My second Red Sea Reefer seam failure.

[Ziggy17]

To quote White Snake, “Here we go again on my own”……. So just cleaning the glass and noticed the unmistakable rectangle box occurring on the middle bottom seam. This was the G2+ replacement they sent me less than a year ago to replace the seam failure I had on the 2 year old G1. Thank goodness I’ve got the new WB 150 up and running, just waiting to transfer fish and coral over in the next few days. I was originally going to wait a few weeks to move the coral over, but this moves up my schedule.

I’ll reach out to Red Sea and go through the warranty process again.

I can change my signature to “double Red Sea seam failure survivor” now….

One more musical reference. “Tick tick boom”. Well hopefully not

 

[BryanM]

So sorry, I’d run far away, as I did.

I am now a water box owner.

 

[Nibs]

Why anyone continues to purchase red sea tanks is beyond me

 

[Ziggy17]

So sorry, I’d run far away, as I did.

I am now a water box owner.

I did. WB 150.4

 

[Ziggy17]

Why anyone continues to purchase red sea tanks is beyond me

When the new one comes in, I’ll be keeping it in the crate and selling it an unopened system. I’ll still sell it at 50% of retail to move it quickly. I just wonder if they will send another G2 or a G3….

 

[Biokabe]

Why anyone continues to purchase red sea tanks is beyond me

Because most people who own tanks - even relatively expensive tanks like Red Sea - don't do a whole lot of research beyond what their LFS offers. They go in, see the nice pretty rimless tank, see the premium price tag, and decide that it must be good, how could they sell them if they weren't?

And despite the issues, most Red Sea tanks do not experience seam failures. It's only after one fails that someone gets online, starts researching it and realizes that there's a systemic issue with tanks failing at far above the rate that they should.

Most people who keep aquariums do not spend a lot of time researching them and posting on old-school Internet forums about them.

 

[gbroadbridge]

To quote White Snake, “Here we go again on my own”……. So just cleaning the glass and noticed the unmistakable rectangle box occurring on the middle bottom seam. This was the G2+ replacement they sent me less than a year ago to replace the seam failure I had on the 2 year old G1. Thank goodness I’ve got the new WB 150 up and running, just waiting to transfer fish and coral over in the next few days. I was originally going to wait a few weeks to move the coral over, but this moves up my schedule.

I’ll reach out to Red Sea and go through the warranty process again.

I can change my signature to “double Red Sea seam failure survivor” now….

One more musical reference. “Tick tick boom”. Well hopefully not

I'd be getting my money back but I guess you don't have that option.

 

[Tripod1404]

Same thing happened to me. Sean in the first tank was failing, I was able to get it warranty replaced before it started to leak. Second tank also developed the same issue and I replaced with a custom acrylic tank. Both Red Sea tanks lasted for about 2 years.

 

[DHill6]

Mine found its happy place at the dump.
I wouldn’t even try a second one, I ran far…straight to Cade

 

[BeanAnimal]

And despite the issues, most Red Sea tanks do not experience seam failures.

That is highly speculative.

 

[Ziggy17]

Why anyone continues to purchase red sea tanks is beyond me

Because most people who own tanks - even relatively expensive tanks like Red Sea - don't do a whole lot of research beyond what their LFS offers. They go in, see the nice pretty rimless tank, see the premium price tag, and decide that it must be good, how could they sell them if they weren't?

And despite the issues, most Red Sea tanks do not experience seam failures. It's only after one fails that someone gets online, starts researching it and realizes that there's a systemic issue with tanks failing at far above the rate that they should.

Most people who keep aquariums do not spend a lot of time researching them and posting on old-school Internet forums about them.

While I cannot comment for anyone but myself, i would agree with this statement , but with an asterisk. For myself, I was a freshie for 30 years. Never had a seam issue with any of my tanks, nor did I know anyone who had a blowout. Which is quite a statement to make over a 30 year span. So when making the leap into salt, I wouldn’t have thought to look up Red Sea and investigate possible seam issues. Based on my personal experience, it didn’t once cross my mind. And in my world, R2R wasn’t a thing. I didn’t learn about it until I was a few months into my reef journey.

Now I do agree with your point, I can say for me, it wasn’t out of negligence, but more blind faith. I also note, you haven’t claimed negligence in your post, but the post does have that vibe.

Anyhow. My WB looks great and happily awaiting the tank transfer. Hoping the tick tick boom holds off for a few more days :)

 

[Biokabe]

Now I do agree with your point, I can say for me, it wasn’t out of negligence, but more blind faith. I also note, you haven’t claimed negligence in your post, but the post does have that vibe.

If it gave a vibe of accusing anyone (including yourself) of negligence, I apologize, because that wasn't my intent. It was more that I wanted to remind people that most people - even most saltwater reef keepers - are not passionate enough that they're spending hours researching the ins and outs of manufacturers in a very niche hobby, manufacturing an important but still niche product, especially before they spend the money on a tank.

That's just not how most people operate. Most people trust the stores they frequent to not sell them products that are known to fail. Generally that trust is rewarded, because most products don't fail. Having products fail is a great way to go out of business. Unfortunately some companies exploit that trust to get away with doing less than they could, writing off the losses as the cost of doing business rather than spending the money to do it properly. Famously, Ford took that same approach with the notorious Pinto car.

I don't blame any reef keeper who bought a Red Sea tank, especially if they didn't know about the problems. I do blame Red Sea for their less-than-stellar approach, both to those who suffered losses from it and for not doing a better job of addressing the obviously faulty manufacturing processes that cause the issue to begin with.

