Poll: QT method - Proactive, Passive, I don't quarantine?

[NC2WA]

I selected Other as I, myself, don't QT but all my fish are QT from online vendors. I made sure their protocol would be the same as if I QT myself. Minimum 2 wks with Copper Power plus PraziPro for flukes and then medicate the food. I have wait 3 to 4 weeks for some. I don't mind paying the extra money as it saves space and time for me.

 

[mfinn]

So in the process of starting to QT fish soon, ive learned a ton here especially from Jay's QT protocol that is the main reason im starting to QT.

However I also am unsure if I want to expose every fish to copper and prazi by taking a proactive approach, anything and everything goes through the treatment which also seems slightly inhumane towards the fish however i understand its for the greater good. Or should I just observe them passively for a couple of months and unless I see signs of disease start treatment.

Would love to hear how everyone does it, why they do it that way and how has it worked out for them!

Had two outbreaks over a 40 year period.
First, wiped out every fish. Used a non copper remedy.
Second took 8-9 out of 24. Had a tank on hand and was able to get the qt tank set up in a few hours after seeing the first issues. Had the fish all moved in a couple more hours, and in a half dose of copper and 4 hours later full copper.
After the first incident I qt'd every fish, but neglected to do the same for corals. Learned that hard lesson.
Now I use vendors that do full medicated quarantine.

 

[jonelder68]

QT is cheaper than replacing fish so I QT amongst many other reasons.

 

[serval]

I voted proactive, but I pay for others to QT. I use High Tide Aquatics, Marine Collectors, and Dr. Reef.

 

[huthain]

I voted proactive, but I pay for others to QT. I use High Tide Aquatics, Marine Collectors, and Dr. Reef.

Wish we had options like that here

 

[huthain]

I think my method is more aggressive than Jays.

Pre-match salinity in cycled qt > 30m peroxide dip > 2.50ppm copper power (21 days) + prazi x 3 doses every 7 days + 14 doses of metronidazole every other day (mostly to ensure brooklynellas gone over intestinal related stuff) + 2 weeks of observation after everything is completed.

I would suggest a slightly lower level on copper if you don't have an ato set up though since you don't want to be in the upper level of copper otherwise.

After treatment for the fish is done, I'll fully clean the qt and restart it for the next possible batch of desired fish.

For corals (they get dipped) and inverts, they get thrown into a tank without fish for 3 months prior to introduction into the proper display.


Keep in mind the most important thing above all else (particularly for fish) is having a well cycled qt with plenty of biomedia that's capable of handling the intended fish load (I use multiple pre-cycled sponge filters + 2 large hang ons on a 40g) along with prepared water for water changes (ideally pre-loaded with matching copper when needed)

Sorry i noticed i said fish and coral i meant inserts, would it be feasible to have the same QT tank for coral and inverts

 

[Ernie Mccracken]

I have long thought that the next big boom in the hobby will happen when/if tissue cultured coral becomes commercially available. It's pretty grim to consider that 100% of wild caught livestock and 99% of cultured livestock is full of nasties that virtually guarantees a huge die off in a matter of months.

This is the biggest reason few of our tanks survive beyond 2-3 years and why most people leave the hobby in general. Someone needs to figure out a better way because "just QT everything" doesn't work for 95% of hobbyists.

Even multi million dollar reef setups and famously careful public aquaria are all full of flatworms, vermitids, and evil bacteria that mysteriously causes massive fish die offs.

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

I buy my fish post qt from TSM aquatics. I pick up as it is an hour away. They do copper and prazi

 

[C_AWOL]

Sounds intense! How often do you water change throughout this and how big are the waterchanges? Also would it work to have the same QT tank for fish and corals? I assume they just go through the same process of leave them there and observe right

It depends on a few factors but weekly 30-50% minimum with temp + salinity + copper matched. If other medications are used such as kanamycin or ammonia issues are present then adjust the frequency and quantity (can do 100% with everything matched if needed) accordingly.

As far as using the same qt for fish and coral you mean after one or the other is fully completed and not together? If so then it should be fine as long as it's well cleaned between uses and you re-cycle the tank.

Frankly though, a coral qt is best left running to iron out the ugly phase and establish enough maturity to stamp out dinos though which is why a separate one is more ideal.

 

[C_AWOL]

Sorry i noticed i said fish and coral i meant inserts, would it be feasible to have the same QT tank for coral and inverts

Yes inverts + coral simultaneously is safe to do. Just start counting the days from the very last addition.

 

[Mebbid]

I've read a lot on various perspectives, and I understand where you're coming from, as I had the same thoughts. Over the course of my research, I have seen countless times (to be less hyperbolic, I've read dozens and dozens of accounts, with multiple more every week) where people had a tank crash due to parasites (velvet in particular) or lost fish due to ich, velvet, brook, etc. It wasn't just stuff I've read online; back when I kept only freshwater tanks, I was given a used tank from a guy who had spent over $10,000 on his reef only to lose it all in a velvet-related tank crash.

