Algae Scrubber Basics

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There is an argument for "full spectrum" but that argument is primarily centered around chlorophyll and plants - not chlorophyll and algae.

I've seen this argument go both ways with logic and reason and the only thing I can back up my advice with is long-term experience. Red (deep red, 660ish) and violet ("hyper" violet, under 420) work well on algae. Originally it was red/blue (royal blue 445-455) but that was mainly because violets were expensive and unreliable (no longer the case).

Most of the stock fixtures are 660 red (maybe, usually a mix of 630/660) and RB 450 because those are cheap and available. For plants, I heard from a hort guy long ago that 660/450 doesn't work well because it's limited spectrum. Plants actually need more full spectrum light. So you're seeing the LED grow light market catch up after the craze of "GO LED OMG" has caught up to the reality that it's more than that, spectral tuning is important - tuned to what you need to grow. Growth vs budding/flowering stages = different spectra. NOAA still uses T12 VHO if that tells you anything (not kidding). So does the USDA Lab at ISU in Ames, IA (I've been inside their climate sim chambers for growing corn in different conditions, biggest lab in the US for that type of thing BTW).

Basically, if you get a fixture that is as heavy in the warm/red spectrum as you can get, you should be OK - but verify before trusting (buy one, try it) and see if they have a return policy (never hurts to ask) then protect the fixture just in case (so it doesn't get salt creep all over it). If memory serves me correctly, "growth" will lean warm white/red, and "budding/flowering" will lean more heavily into cool white and blue (you don't want that).

Intensity is another thing that most fixtures aren't made for - for plants, you don't want massive amounts of focused light, you want to spread it out. In a plant room, you put the light up higher to spread it out instead of placing the lamp 1" from the plant. We actually do that, but the difference is the plant isn't being provided nutrients to the surface with water rapidly flowing across it. So a specialized application doesn't demand that everyone make a fixture that works for it, making them hard to find (and apparently it's getting harder).

{Rant off}
 

andika

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so far my DIY ATS run well ..
no3 at 0.2
po4 at 0.028
(last parameter check this week)

im thinking why the coral looks good with this parameter (LPS dominated tank + some sps frag) while i read almost fb / group post that said no3 should maintain at 2-10 ppm , po4 at 0.05 - 0.1 ppm for LPS ..
137090036_10158903869768630_3489214891455997713_n.jpg 136769038_10158903869738630_3017894114964934213_n.jpg

i read also about what algae result from photosynthesis,
the result is glucose and oxygen ...
is bacteria use glucose as a carbon source to reproduce apart from no3 , po4 ?
as i know, bacteria is one of the corals food right ?
 
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ajjw0828

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Well just read through this entire thread and wow! What a great thread it is, tons of info! First off thanks to @Turbo's Aquatics for all the great information. It should most definitely be a sticky on the DIY page. Have a few questions I was hoping you might clarify for me.
1.) Do you or others you've worked with notice a rise in pH / what does your tank normally run at with this installed?
2.) Do you have issues with stripping nitrates and phosphates to zero. I'm guessing this is why you recommend sizing based off how much you feed?
3.) It sound like you recommend the mesh resting it the water is that correct?
4.) Can you list what LED's you buy from Steve's LED's? I'd be interested in trying some. Sounds like 660nm in a 7 to 1 ratio with some 435nm?

I may end up just waiting for your Rev 5 to come out but I don't know if I will have the patience! LOL.
 

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I have built 2 DIY waterfall ATSs in my time bith grew GHA and Ulva very well under warm white floodlights. I later bought a secondhand Turbo scrubber somebody had imported into the UK, great scrubber but when I upgraded to a much larger tank I bought an Atlantis 3. The Turbo I had no problem selling on.

Now if we only had a Turbo Aquatics stocking LFS here in the UK. I know one shop considered stocking them but decided it was not economically viable which is a shame. Maybe if we can get some sort of post Brexit trade agreement with the US that might change, I hope so.
 
