Using Osmolator 3 nano on 370 liter

[David Zencak]

I am upgrading the tank from nano 90 liters to 370 liter tank a would love to reuse new Osmolator 3 nano if possible. I see the pumps are same. After the installation, the pump adds just a bit of water, running no more than 10 seconds. It repeats after 20 or so minutes. Can I set it to add more water when it is on? Can I upgrade ATO for larger tank or it is necessary to buy a complete new set? Thanks!

 

[Troylee]

You should be able to use it on any tank. I have a nano one on my 300 gallon tank lol..

 

[rvitko Verified Sponsor]

The issue with the nano is primarily that it can only add water for a very short time before it shuts off, while the pump is basically the same, the cable is different and the pumps do not interchange. The Nano was built to be an economical product, the cables were changed to a much less expensive off the shelf cable vs the custom German made Y cable on the Osmolator 3 and the safety sensor was replaced by a short time limit. The logic being that a nano is a small investment, but if you have a full blown large reef tank, cutting corners on an ATO is not the best idea. It may work, you can extend the time limit as shown in the manual, but this is still only rated to 66 gallons. It will depend on the size of the return chamber and evaporation rate, with that said it is a risk and it would be best to choose the appropriate system, when you have tens of thousands in livestock it simply justifies the higher price when that may not be justifiable on a simple nano.

 

[David Zencak]

The issue with the nano is primarily that it can only add water for a very short time before it shuts off, while the pump is basically the same, the cable is different and the pumps do not interchange. The Nano was built to be an economical product, the cables were changed to a much less expensive off the shelf cable vs the custom German made Y cable on the Osmolator 3 and the safety sensor was replaced by a short time limit. The logic being that a nano is a small investment, but if you have a full blown large reef tank, cutting corners on an ATO is not the best idea. It may work, you can extend the time limit as shown in the manual, but this is still only rated to 66 gallons. It will depend on the size of the return chamber and evaporation rate, with that said it is a risk and it would be best to choose the appropriate system, when you have tens of thousands in livestock it simply justifies the higher price when that may not be justifiable on a simple nano.

Fully understood, I thought it will be like that...but I had to try :-) Thanks for such a comprehensive answer, I appreciate it!

 

[David Zencak]

One more question, does it make sense to use just the pump from new Osmolator 3 on older full scale osmolator? Will it work well? The old pump is super noisy...

 

[Troylee]

One more question, does it make sense to use just the pump from new Osmolator 3 on older full scale osmolator? Will it work well? The old pump is super noisy...

It should work fine! It’s an upgraded pump.

 

[rvitko Verified Sponsor]

There are 3 seperate versions of the high jet and they do not interchange.

5000.021 is specifically made to retrofit 3155 and 3152, it has a driver built in to interpret the simple voltage signal from these older controllers.

The Osmolator 3 and Osmolator 3 Nano use a different variation of this pump that has no driver, the driver is instead built into the controller and they use seperate connectors largely based on cost, the water proof connection on the Osmolator 3 being considerably more expensive than the jack plug on the Osmolator 3 Nano. These pumps use 3 wire connections to communicate back and forth with the controller.

 

[Ziggy17]

The issue with the nano is primarily that it can only add water for a very short time before it shuts off, while the pump is basically the same, the cable is different and the pumps do not interchange. The Nano was built to be an economical product, the cables were changed to a much less expensive off the shelf cable vs the custom German made Y cable on the Osmolator 3 and the safety sensor was replaced by a short time limit. The logic being that a nano is a small investment, but if you have a full blown large reef tank, cutting corners on an ATO is not the best idea. It may work, you can extend the time limit as shown in the manual, but this is still only rated to 66 gallons. It will depend on the size of the return chamber and evaporation rate, with that said it is a risk and it would be best to choose the appropriate system, when you have tens of thousands in livestock it simply justifies the higher price when that may not be justifiable on a simple nano.

It’s just a sensor and the pump (pretty sure the same pump), why would you need the larger one? If the sensor is as accurate as they claim for both the nano and normal version, 0.5mm water depth change, then there wouldn’t be huge dumps of water at any time. How much are you evaporating? On my current system, 80g total volume, I evaporate between .5g-.7g per day. Which seems like a an acceptable and common range. So if you double that, the nano, should easily be able to handle 1-1.5g per day. How does the more expensive Osmolator 3 achieve that any better?

