Something weird is going on with my tank.

[Stelioshah]

Last week I could see some really obvious stress on my acan and at the same time my stolophora started receding and 2 duncan polyps came off their skeleton. I did a water change, the receding stopped and the acan recovered, until earlier this morning when the stress reappeared (it acts as if it can't really withstand the flow and gets smashed, even with pumps at low speeds such as 10%). When the stress started I lost a snail out of a sudden. My snails right now do some really weird stuff like the pictures below. What are the doing? What is this?

Ca: 440ppm
Mg: 1320ppm
NO3: 15ppm
PO4: 0.04-0.05ppm
Alk: 8.0-8.3dkH
salinity: 1.026, calibrated refractometer.

What are the snails doing? They are alive if I poke them they go back into their shells. Has anyone seen this kind of behaviour before? I am really worried, they are acting as if some chemical has gotten into the aquarium:

 

[Hats_]

no clue whats going on, looks very strange indeed. i would definitely run some fresh activated carbon and maybe do a large waterchange. maybe check al the magnets and metal parts, check the tds on your RO water and stuff like that

 

[Jase4224]

no clue whats going on, looks very strange indeed. i would definitely run some fresh activated carbon and maybe do a large waterchange. maybe check al the magnets and metal parts, check the tds on your RO water and stuff like that

^ is what I would do. Take and seal up a sample first in case you want to ICP it. But definitely check inside all motors amd for any compromised equipment. Also consider that you are not putting your hands in the tank with any kind of moisturiser/sunscreen. Also consider what gets sprayed into the air around your tank. I bet many tanks have been poisoned by things supposedly unrelated to the tank.

 

[Stelioshah]

I am preparing RO water right now, I changed the filters 1 month ago and the di resin recently, the tds is zero... The snails also excret some short of sticky slime like a coral mucus. Could it be my AI nero pump? I cleaned it with vinegar a month ago. I will try to see if it got rusty.

 

[Stelioshah]

I did about a 30% water change, I checked and cleaned every pump apart from the skimmer pump and none of them was rusty. I also noticed a single urchin spike on top of a rock, I have had this urchin for over a year and have never seen a spike anywhere before. My shrimps still look fine. Hope for the best. The most weird thing of all is that if I move the snails on top of some gha they will eat it, despite acting like that.

 

[Jase4224]

I did about a 30% water change, I checked and cleaned every pump apart from the skimmer pump and none of them was rusty. I also noticed a single urchin spike on top of a rock, I have had this urchin for over a year and have never seen a spike anywhere before. My shrimps still look fine. Hope for the best. The most weird thing of all is that if I move the snails on top of some gha they will eat it, despite acting like that.

Sure your snails are not laying eggs/spawning or something? I’d say it’s natural for urchins to lose the occasional spine. How are your snails acting now?

 

[Stelioshah]

Sure your snails are not laying eggs/spawning or something? I’d say it’s natural for urchins to lose the occasional spine. How are your snails acting now?

All of my herbivorous snails appart from 1 in the sump (which is alone in the sump) are laying upside down. The nassarius snail still lays upside down as well. I will move them in the sump because it is filled with algae and see if they recover. I doubt that it is the lack of algae though, since I can see algae ontop of the rocks and on the glass. I also have tons of baby trochus snails that seem to be unaffected.. Everything else seems totally fine the acan is fully extended again. I will keep doing water changes if the situation continues. That specific nassarius started acting like this about 5-6 ago but I didn't think it was something to care about. I do not have any hermits so they are most likely not attacked unless my deadly amphipods are messing with them at night (In the past, I have seen them run into the shell of a snail the moment it lied upside down after falling and killing it).

 

[Stelioshah]

They still all are upside down yet alive and they react to my touch, I moved them to the sump, they sticked on the walls of the sump thankfully and they are eating.

