Are there any drawbacks to dosing silicates long term? Or do you just dose them long enough to kill the dinoflagellates and then stop. Seems like dosing long term could be great for sponges and diatoms might help boost pod populations. Anyone have any experience they can share?
Silicate Dosing for Reef Tanks
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Randy Holmes-Farley
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Diatoms can become unsightly, but that's about it.
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141918
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This is probably true in my case. I dosed a whole 60ml bottle of silicate sponge excel in a week and my dinos have gotten worse. Not rapidly worse but worse.
Gonna try microbe lift special blend and the UV sweeper for 4 to 6 weeks. If that doesn't work I'm doing a start over in the spring. Been fighting dinos over like 16 months with no concrete success lol
Idech
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What type of Dino’s ? Did you do a WC during that week, or dose anything ? What was your lighting like ? Diatoms in high number will suffocate Dino’s. And how pure is sponge excel ? You might want to try the real thing.
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141918
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LCA in the sand bed. No water changes for quite a while now. 5 ppm no4 and 0.15 po4 holding steady. I just ordered the 3D UV sweeper and have 2 bottles of microbe lift special blend here to be dosed after sweeping as articles suggest. I have another bottle of sponge excel unopened and will continue to dose. At least the sponges will enjoy it lol
Idech
2500 Club Member
I am just getting rid of LCA that I had for years, probably. Silicate dosing (37.5 %), Microbe PL (same as Microbe Lift but cheaper), live phytoplancton, decreased lighting, UV stick, turkey baster to dislodge Dino’s from the rocks and regular changing of filter floss.
It takes time but it works. I’ve been looking at slides with my microscope regularly and I can tell you for sure it works. I recommend live phytoplankton as it creates sort of « bushes » that sit on Dino’s and crush them. Probably with Microbe PL.
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141918
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Live phyto would likely be a great supplement for the tank, for sure. Its funny how well microbe lift works in a tank, as after every dose, my corals always look happier and puffier.
I should have the UV sweeper in about a week or so. Once obtained, I will sweep at peak hours as noted and dose mircrobe lift afterwards. Gonna also start a journal to track the progress and steps, which I can post if it works out.
But as you noted, I think the real kicker here is getting a healthier and more mature tank that grows the competitors that out compete them. Going to definitely get about to getting some live phytoplankton, some reef mud and some live rubble to try and increase biodiversity. I miss the live rock days when Dinos weren't ever talked about lol.
I think the only way that sweeper will work, will be kind of like an evictor of bad tenants, while I try to introduce good tenants in the tank. I think the biodiversity while sweeping should be the determining factor in the war.
There is some minimal Dinos on the rocks, but as I can clearly see, the rocks have developed enough so that Dinos can't stick to them, as with the lights off, the rocks have a green hue. A competitor has staked the claim preventing the Dino advance lol.
Idech
2500 Club Member
Yes, you are right. The UV stick won’t be enough, you need fierce competition. But when you use it, you will be amazed at how efficient it is. You do it once and the next day, Dino’s are gone from sight but they reappear fast. Until your microbiome is strong enough.
GeoSquid
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I just started dosing silicate. I have a 365 gallon system, so far only dosed twice. First week was just 1ml, second week upped it to 2mls. Im getting a lot of brown on my sand. Im assuming diatoms. Will this go away as I continue to dose?
Randy Holmes-Farley
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If it is diatoms, and you keep dosing silicate, then it is unlikely to go away.
CaptainScuba
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I recently added a photosynthetic sponge to my tank and it seems to be doing very well already. I'd like to dose silicates to ensure that it continues to do well. My tank is a IM Nuvo 10, with an actual water volume of only 7g. I'm imagining that measuring out less than 0.1mL or 0.2g of the Loudwolf sodium silicate solution would be rather difficult to do in order to properly dose it for such a small tank. Would it be possible to mix the sodium silicate with RO/DI to create a diluted solution that I can then use to dose into my tank? Would it be "shelf stable" staying in solution / lasting long enough for me to use over the span of weeks or even months?
Hypothetically I mix 3.5mL of 41% sodium silicate into 46.5mL of RO/DI and store it in a plastic bottle with a tight cap. Will this solution allow me easily dose 0.07mL of 41% sodium silicate by dosing 1mL? If I am only dosing 1ppm per week, using 1mL of my new 50mL solution, will this solution last nearly a whole year in the bottle before it is all used up?
Hypothetically I mix 3.5mL of 41% sodium silicate into 46.5mL of RO/DI and store it in a plastic bottle with a tight cap. Will this solution allow me easily dose 0.07mL of 41% sodium silicate by dosing 1mL? If I am only dosing 1ppm per week, using 1mL of my new 50mL solution, will this solution last nearly a whole year in the bottle before it is all used up?
Randy Holmes-Farley
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Yes, you can dilute sodium silicate solution with ro/di (not tank water) to make it as dilute as you want for easy dosing. Exact dosing amounts are also not critical.
BQ5
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What UV were you running? Just bulbs?Just because “people” do something for a long time does not mean it is the right something.
Maybe, not what I would do however.
Imo, it is the exact opposite of a proper treatment and I’m not alone with that statement. Many of the masters in the hobby don’t follow this “gold standard”. Simply vacuuming them out, whatever them is, should be the gold standard. For some reason the “modern” hobbyists wants to fix things by testing and using chemicals or additives vs this:
A one or two hour session 2 or 3 times a week with a canister filter would easily eliminate any nuisance algae….i can guarantee this!
