Tank crash! How to stop it?

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brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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My filter roller is working overtime. My skimmer has also been the nastiest I’ve ever seen/smelled. It appears filter roller is going to need a new roll after only two weeks



thats a key assessment really here. if the toxicity from that mix of organics is low, irritation low, then turnabout in corals is likely but those compounds dissolved and suspended are chiefly the #1 thing we attack in rip cleans. That entire condition set instantly stops upon refill of the tank where no surfaces are bringing back in waste loads/castable sloughs etc.

as the days progress and small details unfold/more loss mass vs stopping and hopefully holding with no more loss/can be counted against the efforts required to produce a sixty gallon rip clean job.

everyone used to think the instant change back to clean water from eutrophic waters was shocking, but it wasn't if we dropped the lights and upped the feed.

in current settings if feed is upped, systemic organic loading increases and algae/cyano challenges come in January. its truly hard to coax that water back into compliance for long term enjoyment too, beyond the initial crash arrest.
 
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brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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if I read your entire post history I see zero practice in tank arrest fixes, with outcomes, so I'll take your evaluation at face value.


there are organics to clear out here, potential irritants and chemistry imbalances, take the long way or the short way/ choose best as possible. that's harmless accurate info, and if this was a 20 gallon it'd already be entered on page fifty of the rip clean thread(s) so that a prediction was in place before the final after pics then 3 month follow up.
 
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brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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DZ

list what he should do as a help to us, I'm genuinely curious to know what you recommend based on all details. I've seen you wrestle with Randy for twenty pages over the most ethereal chemistry equations possible, him leaving unconvinced 100% on each occasion :) but it was clear you have some strong chemistry knowledge. whats your direct recommend for action here, accepting all helpful brainstorms for the benefit of his coral investment/time spent
 
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levi83

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My filter roller is working overtime. My skimmer has also been the nastiest I’ve ever seen/smelled. It appears filter roller is going to need a new roll after only two weeks



thats a key assessment really here. if the toxicity from that mix of organics is low, irritation low, then turnabout in corals is likely but those compounds dissolved and suspended are chiefly the #1 thing we attack in rip cleans. That entire condition set instantly stops upon refill of the tank where no surfaces are bringing back in waste loads/castable sloughs etc.

as the days progress and small details unfold/more loss mass vs stopping and hopefully holding with no more loss/can be counted against the efforts required to produce a sixty gallon rip clean job.

everyone used to think the instant change back to clean water from eutrophic waters was shocking, but it wasn't if we dropped the lights and upped the feed.

in current settings if feed is upped, systemic organic loading increases and algae/cyano challenges come in January. its truly hard to coax that water back into compliance for long term enjoyment too, beyond the initial crash arrest.
I guess I don’t totally follow you here. Are you saying leave it alone and increase feeding for a couple weeks? Are you saying it’s too clean and that inhibits a recovery?
 
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brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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You are mentioning as smell and visual cues an increased expression of circulating organics, dieoff and irritants compared to the usual system. to not rip clean it means we're hoping its all been brought down to acceptable levels with the water changes in place, and we try and not overload the system with further additions because it does no good to arrest a crash here and then give you a GHA farm in January, you'll hate it just the same...seeking clean recovery sounds best.

I'm sending you a link of a simple rip clean thread, theyre all sandbedded but that's not the point, the point is how everyone's tank looked before, and then after we robbed 100% of the organics and invasion and irritants out of the water.

to rip clean this tank is the safest arrest mode you'll see from the two proof works sent, but it takes a lot of work to effect those. if you can guide this tank back safely and not rip clean it, you save money and time. sending now, I dont want the threads wrecked obviously so I gotta mail em to ya.
 

hhaase

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Levi;

Just trying to make sense if your equipment makeup here. I see you have both a 100 and 60 gallon tank.
If I understand this correct, the 60 gallon tank is what crashed.

Since the crash, you linked the 100 and 60 gallon tanks together, bringing total volume of the system to 160 gallons (not including sump). After that you did three water changes of 50 gallons each.

Did the 100 gallon tank have livestock yet? Or was it still cycling?
 
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levi83

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Levi;

Just trying to make sense if your equipment makeup here. I see you have both a 100 and 60 gallon tank.
If I understand this correct, the 60 gallon tank is what crashed.

Since the crash, you linked the 100 and 60 gallon tanks together, bringing total volume of the system to 160 gallons (not including sump). After that you did three water changes of 50 gallons each.

Did the 100 gallon tank have livestock yet? Or was it still cycling?
 
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levi83

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Sorry for delay. I’m trying to quote more and type less. That ain’t working!
Yes. That is right. I’ve had a 100 gallon cycled tank in my basement with two rock structures. No fish. I was doing 2 gallon daily water changes in the reefer 250. The waste water was going into the new tank. Cycling water from my display into the tank I had plans to join in one sump. My plan was to bring the sps downstairs and go lps upstairs. People without tanks don’t care about sps tanks. Sps tanks are just for us nerds. Then before I got it done it crashed last weekend due to my lack of knowledge of new equipment. I have another tank full of lps that was going upstairs into my display. Water from the 100 gallon got cycled through that tank daily. I basically diluted my crash of a 60 gallon tank with a 100 gallon tank of good parameters.
 
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levi83

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No livestock. It was essentially cycled but only got its nutrients from my display water. Yes. 3 50 gallon water changes in the week since I found the crash which started last Saturday or Sunday. Whenever my return chamber got to low for the pump.
 

hhaase

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Gotcha. The good news is that you've got a lot more options available than I realized at first glance.

I'd recommend reading the links that Brandon sent you, as having that 2nd tank available as a separate system will make his method a lot easier from a logistical standpoint.

-Hans
 

brandon429

why did you put a reef in that
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I linked this is yet a different tank CPR thread where we simply wanted to collect jobs that involve power outage fixes, tank wrecks from extreme temp challenges etc. We need to be able to consider this unique challenge because murphy's law says most of the jobs will be on big tanks not easily rip cleaned into compliance... I honestly think you've guided it back here with the water change, actions you took with lighting even before posting, and our thread needs to see times that rip cleans can simply be avoided.

those corals that are open above are specific markers we use in other threads to assess water loosely, but it works very well too/anecdotally of course.

you can see by the rip clean/ about 300 tanks worth/ that its a horrendous cheat that works so well

we aren't supposed to get away with that pattern, reef tanks are to be gently coaxed they said once in 1998.

rip cleans are for spoiled rotten nano owners mainly. However, if you think your system is peeling flesh further, or not improving, then bribe someone to truck you over 140 ish gallons and do surgery, it will intercept the breakdown. studying by anecdote gets more fun when there haven't been any outliers since 2010 :)

its barbarism though, true art skill brings the current water back into line.
 
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