 

[Oldreefer44]

A few things:
Have you verified that your test results are correct by testing via an LFS, second tests kits, ICP etc?
What is your PH?
Are you finding them this way first thing in the morning? If so you likely have a predator like crab etc that comes out at night?

 

[Stelioshah]

A few things:
Have you verified that your test results are correct by testing via an LFS, second tests kits, ICP etc?
What is your PH?
Are you finding them this way first thing in the morning? If so you likely have a predator like crab etc that comes out at night?

The refractometer is calibrated through 2 different standards, store bought and homemade and through parameter checking based on the salt providers salinity chart. I have double tests for alk Ca and Mg, I measured the pH yestarday aswell it was 8.2. Just these torchus (or astrea) snails and the nassarius snail. When changing water I might measure Ca Mg and Alk 5-6 times each to ensure that everything is in range.

Forgot to mention that my 2 cowrie snails have not acted unusual yet. The only other think I can think of is that my skimmer had stopped bubbling without me noticing, but I suppose fish would react first to low oxygen levels. There are no crabs in the aquarium apart from a white docile hermit in the sump.

This aquarium has driven me mad for real, I fix something suddenly something else happens, not parameter related. The acans are happy? suddenly the stylo is not. The euphyllia is happy? suddenly the zoas aren't. I am really thorough with my measurements and I take very good looks in my tank every day and I can tell when something is off.

The last thing that could possibly cause some issues is that I am a chemistry student and I spend many hours in the lab every week, I did not use anything extremely toxic lately (or at least I cannot remember using anything) and I always wash my hands before putting them into the aquarium (which I do very often because I feed my corals). It could be something like that. There definitely is much less algae that it used to be in my aquarium because I have managed to balance phosphates really well after months of trying, but I can see that during the past week the rocks have gotten covered with algae (spots that the urchin has cleaned the algae off are shining bright).

 

[Stelioshah]

Anyways, the snails in the sump are eating the algae off the glass normally right now, that single nassarius snail still acts weird, I can only wait to see the upcoming events right now. I might try to send a sample for ICP, I have never done it before, I will think of that. Thank you.

 

[Oldreefer44]

To clarify some of my points:
Test kits are only accurate to a point. I have 3 different test kits for most of the major parameters so that I can always independently verify their accuracy similar to getting a second opinion when you are diagnosed with an illness.
Predators are notoriously difficult to identify because they will hide during the day. I kept having snails turn up dead or found them upside down in my tank for months until I finally got up early and found a large crab eating one. Another time, months after getting some Aussie live rock I found a Mantis shrimp in my tank. So they can be there and remain unseen for a long time. If snails in the sump are fine but not in the tank that should eliminate water issues as the cause.
My final point is that it is very easy to find yourself chasing your tail in this hobby. Even the "experts" will tell you that rarely is everything in their tank "happy" so often the answer is to let things find an equilibrium on their own and just let them be.

 

[Stelioshah]

To clarify some of my points:
Test kits are only accurate to a point. I have 3 different test kits for most of the major parameters so that I can always independently verify their accuracy similar to getting a second opinion when you are diagnosed with an illness.
Predators are notoriously difficult to identify because they will hide during the day. I kept having snails turn up dead or found them upside down in my tank for months until I finally got up early and found a large crab eating one. Another time, months after getting some Aussie live rock I found a Mantis shrimp in my tank. So they can be there and remain unseen for a long time. If snails in the sump are fine but not in the tank that should eliminate water issues as the cause.
My final point is that it is very easy to find yourself chasing your tail in this hobby. Even the "experts" will tell you that rarely is everything in their tank "happy" so often the answer is to let things find an equilibrium on their own and just let them be.

I agree with these points, especially with the test kit accuracy, when buying a new kit the difference is usually huge to the previous one. I have gotten to a point that I am pretty confident with my salinity at least.

Everything occured suddenly with a few subtle signs some days prior. I will let them in the sump for a few days and see how it goes. The tank is small with not many rocks (basically 2 large rocks make the whole aquascape) so it is unlikely that I have any crabs that I do not notice, I will keep an eye during night hours tommorow because I will be able to stay up late.

