Stocking Order and Possible Suggestions?

Hugh Mann

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I'm finally starting to get my 230 gallom build back on track after many, many delays. I've been trying to figure out my stock list and have a number of awesome fish that are "For Sure"s and a couple I am" "Maybe" on. I'm just not certain in what order I should stock them.

I know the basic rule is Peaceful first, Semi-Aggressive second, aggressive third. As I understand it this is so the more peaceful fish establish a territory that the aggressive fish steal a piece of until everyone lives in more or less harmony. However, pretty much every single fish on my list is listed as "semi aggressive". With one or two exceptions. Though I am sure some are more so than others, hence why I am asking.

My list is currently in no particular order, except for the first four, which are currently living in my other tank. (only one maroon and Betta)
Marine Betta, pair
Greyfaced Moray Eel
Maroon Clownfish, Pair
Hippo Tang

Purple Tang, single or trio
Blonde Naso Tang
Flame Hawkfish, pair
Emperor Angel
Coral Beauty Angel
Niger Trigger
Bluestreak Cleaner Wrasse

Ones I am on the fence about.
Snowflake Moray
Lyretail Anthias
Sleeper Blue Dot Goby (or some other goby species to clean sand)

I am of course, open to any and all suggestions as well.
 

lapin

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Sounds like too many fish and eels to me.
 
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Hugh Mann

Hugh Mann

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I think a small group of Purple Tangs or a trio of Genicanthus angels would be great. :)

Yellow Pyramid / Zoster Butterflies?

Never been a big fan of butterflies myself.

I'm really on the fence about multiple purples. A guy I know is giving me a good deal on his, as he is downsizing his tank. It's a bit bigger than most found in stores and super healthy. I'd hate to have it killed/injured by or kill/injure the other purple as they are pretty aggressive.

That, and if they would bully the heck out of my Hippo or planned Naso.
 
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Hugh Mann

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55 gallons to a 25 AIO peninsula.
The tang he says is about 4.5". I usually see 2.5-3" in stores. Not a huge difference, but how much risk do I want to take with a $200 fish? Especially when I'm not home enough to monitor aggression.
 

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so the maroon clowns are in there already, get fish that can hold their own VERY well

the naso, a trio of small tangs or pyramid butterflies, emperor angel and lots of small wrasse like flashers and fairies, a melenarus wrasse, maybe a blue hamlet, a trio of blue devils (two females one male, males from certain areas have an orange tail, so get them from the same shipment)
 

lion king

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The emporer usually does best as the last addition, the purples likely next to last. I would reconsider the hawks and the goby. These are fish that your greyfaced could literally just bump into, and they will be in his belly, not even meaning to be malevolent. I;m not as familiar with the lyretail anthias, but they fit the body profile of a fish that a fangtooth will take out. When he's fully mature he may not wrestle down a fish, but easy pickings will just be instinct. Even though some people hold the notion that eels will not bother worker fish like a cleaner wrasse or a cleaner shrimp, this is not true and those relationships are usually short lived. The greyfaced is a milder fangtooth but instinct and opportunity will over ride, any fish needs to be of broader body and at least considered semi aggressive. You could consider a Rhinecanthus genus trigger. Depending on what's going on, the snowflake could be your last addition, just make sure to get one large enough to be compatible with the greyfaced. The tank has more than enough footprint for 2 eels. You can always add a refugium for added filtration, as I did on my 210g.

1612797841681.png
 
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Hugh Mann

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Yeah speaking of these fish do you have plans to get a bigger tank down the line? If so how big are you planning?

I honestly don't know how I missed all the newer posts on this one.

I do. Nothing set in stone, because I don't plan to live in this house forever, though my next upgrade, if all goes according to plan will be no less than 400 gallons.
 
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Hugh Mann

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The emporer usually does best as the last addition, the purples likely next to last. I would reconsider the hawks and the goby. These are fish that your greyfaced could literally just bump into, and they will be in his belly, not even meaning to be malevolent. I;m not as familiar with the lyretail anthias, but they fit the body profile of a fish that a fangtooth will take out. When he's fully mature he may not wrestle down a fish, but easy pickings will just be instinct. Even though some people hold the notion that eels will not bother worker fish like a cleaner wrasse or a cleaner shrimp, this is not true and those relationships are usually short lived. The greyfaced is a milder fangtooth but instinct and opportunity will over ride, any fish needs to be of broader body and at least considered semi aggressive. You could consider a Rhinecanthus genus trigger. Depending on what's going on, the snowflake could be your last addition, just make sure to get one large enough to be compatible with the greyfaced. The tank has more than enough footprint for 2 eels. You can always add a refugium for added filtration, as I did on my 210g.

1612797841681.png

Good to know on the Emperor and purple. What about any of the others, any ideas?

Yeah, you have a good point about the Hawk and Goby. It's still hard to come to grasp just how big this eel can get. Saw a couple grown specimens in a different thread, was genuinely surprised. Same too with the snowflake, if just that it will be difficult to find one of a similar size. All but one I've seen have been half his size. Perhaps with those three I can do in a different tank down the road for smaller fish.

Anthias I'd like to think could avoid him, but all fish have to sleep sometime, not a good combo with a nocturnal hunter. So far he's been good with other fish, but as you say, it's only a matter of time. Got some bred mollies getting to a decent size (1") I want to toss in and see who eats them first, eel or betta.
 

lion king

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Add your lesser aggressive ones first, like the coral beauty and if you decide on the anthias, I don't know much about anthias other than they are difficult, and for long term success need to feed several times a day. The naso and niger could go together, then if you chose one purple, add the purple and emporer together. If you decide on more than one zebrasoma, then altogether, and the emporer last.

