Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy....I am beyond my chemistry skills here..

I switched to your new NaOH formula which included Magnesium. My observations after a month are that I have certainly had a pH boost of about 0.1 which is enough to make me happy. Its amazing how much better 7.9 to 8.0 looks than 7.8 to 7.9...LOL

But my Magnesium (which was too low around 1150) has gone to close to 1500, it maxes out my Salifert titration.

Is the new post you have above at start of this thread the original recipe 1 but with NaOH in the Alk part.....moving the Mag to a third solution dosed independently or have I got myself confused...?

Thanks..........John

That must be an error of some sort.

This recipe is just a revision of my 3 part with sodium hydroxide. The other thread is a revision of Jim Welsh's true two part recipe.

I assume you mean this recipe:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/new-diy-two-part-recipes-with-higher-ph-boost.344500/

The calcium part in that recipe contains about 8,300 mg/L of magnesium (when made correctly).

To boost a tank from 1150 ppm magnesium to 1500 ppm magnesium (350 ppm) would require the addition of 4.2% of the tank volume in additive, so you'd have to have added 4.2 gallons to a 100 gallon tank. I assume you did not do that? (if you did, salinity would rise a lot and magnesium would decline when you returned it to normal).

 

[miyags]

How about this for cal.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

It might be OK, but I do not know how pure it might be (the 96% isn't really useful for that purpose).

What I can tell is that it is not calcium chloride dihydrate (which is about 77% calcium chloride), so if you use it, use about 20% less than the recipe calls for.

 

[Acorral]

MY DIY two part recipes are 46 times more potent than saturated limewater. So you need about 100 mL of each part each day.

You can use this calculator and the entry for Randy's Recipe #1:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chem_calc3.html

And after calculating based on recipe 1 use only 16% of that using the new formula?

In terms of overall ph rise of the tank, i assume it would be better to use this new sodium hidroxide formula over recipe 1 and kalk right?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

And after calculating based on recipe 1 use only 16% of that using the new formula?

In terms of overall ph rise of the tank, i assume it would be better to use this new sodium hidroxide formula over recipe 1 and kalk right?

The hydroxide recipe has the same pH boost per unit of alkalinity and calcium as limewater, but is not limited in daily dose by evaporation.

I'm not sure I understand the 16%. It is 46 x more potent, so dose 2.2% as much as the limewater daily dose, or in your case, 100 mL.

 

[Acorral]

The hydroxide recipe has the same pH boost per unit of alkalinity and calcium as limewater, but is not limited in daily dose by evaporation.

I'm not sure I understand the 16%. It is 46 x more potent, so dose 2.2% as much as the limewater daily dose, or in your case, 100 mL.

Ok I got it...

Any disadvantage of switching from kalkwasser to hidroxide and Calcium Chloride in terms of long term effect? Cl or S accumulation?

 

[Myka]

Ok I got it...

Any disadvantage of switching from kalkwasser to hidroxide and Calcium Chloride in terms of long term effect? Cl or S accumulation?

If you read the threads, Randy and Jim have kindly done all the math for us so that there is no long-term disadvantage like you describe - that's the whole point.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Ok I got it...

Any disadvantage of switching from kalkwasser to hidroxide and Calcium Chloride in terms of long term effect? Cl or S accumulation?

There is a rise in salinity over time, so that is a potential drawback.

 

[Acorral]

There is a rise in salinity over time, so that is a potential drawback.

Thanks a lot Randy

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thanks a lot Randy

You're welcome.

I would add that a consequence of rising salinity is that, when corrected back to normal, it will lower everything, and so elements not in the two part, such as potassium (depending on how much is there as an impurity in the calcium additive, where my original recipe there was quite a lot in Dowflake) may decline.

Happy reefing.

 

[Myka]

I would add that a consequence of rising salinity is that, when corrected back to normal, it will lower everything, and so elements not in the two part, such as potassium (depending on how much is there as an impurity in the calcium additive, where my original recipe there was quite a lot in Dowflake) may decline.

