This would be my concern too for any product that contains everything in a single bottle. That's why I've never used them. I went straight for the moonshine products and program. My tanks have improved beyond my expectations with the moonshine products. I had high tin due to a rusting float in my RO/DI storage container. So I did a number of water changes to get the tin down, which also diluted my trace levels. I could see a negative change in my corals. I'm waiting on getting my ATI results back so I can make the corrections and get my tank back to the way it was.
Reef moonshiners program
- Thread starter cedwards04
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KJoFan
Valuable Member
I did an ICP test...a couple months ago, or maybe it was back in June and everything but a couple things were all in line at that time. So, will be interesting to see a comparison now a few months down the road with continued AFR use during that time.
If it turns out to be more of an imbalance then I'll reconsider probably.
minus9
5000 Club Member
That's the great thing about RM is there are no system requirements, you simply adjust to your tanks needs. It's rather simple and easy to follow. It's like a balling or Triton method with precise control. Also, Andre will personally guide you through any issues that may come up. One on one support is stellar.
KJoFan
Valuable Member
Definitely. I only have a 50g tank so my initial supply should last forever. Though I do wonder about shelf life of the product in cases where it will take a lifetime to go through it.
Looking forward to looking deeper into it once my new ICP results come in.
minus9
5000 Club Member
I think they'll be fine. In the meantime, if you haven't read Andre's handbook, it's worth a read (a couple times actually) and it's free. If I haven't mentioned it before, buy his color guide for a few bucks and give that a read too. Also, he's more active on his FB group, which is where you would contact him with any issues, so it's worth it to join the group.
doodledreads
Active Member
Anyone one try this with All for reef? It already supposed to have the trace elements; can I still try Moonshiners for anything lacking? Or would that be overkill?
KJoFan
Valuable Member
I have the book and have read it and also have the calculator to mess around with. I'm also a member of the FB group, so I've been watching this for awhile just never been in a position with the success of a tank where I've thought it'd be worth it/beneficial to give it a try. But, my tank is thriving and sps are taking off, so I'm looking into it now for that extra boost.
IKD
2500 Club Member
I’ve done some initial readings on this and I hear how great Andre is, but it makes me wonder what happens if Andre becomes unavailable or his supply chain is interrupted? Is he the only place to buy the elements? Or can all of them be substituted for other brands?
danieyella
unfriendly local swamp witch
Yes a few of us. Continuing AFR will depend on your individual system. My tank wasn't utilizing the trace in AFR consistently across the board, so some of the elements were significantly elevated, while some were very low. I took my AFR offline and switched calcium/alk/mag to separate versions. I just send off my second test to see if the significantly elevated things have dropped or not since discontinuing. If not, I'll need to look elsewhere. A few people have continued using AFR with no problems.
doodledreads
Active Member
That makes sense. I might have to look into this a bit more.
danieyella
unfriendly local swamp witch
I don't have a lot of SPS, but the growth in 25 days for what I do have (as well as my gorgonians) is definitely noticeable -- and that's just starting up and still having a lot unbalanced in the tank.
Jon Warner
Well-Known Member
What are the relative concentrations in those 500ml bottles?
minus9
5000 Club Member
Andre has two versions of the elements, classic and nano. The nano versions are the dailies, like iron, cobalt, chromium and manganese. These are dosed at 1mL per 100g. If you were to dose the normal/classic version, I believe it would be close to 0.05mL to 0.1mL, but I could be wrong?What are the relative concentrations in those 500ml bottles?
Download the guide, it's free and he describes the difference.
Currently I'm only dosing the ones listed above (nano versions) along with two drops of vanadium and one drop of iodide daily. I dose about 12mL of Rubidium once a month and only have to make a few corrective doses once a month after an ICP test. I've already developed a small trend with some of the elements, so hopefully I can make those adjustments without performing an ICP test, but time will tell?
BOWHUNTER4250
Active Member
Are you still using this system ? and if so can you post some pics maybe of beofre and after ?
Fishinwall
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the reply
I just have a 65 gal with 20 sump
I just hope I know what I’m doing when it comes to dosing.
do you use no pox too?
I’m planning on going with kalk to get stability in check.
BOWHUNTER4250
Active Member
How do you mean as far as you hope you know what your doing when dosing ? Im sorry but correct me please if im wrong .... didnt you have a total system of 300 gal. ????
I did use NoPox for a few weeks because i have a problem with GHA ... used the NoPox for a bit and that started to go away but stopped because my corals looked pale ..... started adding Dr. Tim's Eco Balance and the GHA is slowly receding ... lets hope
i also dose Kalkwasser directly into my sump and it is not added thru my top off as it is a separate bucket
Fishinwall
Well-Known Member
Hi. No that wasn’t me. This is the only reef tank I’ve had. I do have a build thread on here but I haven’t updated it in a very long time.
I really like biogest. Not sure how it compares to eco balance. But Biogest seems to help keep my sandbed clear of cyano.
I plan to do the same with my Kalk. Cool.
Tjm23slo
Active Member
Each element is different. Vanadium is same as Triton. You could pull down the "Calculator" and enter 100g and a 1 unit correction and see what it would take for each element to raise 1ppm/100g.What are the relative concentrations in those 500ml bottles?
Bromide for example is ~7ml/100G to raise 1milligram/l.
Boron is ~95ml/100G to raise 1milligram/l .
Barium is ~4ml/100G to raise 1 microgram/l.
Manganese is ~4ml /100G (Classic) ~10ml/100G (Nano) to raise 1 microgram/l.
McPuff
Valuable Member
I'm planning to start using RM method as soon as I get my ATI results back. Just sent them this week so it will be a couple more I'm sure. Have a friend that is using the method and getting really good results. I figured I'd give it a try since I don't do many water changes anyway. This is probably the reason I've had some issues with a few large colonies over the past 6 months. Excited to see what happens.
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