The DOs and DON’Ts of Quarantine

Discussion in 'Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis' started by Humblefish, Jun 14, 2015.

  1. jasonrusso

    jasonrusso Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    I don't think the bacteria is necessarily going to colonize the filter. There is no ammonia for them to process if you use fresh saltwater. Some may get trapped in the media I guess.
     
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  2. Deezill

    Deezill Active Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    So If I am getting ready to purchase a Powder Blue Tang do I medicate while in QT even If I don't see anything or wait until I see something during the 4-6 seeks he is in QT?
     
  3. iemsparticus

    iemsparticus The Addiction is Real R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Build Thread Contributor

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    Really depends on you. How observant are you going to be? Are you going to be able to sit in front of the QT for large chunks of time and be able to pick up on symptoms? If so, it’s better to not medicate IMO.

    If not, which, honestly, is the camp I myself (and I suspect a lot of us) would fall into, its better to medicate before symptoms crop up... the likelyhood is that by the time I would be able to observe symptoms, the disease has gotten to a pretty advanced stage, and treatment MAY be too late.

    You just have to know yourself and your own situation, and honestly assess your ability to pick up on early symptoms that may happen very sporadically.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2018
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  4. Deezill

    Deezill Active Member R2R Supporter Build Thread Contributor

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    Yep you and I belong in the same camp lol.
     
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  5. dwwataz

    dwwataz nuttier than a squirrel turd R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Build Thread Contributor

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    I personally do a couple rounds of prazipro for potential flukes/worms. I then observe but I'm always home. I've been on disability for a year though. Once my surgeries are done and I'm back at work, I'll likely do ttm/prazipro and then observe.
     
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  6. Greenstreet.1

    Greenstreet.1 Valuable Member

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    I have a PB in qt for a few weeks been through GC never stopped eating also under heavy watch don’t think that I will be putting him through copper.
     
  7. marcus aurelius

    marcus aurelius Member

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    QT tank all set up and running. Thanks for everybody's help. I currently using a 40 gallon bow front. Got it set up on Sunday. I used to DR. Tim's. Yesterday I did a 5 gallon water change. Tested for ammonia and it's still good.

    Has anybody experienced a little cloudy water?
     
  8. Victoria M

    Victoria M Valuable Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Just got to say I love your avatar name.
     
  9. marcus aurelius

    marcus aurelius Member

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    :-}
     
  10. Kactai

    Kactai Active Member Build Thread Contributor

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    My nightmare has happened. In my 180g display I had a powder blue tang, a yellow flanked fairy wrasse, a Swiss guard basslet, a tail spot goby and two midnight clowns.

    The PBT came down with ich so I decided to go full hospital tanks and treatments. I set up 2- 20g tanks with hang on back filters and heaters in my spare room.

    I managed to catch all of the fish and placed the wrasse and PBT in the 20 long and the other 4 in the standard 20. Each of the 20g tanks actually hold 16g plus the volume of the HOB filters.

    The next day I dosed 5ml coppersafe to each tank and everyone seemed fine. The next day I dosed another 5 ml to each tank, which should have brought me to half dose of copper safe. My wrasse did not take this increase well. I did a 7g water change to try and reduce the copper concentration in the 20 long. Long story long... the wrasse did not recover and died today. I did not test for copper levels yet since as per the instructions I’m still under half dosage.

    This is the 3rd day on copper, one fish has died (showed no signs of any disease) and the other 5 are not eating. I’m very nervous as this is my first time using copper or doing a hospital tank and I’m considering abandoning the whole thing. My Gf thinks I’m crazy for going to this extreme for a few fish.

    Should I wait for the fish to eat and continue raising the copper levels every few days? By my calculations the 20 long has 6 ml of copper safe in it. Meaning that to dose according to instructions (5ml/4g) the 20 long still needs 14 ml of coppersafe. The standard 20 has 10 ml coppersafe in it so far and needs another 10 ml.

    Should I be using the API test kit to test? I was told that the level I am looking for on the API test kit is 1.5mg/L. All accounts say between 1.5-2.mg/L. I’m just being paranoid about the loss of the wrasse and I’m looking for a little bit of validation and any advice.
     
  11. melypr1985

    melypr1985 totally addicted R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Article Contributor Expert Contributor Moderator Emeritus

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    You should definitely be testing your copper. Coppersafe has recently shown to be a bit inexact in their concentrations. Copper is a poison through and through so the concentration of it in the water must be monitored closely while raising the levels in QT. @HotRocks and @4FordFamily have done some serious research into this and can lend more light to the subject for you.
     
