Trident or not?

[RedSea500MaxS]

Sad the ion testing and dosing units so far cannot do Alk. Alk must use reagents to drop the pH, and Alk is my #1 test.

Well...first day researching. Time for break...but did make great combo order for some incredible Acro colonies.

Crying though I missed this one by 5 minutes!!!

 

[RedSea500MaxS]

Already here? Most of the Reagent based systems just launched recently I mean the last few months except the KH ones. Most still cant buy a Trident so basically it is new too. Not like these systems have been around for years. At the rate the Trident is going ion based systems will be out by the time everyone who wants a Trident can buy them. I do hear what you are saying but not much of lead, now if the Trident came out last year.

I think we will see ion testing this year and could be by fall. Maybe by that time we will know how reliable the Reagent systems are.

Just my opinion. I just feel the reagent systems are a little late but time will tell. Maybe I am way off base. Sometimes better tech fails because it is brought to the market by the wrong company or one with less marketing capabilities.


To me it is about testing the stuff we do not normally test for.

Which one can do Alk?

 

[road_runner]

Sad the ion testing and dosing units so far cannot do Alk. Alk must use reagents to drop the pH, and Alk is my #1 test.

Well...first day researching. Time for break...but did make great combo order for some incredible Acro colonies.

Crying though I missed this one by 5 minutes!!!

I think Alk will be tested by titration, only machine I know that do not require it is the mindstream. There are couple of reliable kh testers that been in the market for a while now.
I think, other elements will move to ion probs..its only a matter of cost and accuracy if these probs, if these probs delivered, it will dominate testing approaches... .. only time will tell..

 

[road_runner]

I was in the same boat- ran my systems for years without a controller. Never thought I needed one even though invariably when I was away something would happen and I would return to a mess or spend a few frustrating hours on the phone trying to direct my wife to do this or that. I went with a controller for my new build and can't imagine running a system without it. The peace of mind and ability to check in from a distance, be alerted, intervene is invaluable.

Trident? I think it depends on your corals. If mainly an LPS/softies system probably just a fun toy and convenience of not having to manually test but for SPS I have found it invaluable. I no longer have that anxiety of should I check my alK today again. It has let me dial in the Alkalinity and keep it rock stable. Do I need Ca and Mg checked twice a day ....definitely no...but the trident needs to do that for whatever obscure reasons and I accept it.

I have two trident's, one on my Display and the other on my Frag system that houses many high end SPS. I was able to get the first one during the initial release week and set it up on the frag system. I got lucky and happened to be perusing BRS when a batch was released a few weeks later and picked ups the second one for my Display system. I have had no issues, I have replaced reagents on both systems, recalibrated and all continue to just chug along. What I find remarkable is using the DOS to adjust dosing based on the Alkalinity reading has really allowed me to maintain a rock solid level.



Hope this helps.
Happy Reefing!

Wow..
You are the only person I know "that is not affiliated with Neptune" and have 2 tridents..

The few people who used trident so far have indicated that CA and or Mag fluctuate after first calibration. Did you observe any such thing on any of your 2 tridents?

You are also the first person I kown who is dosing automatically based on trident reading...very brave..

 

[CDavmd]

Wow..
You are the only person I know "that is not affiliated with Neptune" and have 2 tridents..

The few people who used trident so far have indicated that CA and or Mag fluctuate after first calibration. Did you observe any such thing on any of your 2 tridents?

You are also the first person I kown who is dosing automatically based on trident reading...very brave..

Correct I have no affiliation with Trident, I'm just a consumer. I was one of those on the release night that thought I had one from BRS but was later informed they had miscalculated stock. They send me one a week later with the next stock release. I set it up on my frag tank and let it run for a few days. The discrepancy between hanna and my other test kits was within the expected range of comparison. After calibration, they were even closer ( for those not familiar, you need to let the Trident run for a few days before calibrating. The first values may be off).

Not brave at all- After a couple weeks I let the DOS be controlled by the Trident. It has a built in failsafe. I told it I want the Alkalinity to be 8.5 and gave it a control range of .5- this means that the trident will continue to adjust the dosage ONLY between that Alkalinity range. I also let it adjust the dosage +/- 35% of the baseline dosage. If the Alkalinity deviates beyond 8 or 9 as per my +/- 0.5 control range then the DOS will revert to my baseline dosing amount. I have also set up an alarm if the Alkalinity is below 8 and above 9 so I will catch any issues. Similarly, you can set the Calcium and mine is set to maintain 440 +/- 50 with a 40% permissive dosage adjustment.

It has worked flawlessly for me and I am very happy with the stability. Much better than my previous testing 3x per week and adjusting dosages manually.

I was so pleased with the performance that I tried getting a second and I was lucky on that point- Just happened to be on BRS when they released a batch. I have it on my display and again the ability to see what is happening with my Alkalinity and the improved stability is very comforting.

