T5 being phased out?

K7BMG

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Yep the government has set standards on energy conservation across the board. These standards get upped every year.
So we are producing more efficient lighting and LED's are the current trend that's filling that standard. Tomorrow the path will lead us to the newer lighting and then beyond.

I call it Government issued progress.

We used to have carbureted cars and trucks, then moved into electronically fuel injected, and now electric, tomorrow who knows.

The real fact is just like the metal halide fixtures of yesteryear, its old tech that uses to much electricity and bad things like mercury and phosphorus, not unlike florescent lamps do.

Just look at the shelves of any retailer in the USA, try and find a real ol-fashioned incandescent lamp, I bet you may find one small section on one shelf that has a few. The same is happening with the shelves of florescent fixtures and lamps.

So why would any retailer or manufacturer choose to make or carry products that are on the way out? Because the market is trending towards other products.

On a business standpoint the economics take hold as well.
The fewer fluorescent lamps that sell over time the worse it will get.
So we used to buy and sell 100,000 a month, and now we have had 60,000 sitting on the shelves for three months now. The manufactures call the wholesalers and say hey you arent buying as many now so you have lost your 30% discount and all we can do is 20% on small orders. Just like that your profit margins droped drastically as well.

Yet the LED world is ramping up to a new high. What would all you continue to invest in?
If you say fluorescents your lieing to yourself.
 
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K7BMG

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They made a business decision and used the government as a scapegoat - cowardly move.

Well as devils advocate, that may or may not be the company's view, or stand on the subject.
That could be the individuals point of view that handed the question.
 

Bpb

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Yep the government has set standards on energy conservation across the board. These standards get upped every year.
So we are producing more efficient lighting and LED's are the current trend that's filling that standard. Tomorrow the path will lead us to the newer lighting and then beyond.

I call it Government issued progress.

We used to have carbureted cars and trucks, then moved into electronically fuel injected, and now electric, tomorrow who knows.

The real fact is just like the metal halide fixtures of yesteryear, its old tech that uses to much electricity and bad things like mercury and phosphorus, not unlike florescent lamps do.

Just look at the shelves of any retailer in the USA, try and find a real ol-fashioned incandescent lamp, I bet you may find one small section on one shelf that has a few. The same is happening with the shelves of florescent fixtures and lamps.

So why would any retailer or manufacturer choose to make or carry products that are on the way out? Because the market is trending towards other products.

On a business standpoint the economics take hold as well.
The fewer fluorescent lamps that sell over time the worse it will get.
So we used to buy and sell 100,000 a month, and now we have had 60,000 sitting on the shelves for three months now. The manufactures call the wholesalers and say hey you arent buying as many now so you have lost your 30% discount and all we can do is 20% on small orders. Just like that your profit margins droped drastically as well.

Yet the LED world is ramping up to a new high. What would all you continue to invest in?
If you say fluorescents your lieing to yourself.

define “invest” in.

If you’re referring to Wall Street. Yeah investing in anything relating to gas burning lamps probably isn’t too bright. No pun intended. If you mean what are we investing in our tanks? I’ll continue to purchase metal halide and t5 lamps until I can’t anymore. At that point if quality reliable led fixtures have come down in price point I’ll do what I must. If not, likely bow out of the hobby and pursue other interests. Maybe I’ll just have a cichlid tank if anything. Who knows.
 

K7BMG

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I am an electrical contractor so I apply my business to this situation.
So when I said invest, I should have said stock up on.

I used to keep many 150, 250, and 400 watt MH and HPS lamps and ballast kits on my shelves.
Over time and as they began to just sit on the shelf I decided to no longer (invest) or keep them in stock.

I hope that clears things up.
 

Bpb

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I am an electrical contractor so I apply my business to this situation.
So when I said invest, I should have said stock up on.

I used to keep many 150, 250, and 400 watt MH and HPS lamps and ballast kits on my shelves.
Over time and as they began to just sit on the shelf I decided to no longer (invest) or keep them in stock.

I hope that clears things up.

Yes. From your professional perspective it makes perfect sense. And to some degree it translates to the reef hobby retailers, but it’s not a perfect translation. After all in the last year or two we have had two major t5 centered products come to launch that are very popular. I would love for someone bring bulk reef supply into the discussion and see if they feel like their t5 stocks are collecting dust or rotating with healthy regularity. I imagine theyre doing well, but could be wrong though. I know smaller businesses (especially local brick and mortar fish shops) jumped ship on bulbs long ago. All the same. They’re far more economical on the small to medium scale in the short and long term when comparing to higher end led products.
 