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  12. 4FordFamily

    4FordFamily Tang, Angel, & Wrasse Addict Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2019 Article Contributor Expert Contributor Hospitality Award Build Thread Contributor

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    Yes in short, Hanna Copper Checker. Coppersafe/Fritz quality control I’m convinced is run by howler monkeys.

    Sorry for your troubles, friend!
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2018
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  13. HotRocks

    HotRocks Fish Fanatic! Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2019 Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Expert Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    How recently did you purchase coppersafe?

    We are finding coppersafe to be very inconsistent lately. Levels vary anywhere from 2.0-3.0ppm if dosed per instructions. Which a level that high is not always necessary. Minimum is 1.5ppm. 3.0ppm can be toxic to some species based on my experiences. Especially Wrasse.

    If you have a bottle that is closer to 3.0ppm you may only need slightly over half of the recommended dose to be therapuetic. Which may only be around 12-15ml for 20 gallon tank only holding +/-16 gallons.
    10ml in a 24hr period is heavy if you have a bottle that is unknowingly higher than expected.

    IMO a single 5ml dose is a little heavy for a 20g tank (especially if you have an over potent bottle). That is probably why your fish aren't eating.

    I lost an entire batch of QT fish to this. API can be hard to read for some, others don't have an issue with it.

    Due to all of this I personally choose to switch to copper power and a different test method. I also test daily during ramp up, and daily to monitor the 30 days of therapuetic treatment as well.

    Do you have the API kit? If so take 1.25ml measured with a syringe, and dose it into a measured gallon of RO water or saltwater. Test with API and see what you think it reads. Or post a pic of result.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2018
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  14. Kactai

    Kactai Active Member Build Thread Contributor

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    My “coppersafe” is brand new. It is actually a chelated copper product made by a chemist for a fellow named Carl Hayden who is well know in Ontario Canada as a very knowledgeable QT expert.

    He advised me that the “coppersafe” should read at 1.5 ppm on the API test kit at the rate of 5ml/4 gal. Or at least that 1.5ppm on the API test kit was my target level. He suggested I start testing copper levels once I had dosed 1/2 to 3/4 of the recommended dose. I only made it to half the recommended dose before the wrasse died, presumably because I added too much way too fast.

    Knowing a bit more about copper, I think I should have raised my copper levels more slowly. What would you recommend? 2ml / day until the API test kit reads 1.5ppm?

    I’ll order the Hannah checker tonight.
     
  15. HotRocks

    HotRocks Fish Fanatic! Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2019 Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Expert Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    So your using coppersafe by fritz?

    Or using something someone you know made themselves and calling it coppersafe?

    It could be that you ramped up too fast. Wrasse tend to be somewhat sensitive to copper. The fact that all fish stopped eating is what scares me.

    Wrasse are also very good at being afflicted by ich/velvet without visual white spots or symptoms due to thick mucus/slime coat.
     
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  16. Kactai

    Kactai Active Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Yes it is chelated copper made by a professional chemist for a local reefer. It is not the name brand fritz CopperSafe.

    Well the PBT and one of the clowns ate a small piece of shrimp each. Nobody else ate anything.

    I’m gonna try some garlic and Zoe soaked nori and shrimp tomorrow to see if they will eat more.

    If they do not eat would you recommend a water change to lower concentrations until they start eating again and starting to raise copper slowly once they are eating again?
     
  17. HotRocks

    HotRocks Fish Fanatic! Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2019 Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Expert Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    It definitely wouldn't hurt at this point.

    I would also recommend when you do begin to ramp up again, figure your total dosage then split over 5-7 days. Then break each daily dose up into a minimum of 1/2 in am 1/2 in pm.
     
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  18. Kactai

    Kactai Active Member Build Thread Contributor

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    Thank you very much
     
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  19. RaikOu1989

    RaikOu1989 Member

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    Ok so got ich outbreak in my main tank, I don’t know if came in a coral, since it’s been 1 year that I add the last fish, and I always QT my fish.
    Turns now that I need to move all my fish to QT and it’s 5 tangs, 2 wrasses, 2 clown and 10 chromis. My QT have only 30g, but I have a 100g in my garage... can I put all the fishes in this tank? Should I put 1 or 2 tangs in the 30 gallon to trying to spread a little?
     
  20. HotRocks

    HotRocks Fish Fanatic! Staff Member Team R2R R2R Supporter R2R Excellence Award Partner Member 2019 Reef Tank 365 Article Contributor Expert Contributor Build Thread Contributor

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    IMO, the tangs would be much better off all in the 100g so they have swimming room.
     
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