 

[road_runner]

Correct I have no affiliation with Trident, I'm just a consumer. I was one of those on the release night that thought I had one from BRS but was later informed they had miscalculated stock. They send me one a week later with the next stock release. I set it up on my frag tank and let it run for a few days. The discrepancy between hanna and my other test kits was within the expected range of comparison. After calibration, they were even closer ( for those not familiar, you need to let the Trident run for a few days before calibrating. The first values may be off).

Not brave at all- After a couple weeks I let the DOS be controlled by the Trident. It has a built in failsafe. I told it I want the Alkalinity to be 8.5 and gave it a control range of .5- this means that the trident will continue to adjust the dosage ONLY between that Alkalinity range. I also let it adjust the dosage +/- 35% of the baseline dosage. If the Alkalinity deviates beyond 8 or 9 as per my +/- 0.5 control range then the DOS will revert to my baseline dosing amount. I have also set up an alarm if the Alkalinity is below 8 and above 9 so I will catch any issues. Similarly, you can set the Calcium and mine is set to maintain 440 +/- 50 with a 40% permissive dosage adjustment.

It has worked flawlessly for me and I am very happy with the stability. Much better than my previous testing 3x per week and adjusting dosages manually.

I was so pleased with the performance that I tried getting a second and I was lucky on that point- Just happened to be on BRS when they released a batch. I have it on my display and again the ability to see what is happening with my Alkalinity and the improved stability is very comforting.

This is awesome thank you for sharing
You are one of the odd ones. So far the common theme is the ca and mag fluctuation that's why I do not know anyone else who let trident control their system.
I run khg for the last 3 years..well 2 kg guardians like you. And also loving how stable alk is with the khg(khg both test and dose on the same unit) I did not let the khg dose for me until 6 months of me observing the unit and its stability. I cannot afford alk swing in my systems...

 

[CDavmd]

This is what I mean- you say I am one of the odd ones. That is simply not true there are many people out there using the Trident and DOS without issue.

 

[road_runner]

This is what I mean- you say I am one of the odd ones. That is simply not true there are many people out there using the Trident and DOS without issue.

Ok got it, you are very common case, most of trident users conteol their dosing based on trident measurements results automatically.
Hope we can make peace now

 

[CDavmd]

Ok got it, you are very common case, most of trident users conteol their dosing based on trident measurements results automatically.
Hope we can make peace now

There was never a war, cheers!

 

[RedSea500MaxS]

Correct I have no affiliation with Trident, I'm just a consumer. I was one of those on the release night that thought I had one from BRS but was later informed they had miscalculated stock. They send me one a week later with the next stock release. I set it up on my frag tank and let it run for a few days. The discrepancy between hanna and my other test kits was within the expected range of comparison. After calibration, they were even closer ( for those not familiar, you need to let the Trident run for a few days before calibrating. The first values may be off).

Not brave at all- After a couple weeks I let the DOS be controlled by the Trident. It has a built in failsafe. I told it I want the Alkalinity to be 8.5 and gave it a control range of .5- this means that the trident will continue to adjust the dosage ONLY between that Alkalinity range. I also let it adjust the dosage +/- 35% of the baseline dosage. If the Alkalinity deviates beyond 8 or 9 as per my +/- 0.5 control range then the DOS will revert to my baseline dosing amount. I have also set up an alarm if the Alkalinity is below 8 and above 9 so I will catch any issues. Similarly, you can set the Calcium and mine is set to maintain 440 +/- 50 with a 40% permissive dosage adjustment.

It has worked flawlessly for me and I am very happy with the stability. Much better than my previous testing 3x per week and adjusting dosages manually.

I was so pleased with the performance that I tried getting a second and I was lucky on that point- Just happened to be on BRS when they released a batch. I have it on my display and again the ability to see what is happening with my Alkalinity and the improved stability is very comforting.

CdavMD

Thank you for such a great post! I am so appreciative and honored people with your experience and knowledge will share with me and these threads! Awesome info.

That is exactly our fears....we look and one day we go on trip and BAM. Disaster, with $XO,OOO in livestock dead.

Appreciate this feedback and hope others enjoy and share as well.

J & D

 

[shred5]

Which one can do Alk?

Alkatronics, Kh director, etc.

 

[RedSea500MaxS]

Alkatronics, Kh director, etc.

Really...see I am new. Ion is a completely new word..Heck I thought Trident was coolest.

We started in 1980s in FL with under gravel filters! I put powerheads on mine and forced water down...so I did not have to clean the darn sand! It worked. John Nobel was just down the street and it was a lab experiment! My LWS wemnt diving with me a picked up rocks....now we call live rock. His 225 did AMAZING, we thought huh why.

Today is like iPhone to dial phone. Exciting. I want our animals to thrive...we all do. Not just for $, for Mother Nature and our Lord who created all things for us.

 

[shred5]

Really...see I am new. Ion is a completely new word..Heck I thought Trident was coolest.

We started in 1980s in FL with under gravel filters! I put powerheads on mine and forced water down...so I did not have to clean the darn sand! It worked. John Nobel was just down the street and it was a lab experiment! My LWS wemnt diving with me a picked up rocks....now we call live rock. His 225 did AMAZING, we thought huh why.