Would larger dosing heads be better for larger tanks?

Appears to be just marketing to me, but I’m definitely not an engineer.

 

[rtparty]

It’s just a sensor and the pump (pretty sure the same pump), why would you need the larger one? If the sensor is as accurate as they claim for both the nano and normal version, 0.5mm water depth change, then there wouldn’t be huge dumps of water at any time. How much are you evaporating? On my current system, 80g total volume, I evaporate between .5g-.7g per day. Which seems like a an acceptable and common range. So if you double that, the nano, should easily be able to handle 1-1.5g per day. How does the more expensive Osmolator 3 achieve that any better?

Would larger dosing heads be better for larger tanks?

Appears to be just marketing to me, but I’m definitely not an engineer.

So you don’t have both of them? Haven’t used both of them? Have no clue about their internals and how they’re made? And then you think Roger wrote all that out (clearly explaining they ARE NOT the same pump) all to make an extra $30-40 to tell someone the nano isn’t designed for large tanks?

Before you say it, retail pricing between the two versions might be $100 but it’s not $100 difference at wholesale

I’ve been asking Roger questions about Tunze for well over 10 years now. Probably closer to 15. He has never once upsold me anything. He either tells me exactly what he thinks will work or has even told me why a Tunze may not work for my situation.

 

[Ziggy17]

So you don’t have both of them? Haven’t used both of them? Have no clue about their internals and how they’re made? And then you think Roger wrote all that out (clearly explaining they ARE NOT the same pump) all to make an extra $30-40 to tell someone the nano isn’t designed for large tanks?

Before you say it, retail pricing between the two versions might be $100 but it’s not $100 difference at wholesale

I’ve been asking Roger questions about Tunze for well over 10 years now. Probably closer to 15. He has never once upsold me anything. He either tells me exactly what he thinks will work or has even told me why a Tunze may not work for my situation.

He actually says, “the pump is basically the same”.
And then he explains that the connector on the nano isn’t as good as the regular. Ok, but is not as good mean it’s junk? I doubt Tunze is going to manufacturer something that isn’t good quality. Plus you get a 5 year warranty on both, so if a connector goes in the 5 years, it’s under warranty.
And we have a valued member who states the nano works perfectly on his 300g…. So, there’s that.

 

[Ziggy17]

all to make an extra $30-40 to tell someone the nano isn’t designed for large tanks?

Before you say it, retail pricing between the two versions might be $100 but it’s not $100 difference at wholesale

Couple factors that can’t be overlooked with your statement.

1)economy of scale- the more they sell of the product, the less it becomes to manufacture said product. Increases profits.
2) law of large numbers. So is it just to make $30-$40 more, not even close. If 1 million reefers are going to buy a Tunze ATO, and you can capture half of that market, in this case, those with larger tanks, and you can offer a different more expensive product marketed for them, you increase profits, especially when they share most of the same R&D.

I don’t know who Roger is, and I’m sure he is a fantastic resource, but that doesn’t mean the nano can’t be used successfully on a larger tank, given this set of circumstances. Does he work for Tunze? If he does, he wouldn’t have a job very long if he went on the largest reef site in the world and advised that a nano is fine for large tanks, even though they’re marketing something different for the above reasons.

So yeah…. At the end of the day, it’s just my single opinion, and those are the reasons I have it. I could be absolutely wrong, and if I am, I’ll own it. I’m not married to it.

 

[rtparty]

Couple factors that can’t be overlooked with your statement.

1)economy of scale- the more they sell of the product, the less it becomes to manufacture said product. Increases profits.
2) law of large numbers. So is it just to make $30-$40 more, not even close. If 1 million reefers are going to buy a Tunze ATO, and you can capture half of that market, in this case, those with larger tanks, and you can offer a different more expensive product marketed for them, you increase profits, especially when they share most of the same R&D.

I don’t know who Roger is, and I’m sure he is a fantastic resource, but that doesn’t mean the nano can’t be used successfully on a larger tank, given this set of circumstances. Does he work for Tunze? If he does, he wouldn’t have a job very long if he went on the largest reef site in the world and advised that a nano is fine for large tanks, even though they’re marketing something different for the above reasons.

