8 39 watt T5s, 2 XR 15s, 2 XR 30s. Not impressed with the LEDs. M. Caps grow slowly like stacked plates rather than vase like. Shaded SPS corals brown on shaded area with thin odd shaped branches and poor polyp extension. I am into shape and growing colorful tips and borders as much as overall color. Slow growth of SPS and LPS for me, virtually no growth without the T5s. LPS not fully expanded. Clams and anemones did fairly well. I have a PAR meter and Par was anywhere from 200 on the bottom to 1,000+ near the surface. I've had a reef tank for over 25 years. The clowns in the tank are 27 years old. The anemones are the original and 2 surviving splits from H Magnifica bought over 13 years ago. I've used my share of lights over the years.

I once had an ATI 6 bulbs (6X 54W= 324W) replaced by 2 black boxes (330W) and it was the worse move I've ever did in my life! You only can tell if you know better! Colony structure was absolutely terrible. The colors were only emphasized by the reflection of the blue diodes, while they were over the system. After about 6 months I replaced the LEDs by the same old T5s again. I then noticed the colonies actually changed/lost some of their natural pigments they had produced under T5s, while they were under those LEDs. After a week under T5s again they started to show an amazing transformation!! The electricity bill basically didn't change at all because I use chiller to maintain the temperature independent of what type of light I use. Went back to metal halides a while ago because I missed them so much and the results were obviously amazing. Reproduction, colors, colonial structure are even better than T5 only. Metal halides and T5s are the very best in captivity. The simplest test one can do is to offer a 150W LED fixture against a 150W halide bulb alone. The qualities of halides count, like spread (with the proper fixture), UV, IR and consistent spectrum, not PAR alone! Even a 20K halide bulb will explode of growth and colors against any "high PAR" LED fixture under the same circumstances!!! There is no comparison! Generally speaking LEDs are a fashion and market propaganda for a high priced tag product. An overpriced tag in most cases, to tell the truth. I'm glad your system is showing those amazing results! Happy for you!!! Heard nothing but great things about Hamilton fixtures, bulbs and customer service through the years! Watch your clams... they are in love with your halides!!! Right on!

 

[X-37B]

I once had an ATI 6 bulbs (6X 54W= 324W) replaced by 2 black boxes (330W) and it was the worse move I've ever did in my life! You only can tell if you know better! Colony structure was absolutely terrible. The colors were only emphasized by the reflection of the blue diodes, while they were over the system. After about 6 months I replaced the LEDs by the same old T5s again. I then noticed the colonies actually changed/lost some of their natural pigments they had produced under T5s, while they were under those LEDs. After a week under T5s again they started to show an amazing transformation!! The electricity bill basically didn't change at all because I use chiller to maintain the temperature independent of what type of light I use. Went back to metal halides a while ago because I missed them so much and the results were obviously amazing. Reproduction, colors, colonial structure are even better than T5 only. Metal halides and T5s are the very best in captivity. The simplest test one can do is to offer a 150W LED fixture against a 150W halide bulb alone. The qualities of halides count, like spread (with the proper fixture), UV, IR and consistent spectrum, not PAR alone! Even a 20K halide bulb will explode of growth and colors against any "high PAR" LED fixture under the same circumstances!!! There is no comparison! Generally speaking LEDs are a fashion and market propaganda for a high priced tag product. An overpriced tag in most cases, to tell the truth. I'm glad your system is showing those amazing results! Happy for you!!! Heard nothing but great things about Hamilton fixtures, bulbs and customer service through the years! Watch your clams... they are in love with your halides!!! Right on!

I had a black box on my 18" cubed nano and it was ok.
Swithced to a hamilton 150 watt. No comparison, imo.
Judge for yourself.

 

[A. grandis]

I had a black box on my 18" cubed nano and it was ok.
Swithced to a hamilton 150 watt. No comparison, imo.
Judge for yourself.

We really can't tell by pictures. If you look pictures of my system you will think I have "brown zoas" under Ushio 14Ks. Much worse to the eyes look the Iwasaki 65Ks, which in reality is the one of the very best bulbs to produce natural pigments (not reflection), growth and colony structure of all halide bulbs IME. Coral growers use them to grow their corals producing those "real pigment" so when their buyers place those frags under their LEDs they go crazy... but unfortunately they will change over time under LEDs. In reality things change a lot. Also, like I've said... the reflection of the blue diodes make it look "richer" to the eyes in some cases, and we tend to appreciate that a bit more. The fact that those diodes over your tank reflect their individual colors and look better to our eyes doesn't necessarily mean the corals are actually producing colorful pigments and are growing better than metal halide/T5s.
But we can't discuss personal taste, right? I just published my opinion/ experience. We all like different visual results. Main thing is that if you like them and you're happy please don't change. In this case it's a matter of opinion.

 

[oreo54]

Errrr.people. Those black boxes don't
ever list REAL wattage just theoretical.

 

[X-37B]

We really can't tell by pictures. If you look pictures of my system you will think I have "brown zoas" under Ushio 14Ks. Much worse to the eyes look the Iwasaki 65Ks, which in reality is the one of the very best bulbs to produce natural pigments (not reflection), growth and colony structure of all halide bulbs IME. Coral growers use them to grow their corals producing those "real pigment" so when their buyers place those frags under their LEDs they go crazy... but unfortunately they will change over time under LEDs. In reality things change a lot. Also, like I've said... the reflection of the blue diodes make it look "richer" to the eyes in some cases, and we tend to appreciate that a bit more. The fact that those diodes over your tank reflect their individual colors and look better to our eyes doesn't necessarily mean the corals are actually producing colorful pigments and are growing better than metal halide/T5s.
But we can't discuss personal taste, right? I just published my opinion/ experience. We all like different visual results. Main thing is that if you like them and you're happy please don't change. In this case it's a matter of opinion.

I meant I like the MH quality look better. Never really cared for the black box look. But I agree it is personal choice.

 

[A. grandis]

I meant I like the MH quality look better. Never really cared for the black box look. But I agree it is personal choice.

I'm sorry I missed your point in that message, and that was because the LED picture actually looks more colorful than the halide picture. The main reason could be because the camera captures the spill from the halide fixture while the LEDs are projected straight downward preventing the camera to misread the image. But that was great to illustrate here how the pictures can sometimes deceive the actual results. It's great to see so many people publishing their great results with halides.

 

[Justjim]

I used to run reeflux 12k 250 watt bulbs and loved them. The only issue was I felt they died a lot faster than others. Now I’m running Hamilton 14k 400 SE bulbs and I wish they were just a LITTLE more blue. Are the Ushio bulbs more or less blue than the Hamilton and how are the 400 watt 12k reeflux?

 

[Bpb]

I used to run reeflux 12k 250 watt bulbs and loved them. The only issue was I felt they died a lot faster than others. Now I’m running Hamilton 14k 400 SE bulbs and I wish they were just a LITTLE more blue. Are the Ushio bulbs more or less blue than the Hamilton and how are the 400 watt 12k reeflux?

The reeflux 12k bulb seems to be one of the most revered bulbs in this hobby’s history. Wish I’d have been able to get ahold of some. Surprised no smart person was ever able to figure out where they were sourced from