When I had dinos, the problem cleared up very fast when I boosted nutrients, added silicate, added two uv bulbs in a sump, and ran a mechanical filter in a different sump.
One or more of those things did the trick. Of course I cannot say with certainty which ones, but without a doubt something made a big and lasting difference.
The only treatment that continued after the problem disappeared is the elevated nutrients and occasional silicate. Perhaps they are why it has not recurred.
Fishfinder
2500 Club Member
@Randy Holmes-Farley how much of this product would you recommend for a 240gal tank. I’m not sure if my math is 100%, but i think 6ml per week will give me 2ppm? Is that correct? I included pics of the bottle and the MSDS.
slingfox
2500 Club Member
How do you use the above? Are they used to just filter the water column generally or is there a way to use them to target uglies in the sandbed?Just because “people” do something for a long time does not mean it is the right something.
Maybe, not what I would do however.
Imo, it is the exact opposite of a proper treatment and I’m not alone with that statement. Many of the masters in the hobby don’t follow this “gold standard”. Simply vacuuming them out, whatever them is, should be the gold standard. For some reason the “modern” hobbyists wants to fix things by testing and using chemicals or additives vs this:
A one or two hour session 2 or 3 times a week with a canister filter would easily eliminate any nuisance algae….i can guarantee this!
CHSUB
2500 Club Member
I use canister filters on a temporary basis for about an hour. I connect the filter to a gravel vacuum and suck the sand. For rock, I will scrub with a toothbrush and vacuum algae. This allows hours of work and removal that would be limited if done with water change. WC or blowing /scrubbing is not very effective for controlling algae unless physical removal is included.
240gal ≈ 909L@Randy Holmes-Farley how much of this product would you recommend for a 240gal tank. I’m not sure if my math is 100%, but i think 6ml per week will give me 2ppm? Is that correct? I included pics of the bottle and the MSDS.
2ppm in 909L would be a total of 1.818g sodium silicate.
To get 1.818g sodium silicate with you 37.5% W/W solution you would need 1.818g / 0.375 ≈ 4.85g of solution.
However, this also includes the mass of sodium not only silicates. You want 2ppm silicates. The required information is not in the SDS but apparently this is the commercial standard:
SiO2: ~28.7% w/w
Na2O: ~8.9% w/w
Density: ~1.39 g/mL
Which also fits approx. 37.5% W/W sodium silicate.
Therefore you would need 1.818g / 0.287 ≈ 6.33g
The density of the solution is not specified in the SDS making it difficult to calculate the volume in mL to dose. A quick websearch says it should be 1.39g/mL for the solution, so:
6.33g/1.39g/mL ≈ 4.6mL
You need to add 4.6mL of the solution to increase silicate levels by approx. 2ppm in your 240gal tank.
I would still prefer someone to double check as I'm typing on mobile right now and typos happen fast
Fishfinder
2500 Club Member
Wow. Thanks for the help. I’m happy I was close240gal ≈ 909L
2ppm in 909L would be a total of 1.818g sodium silicate.
To get 1.818g sodium silicate with you 37.5% W/W solution you would need 1.818g / 0.375 ≈ 4.85g of solution.
However, this also includes the mass of sodium not only silicates. You want 2ppm silicates. The required information is not in the SDS but apparently this is the commercial standard:
SiO2: ~28.7% w/w
Na2O: ~8.9% w/w
Density: ~1.39 g/mL
Which also fits approx. 37.5% W/W sodium silicate.
Therefore you would need 1.818g / 0.287 ≈ 6.33g
The density of the solution is not specified in the SDS making it difficult to calculate the volume in mL to dose. A quick websearch says it should be 1.39g/mL for the solution, so:
6.33g/1.39g/mL ≈ 4.6mL
You need to add 4.6mL of the solution to increase silicate levels by approx. 2ppm in your 240gal tank.
I would still prefer someone to double check as I'm typing on mobile right now and typos happen fast
These calculations are based on quite a few assumptions, maybe you want to still use a smaller dose first and increase step by step.Wow. Thanks for the help. I’m happy I was close240gal ≈ 909L
2ppm in 909L would be a total of 1.818g sodium silicate.
To get 1.818g sodium silicate with you 37.5% W/W solution you would need 1.818g / 0.375 ≈ 4.85g of solution.
However, this also includes the mass of sodium not only silicates. You want 2ppm silicates. The required information is not in the SDS but apparently this is the commercial standard:
SiO2: ~28.7% w/w
Na2O: ~8.9% w/w
Density: ~1.39 g/mL
Which also fits approx. 37.5% W/W sodium silicate.
Therefore you would need 1.818g / 0.287 ≈ 6.33g
The density of the solution is not specified in the SDS making it difficult to calculate the volume in mL to dose. A quick websearch says it should be 1.39g/mL for the solution, so:
6.33g/1.39g/mL ≈ 4.6mL
You need to add 4.6mL of the solution to increase silicate levels by approx. 2ppm in your 240gal tank.
I would still prefer someone to double check as I'm typing on mobile right now and typos happen fast
I assume your tank is struggling with dinoflagellates? Maybe you can open a thread and the community might be able to access the proplem in greater detail. I see you had a thread a year ago, but it's still worth a try I suppose.
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