So yeah…. At the end of the day, it’s just my single opinion, and those are the reasons I have it. I could be absolutely wrong, and if I am, I’ll own it. I’m not married to it.

Roger is Tunze USA. He’s been their rep here for decades

You think the hobby is way larger than it is if you think “law of large numbers” is going to effect the hobby.

A lot of hobbyists use equipment outside the scope of how it was designed or intended. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s being used outside the intended purpose

 

[Ziggy17]

A lot of hobbyists use equipment outside the scope of how it was designed or intended. Doesn’t change the fact that it’s being used outside the intended purpose

Not disputing that point at all. But keeping the focus on this particular instance, let’s looks at the similarities of the two.

Same pump.
Same ability to deliver fresh water 50ml per minute.
Same water level sensor
Same abrasion resistant cable made in Germany

The only differences appears to be a secondary thermal sensor as an emergency shut off and the magnets ability to work at 15mm glass thickness instead of 10mm on the non nano. Those in themselves wouldn’t determine the ability to deliver to a larger tank if your sump glass was 10mm or under.

I’m just looking at the black and white facts published by Tunze themselves. Not making any assumptions or attributions.

 

[rvitko Verified Sponsor]

This is really simple, the Osmolator 3 Nano is geared toward a very basic set up, something with a minimal investment, a basic nano. It is intended to be more of a beginners product. It only makes sense that if you have a considerable livestock investment or a more elaborate set up you would want the additional safety sensor and longer fill times. The only safety on the 3151 is a time limit, it has no safety sensor, this time limit is very short, so if you try to run it on a larger system and you were gone, and it times out, it is not ever filling again until someone manually resets it, this is a risk that is not worth it to save the price of a nice frag. You can certainly do what you wish, but don't expect much sympathy when it does not work out, there is no upgrade path between the two units, and for me, the main thing I want to avoid is "it doesn't work", it does work, but only when used the way it is intended and that is a simple system under 60 gallons and even then, if this is a more serious SPS reef, it would be well worth the extra expense for the Osmolator 3.

 

[rvitko Verified Sponsor]

And no, they do not use the same cable, the Osmolator 3 Nano uses 2 cables that are standard off the shelf cables, the Y cable on the Osmolator 3 is a custom made German cable. The Osmolator 3 can fill for 10 minutes, the Osmolator 3 Nano is 77 or 154 seconds fill time. The Osmolator 3 can give the pump enough power for 20 ft of head pressure, the Osmolator 3 Nano can only do about 9ft. These are considerably different systems despite looking the same in some regards.

 

[Ziggy17]

And no, they do not use the same cable, the Osmolator 3 Nano uses 2 cables that are standard off the shelf cables, the Y cable on the Osmolator 3 is a custom made German cable. The Osmolator 3 can fill for 10 minutes, the Osmolator 3 Nano is 77 or 154 seconds fill time. The Osmolator 3 can give the pump enough power for 20 ft of head pressure, the Osmolator 3 Nano can only do about 9ft. These are considerably different systems despite looking the same in some regards.

That’s from your site. Both say German cable, no mention of a second German cable.
The pump is the replacement for both the Nano and the regular, as per the literature on the pump box itself, so same pump with the same 20’ head ability, again, as per your literature. See last photo. So is your literature inaccurate?

 

[Ziggy17]

This is really simple, the Osmolator 3 Nano is geared toward a very basic set up, something with a minimal investment, a basic nano. It is intended to be more of a beginners product. It only makes sense that if you have a considerable livestock investment or a more elaborate set up you would want the additional safety sensor and longer fill times. The only safety on the 3151 is a time limit, it has no safety sensor, this time limit is very short, so if you try to run it on a larger system and you were gone, and it times out, it is not ever filling again until someone manually resets it, this is a risk that is not worth it to save the price of a nice frag. You can certainly do what you wish, but don't expect much sympathy when it does not work out, there is no upgrade path between the two units, and for me, the main thing I want to avoid is "it doesn't work", it does work, but only when used the way it is intended and that is a simple system under 60 gallons and even then, if this is a more serious SPS reef, it would be well worth the extra expense for the Osmolator 3.

If the pump timed out, and you turned it off on the Apex, and then turned it back on, would it reset?