Of course it’s not dominant on a reef. And then, how much of what we put in our tanks is dominant on a reef?Carbon source. Heterotrophic bacteria that's not dominate on a reef? No thanks.
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Of course it’s not dominant on a reef. And then, how much of what we put in our tanks is dominant on a reef?Carbon source. Heterotrophic bacteria that's not dominate on a reef? No thanks.
Carbon doseVinegar can be a food source for some bacteria so my guess is it is included for the bacteria and not in itself directly related to the algae elimination.
None here. That's the problem.Of course it’s not dominant on a reef. And then, how much of what we put in our tanks is dominant on a reef?
We need to figure this out. I'll submit a sample of Vibrant for microbiome sequencing at our core facility to determine the bacterial strains present as I don't like to use proprietary biological products without knowledge of the actual ingredients. I think the 3.5% is simply RO/DI water as stated and the 95% cultured bacterial blend is the spent culture medium used to grow the bacterial blend - this is of course mostly water (>99%).
95% Cultured Bacteria Blend
1% Amino Acids (Aspartic Acid)
0.5% Vinegar - This is used as the preservative
3.5% Other Ingredients (RO/DI Water)
We need to figure this out. I'll submit a sample of Vibrant for microbiome sequencing at our core facility to determine the bacterial strains present as I don't like to use proprietary biological products without knowledge of the actual ingredients. I think the 3.5% is simply RO/DI water as stated and the 95% cultured bacterial blend is the spent culture medium used to grow the bacterial blend - this is of course mostly water (>99%).
95% Cultured Bacteria Blend
1% Amino Acids (Aspartic Acid)
0.5% Vinegar - This is used as the preservative
3.5% Other Ingredients (RO/DI Water)
It works, but you need to be careful with it. I used it once, it took a long time to get out of my system. Months. I'll carbon dose, but that's it. And I'll stop that when the #'s get down. But not to zero. I'm just not a big fan of throwing "cures" at a tank. Time and patience will take care of most things.
please don’t continue tasting random bacterial mixtures..This post might create a bunch of grief, but whatever....
So, we know that Vibrant isn't snake oil. It actually does perform work/action on algae and water clarity. This has been proven time and time again even though some will argue one way or the other while stating that it has hurt their tanks. It's a little bit of a mixed bag, but by my account the stuff works.
With that said, I think there is much to be known or should be known about the product. I'd like to try to reduce the mystery around the product and really dig in to know what is in it. It doesn't have to be the exact recipe, but I really think we should all know more about this and really anything we put in our tanks given the amount of investments we have all made. If this has been hashed over, please let me know and close the thread.
What I know.
Back of the bottle:
95% Cultured Bacteria Blend <-Check... So, some kind of bacterium with (salt)water
1% Amino Acids (Aspartic Acid) <- Check... an α-amino acid that is used in the biosynthesis of proteins. Food for bacteria while in bottle? Has a PH of 7.4.
.5% Vinegar <- Check... Ph of 2.4. .5% vinegar solution in solution of water gives a ph of 3.58. This level of PH will prevent "bad bacteria" such as botulism.
3.5% Other Ingredients <-Check... What is this? I would think the liquid portion would be included in the 95%. So, this begs to answer this question.
I measured the salinity of Vibrant to be 65ppt or 1.05sg. Obviously higher than our reef aquariums. This makes me question which type of bacteria live in that high of a salinity. My quick research on this lead me to the phyla Cyanobacteria, Proteobacteria, Firmicutes, Actinobacteria, Spirochaetes, and Bacteroidetes.
Other properties to note: Odorless and colorless. Taste (yes I tasted) is something not only like vinegar, but chalky dry tart. It was a strange sensation before I quickly washed my mouth out. It reminded of something like a salt substitute for food. Maybe sodium chloride like or some other kind of salt.
Given the salinity and taste, it makes me wonder what that 3.5% is. I'm wondering if there is some type of synthetic algaecide in this. Being "reef safe", I would think not something made with copper. Given the taste with the salinity level, I'm thinking about some kind of algacidal salt such as Cyanuric chloride.
Anyway, I would love to hear people's thoughts on this and break this mystery of what actually Vibrant is. I do not believe that it is only a "Cultured Bacterial Blend" that is having the success in the tank that I have seen.
I've attached pictures of my tank to demonstrate my experience in a 2 week period of time.
Please share your thoughts.
You've obviously never done any natural fermentations. PH can indicate/dictate if there is anything dangerous in a liquid. The nose knows. Lastly, I've been practicing brewing with wild yeast and bacteria for over a decade. You get more bad bacteria in your nose, ears, and mouth when you go to a lake and swim than anywhere because the PH doesn't kill off the bad stuff.please don’t continue tasting random bacterial mixtures..