Today is like iPhone to dial phone. Exciting. I want our animals to thrive...we all do. Not just for $, for Mother Nature and our Lord who created all things for us.

Those are not Ion and as far as I know ALK is only reagent based for the near future.

 

[road_runner]

Really...see I am new. Ion is a completely new word..Heck I thought Trident was coolest.

We started in 1980s in FL with under gravel filters! I put powerheads on mine and forced water down...so I did not have to clean the darn sand! It worked. John Nobel was just down the street and it was a lab experiment! My LWS wemnt diving with me a picked up rocks....now we call live rock. His 225 did AMAZING, we thought huh why.

Today is like iPhone to dial phone. Exciting. I want our animals to thrive...we all do. Not just for $, for Mother Nature and our Lord who created all things for us.

None of these are ion testers.
Ion testers will be out in the coming couppe of months.
These are kh testers using regular titration methos.
Khg and alktrinics been in the market for long time now.
Kh director been there for an year I believe.
All of these including trident all use peristaltic dosers to creat the titration needed to calculate the kh..
Problem with peristaltic pumps is they need regular maintenance and change its tubing otherwise its accuracy degrade which will impact measurment.
Any peristaltic based equipment will require changing the pump tubing every xx months.
Some of these testers sell sub assembly of the pump head you can just change in house like alktronic and kh director. Usually cost is around 30 to 50$

Others sell the tubing whichnos bit harder to change cause it require you open the head itself like kh guardian. Cost is much less(5$) but remember you need to change the tubing yourself

It is not clear how maintenance will be done on the trident, there are couple of infos here and there but it's not really clear how much and how easy it is. I have heard 150$ and 99$. Also early launch there was talk about customer send the unit to Neptune for maintenance, or do DIY kit, which might indicate the proccess is not easy for every customer to do.... still yet to be seen.

In couple.of months ion based testers should be out then it will be seen how good or bad they are and what's the best use case for them.

 

[road_runner]

Here is quick summary for you to have fun reading

Mindstream(ion activated strip)..just released
https://www.mindstreamh2o.com

Kh director (titration kg test and dose), launched last year
https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/kh-d...f9iO6JHKCrvo7QCwmIBrCvY7AuTo9zWBoCHAIQAvD_BwE

Ion director(ion based tester) will launch sep-2019
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ion-director-from-ghl.572795/

(Kh guardian kh titration test) launches ~3 years ago
https://www.coralvue.com/kh-guardian-pro

Xepta(ion based test and dose)- will be released ~sep-2019
https://xepta-reef.com/en/


Alktrinics (Titration based kh test and dose) launched last year...I think
https://www.saltwateraquarium.com/o...-84QjTOntP1IK3rW7MeY8F3Mi698TIEhoCclgQAvD_BwE

And finally
Trident.. launched but very limited quantities and not available yet..
https://aquarium.bulkreefsupply.com...sAgN50VSBiqMystRjM5OuNfrMmLK8TTBoCGisQAvD_BwE

 

[powdertang05]

Just FYI kh guardian is now discontinued. They are only selling the alkatronic now. Coralvue informed me.

 

[vangvace]

I think Alk will be tested by titration, only machine I know that do not require it is the mindstream.

Mindstream isn't testing Alk the same way the tritation products test either. It will measure one of the ions that makes up Alk and ignore the rest. Maybe it'll use some fuzzy math on the backside based on ratios found in NSW for total alk, but dunno.

 

[road_runner]

Mindstream isn't testing Alk the same way the tritation products test either. It will measure one of the ions that makes up Alk and ignore the rest. Maybe it'll use some fuzzy math on the backside based on ratios found in NSW for total alk, but dunno.

Correct, sorry, I was referring to the common ones.
Mindstream is very disruptive and innovative equipment.

 

[road_runner]

Just FYI kh guardian is now discontinued. They are only selling the alkatronic now. Coralvue informed me.

Not correct. Coral vue stopped selling cause they want to double down on xepta.
Yoi can now get khg pro(dose and test) for around 500$ directly from the source.
friend of mind just got his.
As a matter of fact I just recently added 3rd unit to my setups that I purchased 2 months ago

 

[TheGreatWave]

Are the lights not complicated enough? I like toys etc but honestly my eyes roll back in my head when I read about these things, I really don't know what they are. I intentionally skipped to the end of this thread so that I would gain no insight. It's an order of magnitude beyond a controller and I am just not interested, I'm still learning how to analog reef. Ignorantly blissful.

I sold my Apex because honestly there is something romantic about those wall timers. So satisfying to have explored and set all the options of said device.

lol I shuddered when I briefly read about the nuances using API tests kits with particular robots. I'll leave it to you crazy reefers to sort out whatever this thing is, by then I will consider buying this machine and associated paraphernalia, cloud service and all, when it when the bugs are worked out of or into it.

This thing has to be good to be on wait lists. So what does it do? Must have something to do with AEFW or Aiptasia? Does it wam-bam the dreaded Dianos? Man now I am curious lol. How much and how long until I get one?