If you decide on the smaller fish, they can go first, the hawk and coral beauty could go tigether before the niger and naso.

When it comes to the eel, it is really more about nature, than aggression. The same as many predatory fish I kept; my lions, scorps, grouper are none aggressive; but will eat whatever can fit in their mouth. I can't speak to a specific match, but I have seen eels of many different combinations miss matched, and the established eel killed a smaller or less aggressive new addition.
 
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Hugh Mann

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Thanks. Very helpful.

Another question if you don't mind. I'll of course be putting my current fish in first, but would it be a good idea to also introduce the first couple of the new fish in at the same time as them? There will be lots of live rock, so ammonia won't be an issue.

It would likely be the coral beauty and I haven't yet settled on what else. I'm reconsidering my stock list now that I am factoring in how big this eel is going to get. That, and the more I read about anthias, while I am okay with multiple feedings, by the sounds of it they'll just kill eachother off until there's one left.

What sort of fish do you keep with your eels?
 

lion king

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You are expecting the greyface to get to about 24" aren't you. I don;t have any experience with this eel, but all my research suggest they are milder than the other small fang tooths I have experience with. I would usually stick to fish like large angels. triggers, groupers, some tangs, foxface/rabbitfish to include with a fang tooth. I know you have been raising this eel since small and it has been good with your betta and clowns, so there's a little consideration there. I wouldn't normally do dwarf angels, I've seen other small fang tooths take down tangs, even pretty big ones. The naso I wouldn't worry about so much, and maybe a thick purple at least around 6". Be very careful and deliberate when introducing new fish. At 24" and 2" diameter this eel is a bit more to handle than at smaller sizes. Maintaining a very strict feeding schedule is imperative. I say fish that are at least semi aggressive to aggressive, because they need to be elusive and fight back if challenged by the eel. The way you are raising him I doubt he will maliciously go after a fish that is broad and beefy, but if he did and they fight back, the eel would usually give up. A more passive fish that might give in if the eel grabs at him, will be toast. That;s the dynamics.

Are you breaking down the old tank and setting up the new tank in the same day, New rock? there can sometimes be an ammonia spike when you 1st move all your existing rock, have some Prime on hand. Do you have media in your sump? If the tank is going to a new location in your house and you can set it up, and pretty much cycle the new rock and media before the move, you can likely add a couple more fish at the same time. You can also cycle all your new rock and media in some brute containers before hand. This is an area where many have varying methods
 
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Hugh Mann

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These guys apparently get quite a bit bigger than that. This thread here https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/moray-eel-tank-progress-thread.799528/page-2#post-8555739
He has 3, and I believe he said they're in the 3.5' range. Blew my mind seeing adult specimens for the first time. I'm thinking like he's going to end up with a tank to himself in the future.

So far he has been incredibly well behaved towards the other fish. Even mollies waving their tails in his face. Would go as far to say he is the most "peaceful" one in there, the others chase eachother all the time. But yeah, that may change as he grows, and I am trying to take your advice and add some live into his diet. Wouldn't believe the difficulty of finding ghost shrimp. Finally sourced them at $2.50 each. So that may also change his behavior too. After an unfortunate incident involving a hermit crab, I've been very diligent in feeding him to his full every two days, and he eats off tongs, though sometimes he won't eat on day 2 but does day 3.

At least according to Live Aquaria, everything on my list is "semi aggressive". Definitely willing to forgo the smaller fish for sure, would just fill the space with something else. I like sailfin tangs, but I think they get too big, and the purple may take issue with it.

The new tank is directly beside the current. I'm doing about a 50/50 of dry and live from a friend taking down his tank. Good to know on the ammonia spike, so I'll have to let that get settled down prior to moving livestock. The dry is in a brute with some live too. Current tank will stay up for a while to QT some inverts that the trigger will probably eat anyways.
 

lion king

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I think he was talking about the tessa in regards to that size, the greyface max size should be around 24". I wouldn't get the eel on live if he is being kept with other fish, keeping him on a well managed feeding schedule of dead food, will help keep him tame, as it were. $2.50 each for ghosties, that's highway robbery, I get 5/$1.

You can dose some biospira and ammonia(dr tims ammonium chloride) into the brute to boost a high bacterial colony before adding the rock to the tank.
 
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Hugh Mann

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I think you're right. Will have to ask him sometime, they look bigger than that, but it could just be a perspective thing.

I thought it seemed a bit nuts for price. Was going to try and breed them like the mollies. Might still give it a shot for the Betta, and feed after the eel gets his. I'd rather have him live a good, long life and have to get an eel specific tank down the road. Fill up the house with tanks. :D

Good suggestion, I'll do that too. Can't have too much of the good stuff.

So, if I have understood all this so far, my stocking, after my initial livestock, separated into groups.

Coral Beauty/Flame Hawk/or Anthias, knowing it could get dangerous for them without intervention. Not sure about getting these ones now, might save them for the old tank.

Blonde Naso/Niger Trigger

Purple Tang/Sailfin Tang?

Emperor Angel

Feels like a pretty short list even with the 4 I already have, but I know most of them get well over 12" fully grown.

I had forgotten to say earlier, I actually only have the one maroon clown at the moment. Closing in on 1.5-2" by the looks of it, though I am apparently a terrible judge of size. Been thinking about trying to pair it up. Most maroons I see in stores are half that size, though I am aware with these cranky buggers it is not that easy, and a tiny male would be easy pickings for a hungry eel.
 

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