Additionally you do realize the actual creator of vibrant is here, why not ask them directly!This post might create a bunch of grief, but whatever....
So, we know that Vibrant isn't snake oil. It actually does perform work/action on algae and water clarity. This has been proven time and time again even though some will argue one way or the other while stating that it has hurt their tanks. It's a little bit of a mixed bag, but by my account the stuff works.
With that said, I think there is much to be known or should be known about the product. I'd like to try to reduce the mystery around the product and really dig in to know what is in it. It doesn't have to be the exact recipe, but I really think we should all know more about this and really anything we put in our tanks given the amount of investments we have all made. If this has been hashed over, please let me know and close the thread.
What I know.
Back of the bottle:
95% Cultured Bacteria Blend <-Check... So, some kind of bacterium with (salt)water
1% Amino Acids (Aspartic Acid) <- Check... an α-amino acid that is used in the biosynthesis of proteins. Food for bacteria while in bottle? Has a PH of 7.4.
.5% Vinegar <- Check... Ph of 2.4. .5% vinegar solution in solution of water gives a ph of 3.58. This level of PH will prevent "bad bacteria" such as botulism.
3.5% Other Ingredients <-Check... What is this? I would think the liquid portion would be included in the 95%. So, this begs to answer this question.
I measured the salinity of Vibrant to be 65ppt or 1.05sg. Obviously higher than our reef aquariums. This makes me question which type of bacteria live in that high of a salinity. My quick research on this lead me to the phyla Cyanobacteria, Proteobacteria, Firmicutes, Actinobacteria, Spirochaetes, and Bacteroidetes.
Other properties to note: Odorless and colorless. Taste (yes I tasted) is something not only like vinegar, but chalky dry tart. It was a strange sensation before I quickly washed my mouth out. It reminded of something like a salt substitute for food. Maybe sodium chloride like or some other kind of salt.
Given the salinity and taste, it makes me wonder what that 3.5% is. I'm wondering if there is some type of synthetic algaecide in this. Being "reef safe", I would think not something made with copper. Given the taste with the salinity level, I'm thinking about some kind of algacidal salt such as Cyanuric chloride.
Anyway, I would love to hear people's thoughts on this and break this mystery of what actually Vibrant is. I do not believe that it is only a "Cultured Bacterial Blend" that is having the success in the tank that I have seen.
I've attached pictures of my tank to demonstrate my experience in a 2 week period of time.
Please share your thoughts.
Yeah ok, I have post-graduate degrees in science but your post is so compelling I‘m going to suggest people drink bacterial products. /sarcasmLots of he said, they say,
You've obviously never done any natural fermentations. PH can indicate/dictate if there is anything dangerous in a liquid. The nose knows. Lastly, I've been practicing brewing with wild yeast and bacteria for over a decade. You get more bad bacteria in your nose, ears, and mouth when you go to a lake and swim than anywhere because the PH doesn't kill off the bad stuff.
I'm seeing a lot of people that want to dismiss the subject and don't seem to care about the science or understanding with what makes all this stuff work. I'm just jumping back into the hobby and think it's funny the knowledge base doesn't seem to have expanded to the point I think it should have when I got out 12 years ago.
I like to reference my brewing background when talking about all this because I'm seeing many parallels. Let me introduce some thoughts. It's listed as a bacterial blend. If bacteria are isolated, defined, and understood - you can more easily predict the end result of the issue you are trying to tackle. This is very much like a flavor profile. If you have a yeast or bacteria isolate, you can more accurately predict the end product of the beer you are fermenting. I can promise you that all brewing yeast labs aren't this secretive about their products as Vibrant is.
We should know what is making up this bacterial blend. It's not about saving money, diy, or whatever else has been accused. It's about getting educated and understanding a process without regurgitating what he/she said in the past with out know. This equates to someone saying "I don't know, but I'm going to tell you". =\
We apparently have some scientists in here. I look forward to seeing what Courtney Aldrich, PhD is able to find out.
Because they will not say. It's been asked. So, it is our job to discover and do the analysis. What are the bacteria strains and what is that 3.5% "other" ingredients. That's the question(s).Additionally you do realize the actual creator of vibrant is here, why not ask them directly!
this is a little bit of an overreaction which was the point of the humor I thoughtYeah ok, I have post-graduate degrees in science but your post is so compelling I‘m going to suggest people drink bacterial products. /sarcasm
Since some folks apparently need this, please DO NOT DRINK FISH TANK BACTERIAL ADDITIVES.
That's silly. Did I say I drink it? Has anyone ever siphoned out their tank and got a mouth full of salt water?Yeah ok, I have post-graduate degrees in science but your post is so compelling I‘m going to suggest people drink bacterial products. /sarcasm
Since some folks apparently need this, please DO NOT DRINK FISH TANK BACTERIAL ADDITIVES.