 

[W31Olds]

That is highly speculative.

Not speculative at all. Do the Math. Even without RS Sales Data they probably sell thousands of Tanks Worldwide every year and on the forums maybe have 100 failures a year if even that. Still high and unacceptable. My LFS is an Authorized RS Dealer and they don't seem to push them much at all and seem to prefer Planet. Anyway, RS fixed all the problems with their recent improvements. 

 

[BeanAnimal]

Not speculative at all. Do the Math.

It is purely speculative. You can't "do the math" because you don't have any of the numbers required.

You have to guess at the number of tanks sold. You have to then guess how many failures get reported to the medium that you are tabulating from and how many go unreported.


The ONLY thing that we can say
without speculation is that the publicly reported failure rate for RS tanks over the last 5 years appears to be overwhelmingly larger than the sum total reports of all other brands combined over several decades.

 

[UncommonSense]

I just wonder if they will send another G2 or a G3….

It’ll be another G2, unless you want ~50% of MSRP as credit on a G3, and pay the difference… at least that was effectively the response to another R2R user whom asked RS this question…

 

[Hakon]

If it gave a vibe of accusing anyone (including yourself) of negligence, I apologize, because that wasn't my intent. It was more that I wanted to remind people that most people - even most saltwater reef keepers - are not passionate enough that they're spending hours researching the ins and outs of manufacturers in a very niche hobby, manufacturing an important but still niche product, especially before they spend the money on a tank.

That's just not how most people operate. Most people trust the stores they frequent to not sell them products that are known to fail. Generally that trust is rewarded, because most products don't fail. Having products fail is a great way to go out of business. Unfortunately some companies exploit that trust to get away with doing less than they could, writing off the losses as the cost of doing business rather than spending the money to do it properly. Famously, Ford took that same approach with the notorious Pinto car.

I don't blame any reef keeper who bought a Red Sea tank, especially if they didn't know about the problems. I do blame Red Sea for their less-than-stellar approach, both to those who suffered losses from it and for not doing a better job of addressing the obviously faulty manufacturing processes that cause the issue to begin with.

To be perfectly fair even if you do do the research you'll find horror stories for every manufacturer, as I recently found. I bought a fiji cube 38 AIO and I found a couple accounts of bad design in the overflow box (using acrylic with silicone adhesive) but made the decision that forwarned is forarmed and I know how to fix that with bracing. I found issues with practically every manufacturer I looked at, at the end I can only conclude that there are defects everywhere and no one is perfect, the best I can do is catalogue potential issues and weigh them against each other.

 

[Maho.B]

Not jumping into the Red Sea is a bad company debate, but asking about the specific symptom. I have a Red Sea (2 years old) and I do notice one seam has a more "cloudy" looking area to it. Is that the sign of a seam failure? I'm just trying to get a sense of what a Red Sea failing seam is before a full on panic. Which I not need lol. Thanks

 

[UncommonSense]

Not jumping into the Red Sea is a bad company debate, but asking about the specific symptom. I have a Red Sea (2 years old) and I do notice one seam has a more "cloudy" looking area to it. Is that the sign of a seam failure? I'm just trying to get a sense of what a Red Sea failing seam is before a full on panic. Which I not need lol. Thanks

I covered this topic a few months back!

The “cloud” gray areas within the black silicone can be cause for concern…

— use a bright point light source, like a phone light or strong flashlight to help you inspect the seam(s) in question from various angles… if possible, examine the silicone seam(s) through both adjoining glass panes for signs of silicone peeling away from glass! (A “bubble”, often with a mirrored finish under ambient lighting)

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/black-silicone-can-hide-failing-seams.1113164/

 

[Ziggy17]

I'd be getting my money back but I guess you don't have that option.

If it gave a vibe of accusing anyone (including yourself) of negligence, I apologize, because that wasn't my intent. It was more that I wanted to remind people that most people - even most saltwater reef keepers - are not passionate enough that they're spending hours researching the ins and outs of manufacturers in a very niche hobby, manufacturing an important but still niche product, especially before they spend the money on a tank.

That's just not how most people operate. Most people trust the stores they frequent to not sell them products that are known to fail. Generally that trust is rewarded, because most products don't fail. Having products fail is a great way to go out of business. Unfortunately some companies exploit that trust to get away with doing less than they could, writing off the losses as the cost of doing business rather than spending the money to do it properly. Famously, Ford took that same approach with the notorious Pinto car.

I don't blame any reef keeper who bought a Red Sea tank, especially if they didn't know about the problems. I do blame Red Sea for their less-than-stellar approach, both to those who suffered losses from it and for not doing a better job of addressing the obviously faulty manufacturing processes that cause the issue to begin with.

Couldn’t have said it better myself.

Funny, I remember the pinto quite well. I ever saw one explode, but I’d never take a ride in one, even if I was hitchhiking…

 

[Jungle Blue]

Because most people who own tanks - even relatively expensive tanks like Red Sea - don't do a whole lot of research beyond what their LFS offers. They go in, see the nice pretty rimless tank, see the premium price tag, and decide that it must be good, how could they sell them if they weren't?

And despite the issues, most Red Sea tanks do not experience seam failures. It's only after one fails that someone gets online, starts researching it and realizes that there's a systemic issue with tanks failing at far above the rate that they should.

Most people who keep aquariums do not spend a lot of time researching them and posting on old-school Internet forums about them.

Like cars with known recalls and engine failures, at least the seats are red. +5 speed