Unlikely but, it wouldn't suprise me if it is the amphipods, which only come out during night hours because my dragonet hunts them all day long. These things are the devil of my tank. I had a zoa that would not open for a few weeks and I couldn't tell why. I then found out that during night hours amphipods were digging through its mouth eating its flesh. I managed to save it by covering it with a cup for every single night for 4-5 months straight. I forgot to cover it for a single night once and it stayed closed for another 2 weeks. The moment any coral shows the slightest weakness (zoas in general), it gets devoured.

 

[Jase4224]

I agree with these points, especially with the test kit accuracy, when buying a new kit the difference is usually huge to the previous one. I have gotten to a point that I am pretty confident with my salinity at least.

Everything occured suddenly with a few subtle signs some days prior. I will let them in the sump for a few days and see how it goes. The tank is small with not many rocks (basically 2 large rocks make the whole aquascape) so it is unlikely that I have any crabs that I do not notice, I will keep an eye during night hours tommorow because I will be able to stay up late.

Unlikely but, it wouldn't suprise me if it is the amphipods, which only come out during night hours because my dragonet hunts them all day long. These things are the devil of my tank. I had a zoa that would not open for a few weeks and I couldn't tell why. I then found out that during night hours amphipods were digging through its mouth eating its flesh. I managed to save it by covering it with a cup for every single night for 4-5 months straight. I forgot to cover it for a single night once and it stayed closed for another 2 weeks. The moment any coral shows the slightest weakness (zoas in general), it gets devoured.

Did you use live rock? There absolutely could be a crab or mantis hiding in your tank. I had a gorilla crab show up in my tank the other day and it’s been setup for 4 years and for two years I had a harlequin tusk so go figure!

 

[Jase4224]

Richard Ross on algae

 

[Stelioshah]

Did you use live rock? There absolutely could be a crab or mantis hiding in your tank. I had a gorilla crab show up in my tank the other day and it’s been setup for 4 years and for two years I had a harlequin tusk so go figure!

It's all dry apart of some small pieces of rock that some corals have come with, the snails seem to be ok after the water change and moving them to the sump. I also unable to find the nassarius snail, so it might have managed to burry itself again. If I can tell correctly, the "affected" snails mostly were astrea snails while the ones acting normally were cowrie and trochus snails (the same type of snail that the babies are).
Thanks for the tips!

 

[Stelioshah]

Did you use live rock? There absolutely could be a crab or mantis hiding in your tank. I had a gorilla crab show up in my tank the other day and it’s been setup for 4 years and for two years I had a harlequin tusk so go figure!

So, the issue stopped for a few days but more nassarius snails kept showing up, unable to flip back straight. At the same time, I moved the hermit from the sump back to the display yesterday and today he is acting just like the snails, (flipped over not moving much).

The hermit was acting normally in the sump which now actually makes me lean towards a preditor. I doubt that it would be a crab or mantis shrimp that I have not noticed (there are really not that many hiding places and I take good looks of my tank, even for an hour some times), so... Do you guys know of any worms that might attack hermits and snails? I have moved some snails to my qt to take a good look at them, they seem to be getting a little bit better. The nassarius snails seem to be unable to smell food though. They do not eat, while a few weeks ago they would desperately try to steal food from my corals.

 

[Jase4224]

What’s your fish list?

 

[Stelioshah]

What’s your fish list?

2 clownfish and a scooter blenny. I just found this snail in my fireshirmp's cave. It is still alive but some of its flesh looks like it is rotting. The brown stuff in the picture looks like part of the snail's flesh. Could it be the shrimp? It is hanging out a lot more in the open lately. And again it is just the snails. Most of my corals are the puffiest I have seen them in a good while:

 

[JCM]

Sure sounds like a predator issue, I second examining the tank very closely at night repeatedly.

I doubt it's your shrimp.