I've decided for me, it would be a non-negotiable if I would spend money on this hobby, I would quarantine everything. What I do is outlined below, if it is helpful. Keep in mind I'm still new to reefing (<1 year) so how this works out in the long term is yet to be seen.

Corals, inverts, live rock, etc. go in a fishless frag tank for 77 days.

For fish I'm using Jay Hemdal's QT method of 30 days in copper (2.25 ppm) with three rounds of prazi powder. Public aquariums use copper and have fish live 15+ years, anecdotally. So this suggests to me that fish can live a long time even after prophylactic copper.

I was really intrigued by the Serious Reefs QT method (15-days in elevated copper [2.65 ppm]) with 100% water changes every 3 days, and prazi baths periodically. Ultimately I decided on the method with the longer track record. Part of the decision was I'd rather not disturb the fish by catching them every 3 days (which would effectively simulate a predatory attack every 3 days, thus causing acute stress 5+ times during QT).

I find the 30 day QT, usually one fish at a time, also forces me to stagger my DT introductions in a disciplined manner, which helps the tank adjust to increasingly higher bioload over time.

Ultimately, quarantining is your decision, and is about your own risk tolerance. Hope these thoughts are helpful!

I've been doing TTM quarantining for my fish. I found that using a clear specimen container results in a relatively stress free capture of fish vs a net. Then I acclimate it to the new tank, dump most of the water out, and then dump the fish in the new tank.

 

[vittpsu21]

I understand completely, I had a big chiller when I had erectus seahorses and we did not have AC. Finally we got AC when we decided it was cheaper to have whole house AC than to run the chiller!


You are welcome! Before the January disease incident, I had not had a major incident in 25 years. I maybe would lose one fish here or there in the first week of bringing it home but it was seldom. A lot of the fish I had were transfers from my 10 year old 56g column tank last Sept and they had been with me for 5 years or more. When I got the 75g I was excited to get more fish but resisted for 4 months so the tank could settle (even though I used all my old rock from that tank and its 30g sump). I thought the tank was ready by January but the newness probably contributed. Adding 7 new fish in 2 waves I am sure contributed as well. I played a risky game foolishly and my pets paid the price. I am fortunate that I still had 10 fish survive and for that I am truly thankful!

For me a QT was easy because when I set up the 75g I was toying with having a sump so I put the 20g high tank in the cabinet before setting the 75g aquarium on the stand. However, I decided to simplify this tank and not have a sump but use a canister filter instead but the 20g tank was in place and is perfect size wise for a QT. It has live rock and I have old artificial decor so fish can hide if they want. I had old lights and pumps so I was set. I can even do water changes from the 75g DT into the 20g so new fish are already acclimated to the display water. And I only treat fish if I observe disease. Again, I must say this isn't a guarantee but it no doubt reduces the chances of a bad outbreak of disease greatly and the UV sterilizer even reduces the chances more. I plan to only use the UV when new fish are being introduced or for bad algae.

which local shop? I have had a decent bit of success with elhmers and wet pets, I still QT but they rarely have anything. Though I do lose quite a few from wet pets in the first weeks (they do run UV there also)

 

[ReefGeezer]

There was a time where I QT'd everything. But I voted other. I buy my fish only from on-line vendors I trust to have good quarantine processes. I'm not sure that their quarantine processes work. What I do think happens is that the vendor absorbs the risks associated with newly captive fish. I think this is valuable because most deaths and decease outbreaks occur in the first few weeks of captivity while stress levels are high. I think if a fish makes it through that high stress period, it will likely survive in an established tank.

I have QT equipment and sometimes use an observation period for fish that are sensitive or picky eaters, i.e. Copperbands, just to make sure they are eating.

 

[huthain]

There was a time where I QT'd everything. But I voted other. I buy my fish only from on-line vendors thprocesses.at I trust to have good quaranteen processes.

Gorgeous hawkfish in your profile picture

 

[vlangel]

which local shop? I have had a decent bit of success with elhmers and wet pets, I still QT but they rarely have anything. Though I do lose quite a few from wet pets in the first weeks (they do run UV there also)

It's in Greensburg and they are brand new, R & B Aquariums. 3 of the 4 fish did very well, (a Bangaii cardinal disappeared day 2 in QT and I never saw it again). I have not had luck with lfs Bangaii's no matter where I buy them. Their fish looked very good in their tanks. I too have shopped at Elmers (often) and Wet Pets, (a little).

 

[mattgsa]

I don't quarantine fish myself. It's not because I don't think quarantine is important. It's because I know very little about fish diseases and treatments, and getting it wrong can be just as deadly as any parasite.

Instead, I spend the extra money and buy only from vendors that proactively quarantine and treat their fish, such as Marine Collectors and TSM Aquatics. Fish disease identification and treatment is something that takes years of experience and study, and that's expertise I simply don't have.

Taking this approach has worked well for me. I've never had a disease outbreak in my tank. This aquarium has never seen ich, flukes, or any other known fish parasites, and I believe a big part of that is starting with properly quarantined fish from trusted sources.