That's not any different than any other type of 2 or 3 part dosing though, or even balling method.

@Randy Holmes-Farley did you see my question about trace elements on the previous page?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That's not any different than any other type of 2 or 3 part dosing though, or even balling method.

@Randy Holmes-Farley did you see my question about trace elements on the previous page?

The salinity rise, yes, but a well designed commercial two part or balling will have ingredients like potassium and fluoride in them so that after correcting for the salinity rise, the levels are right back where they were.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Randy, is there any reason the Sodium hydroxide solution can't be mixed with the typical trace elements that are added to the alkalinity part? I'll play the game provided I can still add in the Fauna Marin Balling Light Trace 3.

While there may be some issues that aren’t occurring to me, most things that go into a carbonate part can be put into a hydroxide part. [emoji3]

 

[Myka]

While there may be some issues that aren’t occurring to me, most things that go into a carbonate part can be put into a hydroxide part. [emoji3]

Great, thank you. That's what I was thinking too. I ordered up some hydroxide, I'll give it a go.

 

[Finhead]

Great, thank you. That's what I was thinking too. I ordered up some hydroxide, I'll give it a go.

@Myka where did you order the Hydroxide from? I was thinking about trying it out, I'm in Alberta BTW.

 

[Myka]

@Finhead I ordered 1 pound for $29. Certainly costs a heck of a lot more than bicarb, but it's only a "trial size".
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B06W57NL8S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Here are some other options for "sodium hydroxide food grade".
https://www.amazon.ca/s/ref=nb_sb_n...ps&field-keywords=sodium+hydroxide+food+grade

 

[Finhead]

@Finhead I ordered 1 pound for $29. Certainly costs a heck of a lot more than bicarb, but it's only a "trial size".
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B06W57NL8S/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Here are some other options for "sodium hydroxide food grade".
https://www.amazon.ca/s/ref=nb_sb_n...ps&field-keywords=sodium+hydroxide+food+grade

Thanks, I found this place but shipping is a bit. It'll still work out way cheaper than Amazon which I already found for that $$.
https://www.voyageursoapandcandle.com/Lye_Sodium_Hydroxide_p/62190.htm

 

[DaveRaz]

MY DIY two part recipes are 46 times more potent than saturated limewater. So you need about 100 mL of each part each day.

You can use this calculator and the entry for Randy's Recipe #1:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chem_calc3.html

Hold on now...stop the clock....stop the clock. haha I just diving in here but I need to clarify something.

I dose 6800 ml / day of saturated kalkwasser per day (just barely under my evaporation threshold). I'm to understand that I can dose sodium hydroxide at ~151ml / day and ditch the kalk? (And maintain my PH 7.9 to 8.2) Obviously I would also need to dose the same amount of calcium chloride dehydrate. Going this route could save my dosing pumps a lot of daily work! I use kalk due to the ph benefits... This is a game changer if so!

Right now in order to satisfy current uptake, I am supplementing the 6800ml of kalk with 10ml 2 part.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hold on now...stop the clock....stop the clock. haha I just diving in here but I need to clarify something.

I dose 6800 ml / day of saturated kalkwasser per day (just barely under my evaporation threshold). I'm to understand that I can dose sodium hydroxide at ~151ml / day and ditch the kalk? (And maintain my PH 7.9 to 8.2) Obviously I would also need to dose the same amount of calcium chloride dehydrate. Going this route could save my dosing pumps a lot of daily work! I use kalk due to the ph benefits... This is a game changer if so!

Right now in order to satisfy current uptake, I am supplementing the 6800ml of kalk with 10ml 2 part.

Yes, but you still want to dose the hydroxide slowly or spread out over many doses, as you do with limewater. A times set to turn on many tiems a day for short periods is a good idea, if you can dose small enough amounts.

 

[DaveRaz]

Woohoo! I'll dose 75x /day, 2ml every 19 minutes. And offset the calcium by 5min or so. Thanks so much!