Discussion in 'Fish Discussion' started by 4FordFamily, Sep 29, 2015.

Tang Aggression - Understanding and Combating

  1. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    Wow, that is a lot of tangs in your tank. How will you handle that bio-load in a few years when all of them have grown much larger? I am genuinely curious because I am stocking my first tank over 120g and based on many of the stocking plans I am reading on these forums, I am under-stocking.

    Everything I have read on this forum leads me to believe that PBT won't survive long term in your tank because of the ich. Maybe I am wrong, I have not kept one myself yet, but I have qt every fish since I think there is a possibility I may add one.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2018
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  2. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    So if I got a sailfin it may be ok for quite a long time in my 180g? I don't think I will be upgrading for quite some time, maybe never?? It took me 26 years to get to a 180 so maybe in another 10 I will graduate to a 300 lol.
     
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  3. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    Wow, that hippo is gorgeous!!! You are making me want to try one and see how it does.
     
  4. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club

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    It's not impossible and it has been done. It just has it's challenges. A change in stress in the tank such as aggression, water quality, or hardware failures, can open them up to an outbreak. In some ways, it is more work than putting fish through QT. And you definitely don't want to be a tinkerer or love the look of a sterile tank.

    If you start small you will be doing very well if you have him long enough to outgrow your tank.
     
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  5. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club

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    Thank you. I'm not all that good with coral but the fish came easy. I had a lot of help from @4FordFamily , @Humblefish and @melypr1985 who got me started with proper QT right off the bat. For someone who was new to saltwater at the time it was exactly the help I needed. I'm also a big fan of Paul B and his concepts of fish immunity. I feed my fish as healthy as possible just in case something does get through my QT system. I do sheet nori and PE mysis every morning. Every other morning I feed PE Calanus and I feed LRS Fish Frenzy every evening. I try to spoil them.
     
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  6. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    I feed heavy and I also use LRS and mysis! Every fish in my tank eats the nori.



    Do sailfins not live very long, or do they just grow really slow?
     
  7. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    I have kept an ich management tank in the past before I even knew the term. I got serious about QT. in 2014 when I restarted my 95g. I have been somewhat successful with qt fish, but I don't enjoy the process. I am looking forward to purchasing fish from @Humblefish in the future.
     
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  8. Brew12

    Brew12 Electrical Gru Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Reef Tank 365 Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor North Alabama Reef Club

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    I've never kept one but my understanding is that it can take up to 10 years or more for them to reach full size. Like most fish, they start out growing fast but as they get larger the growth rate slows down.
     
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  9. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    Yes just buy a bit larger than the PBT, perhaps .5 inches larger. :)
     
  10. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    They can live upwards of ten years in the hobby. They’re not slow growers they get to 5” pretty quick and then start to slow down considerably.

    Edit: just saw @Brew12 answered I guess there’s an echo in here! :)
     
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  11. norfolkgarden

    norfolkgarden Well-Known Member R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award

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    What are reasonable life expectancy for each types of the smaller tangs?
    For arguments sake, say you started with a 3" fish and have it in a 180 gallon tank.

    Thanks!
     
  12. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    10-15 years with proper husbandry perhaps. Very few make it that long in the hobby.

    It’s also hard to know how old a fish is by size, some lived in environments with lots of food and grew quite fast, others not.
     
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  13. norfolkgarden

    norfolkgarden Well-Known Member R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award

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    Is that their normal lifespan?

    Do they die from HLLE? Or simply outgrow the 'temporary' 75 gallon tank they start out in and never get a needed upgrade?

    Are we still incapable of providing them with good longterm nutrition?

    Thank you!
    I want to keep mini me 7/8" blue hippo tang as healthy as possible.
     
  14. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    There’s conjecture that some tangs can live 20 years, many factors lead to that. I’ve seen giant sailfin without notable HLLE.

    Hippos on the other hand, any slip in husbandry can send them down HLLE lane they may never fully recover from.
     
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  15. mdrobc13

    mdrobc13 Member

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    What worked for me was to get a large Powder Blue tang who was larger than my other tangs...added him last and so far so good. Clown Tang and Sailfin have accepted him whereas they killed the last Powder Brown tang who was added that was smaller in size. No issues otherwise and new order has been established and the Powder Blue and my Angularis Angel are the current tank bosses. Fingers are crossed.

    Would like to add one or two Scopas Tangs and a Leutenant Tang also but I think I am tang'ed out at this point and probably the only thing I can get away with adding is a small dwarf angel at this point.
     
  16. mdrobc13

    mdrobc13 Member

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    They are doing fine..I have as big a skimmer as I can tolerate/fit on my tank (BubbleMagnus Curve D9) rated for up to 300+ gallons for hi bio-load and I've got a full refugium with macroalge using the Triton method for the last 4 months and so far so good. Largest are the newly added Powder Blue Tang 5" and Angularis Angel 5-6" followed by my Purple and Sailfin tangs who are each about 4-5" Two yellow tangs are between 3-4" and clown tang is 3.5" long. Vlamingi Tang just added is small about 2.5" but I know they get big. Hippo tang I got at 2" and is now almost 4.5" long. My Blue Faced angel is still a juve and about 3-4" and Potters angel is 3" also. Rock Beauty is a small one 3" and my Foxface is small also 3". Two Diamond Orange Gobies are med about 3" long and that's about it other than the schooling Green Chromis (small).

    Tank is 210 g with a 34" Trigger Purple/Amethyst Sump...so I am about as far as I can go I think with the bio load. Lots of life rock in the tank and sump also. Plan is to upgrade possibly in another year or two tank wise and when I retire from my current job (no more frequent moves) then will go big or go home with a custom peninsula tank of at least 400-500g or more depending on house/residence. But yeah I am tanged' out at this point!
     
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  17. Ento-Reefer

    Ento-Reefer Well-Known Member R2R Supporter Delaware Reef Club Build Thread Contributor

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    All I can say is amazing @mdrobc13. I never realized how much bioload a tank could handle. I know I probably won’t stick as many fish as you, but it is nice to know I have quite a bit of leeway. My skimmer is rated for a 400g tank and I have a decent refugium also. Thanks for replying.
     
  18. mdrobc13

    mdrobc13 Member

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    54156114117__B5191C2E-8A2D-4554-89F2-19ADAB369831.JPG IMG_0198.jpg IMG_0202.jpg IMG_0388.JPG IMG_0814.jpg IMG_2132.jpg

    Here are some shots of my PBT and also my Angularis cruising also my yellow tangs and new rose bubble anomone..and I think my foxface and Rock Beauty are in there. Also a shot of tang feeding time where you can see my purple tang and clown tang closing in to get some nori also. I think my Sailfin is in there too...
     
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  19. jgleach99

    jgleach99 Member

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    Great info as i'm about to add a PBT to the mix. Currently I only have a yellow tang, but its been there for awhile so I'll heed your advice and try some of the tips!
     
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  20. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2018 Article Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    Thanks! Glad you found it helpful! :)
     
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