K7BMG

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When I say invest.
Anything I use my capitol (Money) on I consider an investment.
Stock on the shelves in any business is a big investment.
In fact its right next to or near labor costs.
 

Bpb

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When I say invest.
Anything I use my capitol (Money) on I consider an investment.
Stock on the shelves in any business is a big investment.
In fact its right next to or near labor costs.

i get it. When I read your first post I replied to I didn’t know you were an entrepreneur dealing in lighting. I read your post with consumer undertones only.
 

K7BMG

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i get it. When I read your first post I replied to I didn’t know you were an entrepreneur dealing in lighting. I read your post with consumer undertones only.

Ha ha I get it.
My insider speak.. so to speak..

I tell you what though.
The lamp manufactures had a hey day and IMO were the ones that started the ban lie. The next statement right after the lie was you better stock up now before there all gone.
Some bought it and I bet they are still sitting on new but very old stock.

A rep for GE and I had a talk on the subject back in 2011 or so.
Said he was having his best sales year ever on florescent lamps back then.
 

sfin52

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Ha ha I get it.
My insider speak.. so to speak..

I tell you what though.
The lamp manufactures had a hey day and IMO were the ones that started the ban lie. The next statement right after the lie was you better stock up now before there all gone.
Some bought it and I bet they are still sitting on new but very old stock.

A rep for GE and I had a talk on the subject back in 2011 or so.
Said he was having his best sales year ever on florescent lamps back then.
Growers and referred are in the boat. We both rely on t5. Led is still new and improving
 

oreo54

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Ha ha I get it.
My insider speak.. so to speak..

I tell you what though.
The lamp manufactures had a hey day and IMO were the ones that started the ban lie. The next statement right after the lie was you better stock up now before there all gone.
Some bought it and I bet they are still sitting on new but very old stock.

A rep for GE and I had a talk on the subject back in 2011 or so.
Said he was having his best sales year ever on florescent lamps back then.

Trusting sales reps is one step below trusting manufacturers.. :)
One year results mean little as well. Certainly doesn't define a "trend"..
8 years is a "loooong" time in some tech..

-looking statements are neither predictions nor guarantees of future events, circumstances or performance and are inherently subject to known and unknown risks, uncertainties and assumptions that could cause our actual results to differ materially from those indicated by those statements

How long did it take till tube TV's disappeared once the flatscreen tech was polished and affordable.
Funny thing is some tubes would last a lot longer than those new fangled panels..

Good or bad it just is what it is.
Good thing is usually someone will still want to make money on "niche" products.

LED efficiency is starting to exceed 2x the L/Watt efficiency of current light sources. In some industries that is a LOT of savings.
Not going to get into replacement costs ect since really.. that is indeterminate at this point..at least in the real world.

Plenty of room currently for all tech..

Sad thing it's suppliers that determine your fate more than you do..

It will cost you to find out what the real gurus know..

Oh and it sometimes it isn't if they can make money on it, it's if they can make "enough" money on it..
(kind of full circle to those niche providers)
Profit margins make the world go around.
 
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Bpb

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Dont care if any lfs carries them since BRS and marinedepot do!

thats what I’m saying man. I don’t even have a fish store within hours of me so I don’t even consider that as a viable option when shopping. I can count on one hand the number of times I’ve actually even been IN a fish store in my 12 years in the aquarium hobby. Never once have purchased anything from a fish store ether. I have shopped exclusively online or from other hobbyists.
 

blstravler

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thats what I’m saying man. I don’t even have a fish store within hours of me so I don’t even consider that as a viable option when shopping. I can count on one hand the number of times I’ve actually even been IN a fish store in my 12 years in the aquarium hobby. Never once have purchased anything from a fish store ether. I have shopped exclusively online or from other hobbyists.

that’s crazy - do you keep a lot of back up’s on hand in case of failure?
 

tehmadreefer

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Ya I only get fish and fish food from my lfs meat me.

Funny thing however, I had a blue + bulb break last year and I finally found an lfs that had one in stock about an hour from me in west palm beach. He wanted $40 for it... he couldn't believe the price online lol i just waited for another to be shipped.
 

RONBATTLE

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WELLLL NOW..THAT HAS TO BE B.S. CANT SEE T5 GOING AWAY..A GREAT LIGHT THAT WORKS SO GOOD...BUT ,...IF SO , THEN MY 8 BULB ATI WILL BE AN 800 DOLLAR PAPERWEIGHT.
 

Cook

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I don't think we are in any danger of these T5's going away anytime soon. This is a specialty industry as others have mentioned and the light spectrum that you can get out of one T5 bulb like the Blue Plus takes many LEDs to replicate and the blending isn't easy or cheap. I have a hybrid fixture with T5's myself.
 

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