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1.) Do you or others you've worked with notice a rise in pH / what does your tank normally run at with this installed?
Your pH should rise when running the lights compared to when you are not - this depends on timing. So if you run the scrubber at night when the DT lights are off, it will help keep pH from dropping. If you run during the day, it might not make a noticable difference
2.) Do you have issues with stripping nitrates and phosphates to zero. I'm guessing this is why you recommend sizing based off how much you feed?
This can happen when you run the lights on an aggressive intensity/duration schedule compared to your feeding and/or nutrient levels. It's a balance that you have to find.
3.) It sound like you recommend the mesh resting it the water is that correct?
If it is an open-air scrubber, yes - that helps keep the water splashing down, that's the only reason for doing that really
4.) Can you list what LED's you buy from Steve's LED's? I'd be interested in trying some. Sounds like 660nm in a 7 to 1 ratio with some 435nm?
660nm Deep Red and 415nm Hyper Violet. Royal Blue (435, 445, etc) are OK but HVs work slightly better and don't create hotspots (areas with zero growth in a circle right in front of the lights is related to photosaturation - intensity too high for too long)

so far my DIY ATS run well ..
no3 at 0.2
po4 at 0.028
(last parameter check this week)

im thinking why the coral looks good with this parameter (LPS dominated tank + some sps frag) while i read almost fb / group post that said no3 should maintain at 2-10 ppm , po4 at 0.05 - 0.1 ppm for LPS ..
See my response above to #2, as long as you are feeding adequately and not running the scrubber too aggressive, you should be able to find a balance. Keep an eye on the corals and dial the scrubber back if nutrients bottom out - that does happen.
 

SantaMonica

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If anyone would like scrubber basics going back to 2008, it is available here:


When I designed the first waterfall scrubber in 2008, and then the first bubble upflow scrubber in 2011, I posted it there.
 
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IMO dual screens are not necessary. Eventually, it will just grow on one side of each screen, and the inside face of each screen will get no light so each of those will be considered single-sided. A single sided screen is arguably less than half as effective as a double-sided screen that is half the size (LxW) since the light doesn't hit it from both sides.
 

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Finally got the new tank running a bout a month ago and hooked my DIY ATS today. I cut up the screen from my old scrubber and sewed it to the new one with fishing line, two pieces on each side.
I was looking in here for information on how much light intensity or duration to use starting out but haven't found it yet. Would appreciate any tips on that!

20210905_ats.jpg
 
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I'd start out with 9 hrs/day. Intensity is relative to the fixture and proximity so that's more of a judgement call. Spectrum on that fixture looks very white so that is also a factor. Too many variables to give you a good answer IMO, just see how it goes and make adjustments as needed
 

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Thanks for the help! I have it set to 100w per side measured at the outlet. I have a seneye par meter, would that help at all?
 
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Not really, IMO PAR isn't a very accurate way to measure when it comes to algae scrubbers, that is usually because of the amount of red. When you are using a deep red fixture, you need a spectrometer. I don't have one but Steve's LEDs does and theirs runs about $10k. White light will grow algae but IME it's very hit or miss so you have to just see how it goes.
 

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I have the Turbo Aquatics L16 and couldnt be happier with it. Just needs a few tweaks here n there. Like one long screen instead of two seperate ones attached to each other. Bud was helpful during the install.
 

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Here is an update around the one month mark.
Looks like it is working well. Having 22 well fed fish (maybe overfeed since I was trying to keep down aggression as they were all added over a week) helped with growth on the ATS. The mature screen pieces that I stitched in there are buried, not sure that was necessary but might have helped. Don't think I would ever keep a reef tank without an ATS.
@Turbo's Aquatics wondering what your thoughts are on ATS being a safety net for removing heavy metals and preventing them from accumulating? That seems to me to be a huge advantage.
I think I might have gotten a small amount of copper from my fish QT into my Coral QT and along with some neglect, total wipeout. Even bullet proof gorgonians died. Sole survivor was one paly colony. It might no0t have been the copper, it might have just been a chain reaction with dead coral soup becoming more and more deadly but coincidentally happened when I reused a bucket from the copper treated fish QT tanks.


20211008_163230.jpg
 
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Algae will definitely remove heavy metal contaminants, but the rate of uptake in a reef tank is really not well documented or studied. I know people who have treated a tank with copper - which has historically been the death blow for keeping corals and inverts along with whatever live rock was in the tank - and have been able to keep corals and inverts. I can't recall the timeframe from removal of copper from the water column to the time when they could keep corals/inverts but I believe it was in the range of 6-12 months.
 

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28 watt grow light from menards it has a green bottom and 3 times the size of a standard light bulb. Red with a couple blues grows algea like crazy. They have a 9 watt and a 42 watt that was as big as a street light bulb. 28 works for me .
 

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You would be right! That is the one. I cut a hole on top of my sump put the light in from inside to the green part of the light . Put two screens in the sump 10x 14 they are lit only on one side. If I let them go for a month a funky ball type algea grows right on top of the hair algea it is kind of cool. And I get some slime balls floating inbetween the screens. But I have been cleaning one screen on the weekend the other on the next. It keeps my nutrients to low. Tried one screen then I get the swing affect.
 

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