Bottomed out nitrates/phosphates???

[xiholdtruex]

The oddest thing happend to me today. Came home to find all my toadstool leathers wilted and closed up along with 1 of my nephthea corals close up also looking the worst I have ever seen them. Took some water samples and dosed some api water conditioner similar to prime and tossed in a media cup a sheet of poly filter. Tested my water and my nitrates were bottomed out to 0 my phosphates at .13 and my alk rose to 9dkh. Saturday I tested and my nitrates was at 13 my phosphate at .81 and my alk was at 8.6dkh.Yesterday all I did was my normal 10g WC on my 90g reef and changed phosguard and carbon which I have been doing weekly for around 6 months without much change.Test with my Hanna testers and salifert and getting the same results. What I did do yesterday was clean out my kitchen and had some grain weevils that took up residence and cleaned out all my cabinets and counter tops with some 70 and 90% alcohol. Only thing I could think of is it some how made it toward the tank and acted like a massive carbon dose.
Dosed 20ml of neo notro to raise my nitrates up to 2ppm and now my corals are starting to open back up again. My kitchen is around 30ft from my tanks as a reference.

Any input or suggestions are welcome.

Thanks in advance

 

[Miami Reef]

Yesterday all I did was my normal 10g WC on my 90g reef and changed phosguard

Ding ding ding!!!

The nitrate was the red herring.

Phosguard releases particulate and soluble aluminum, which has shown to irritate and cause leather corals to retract and shrivel.

I will bring up the study. Please don’t use phosguard anymore.

 

[moretor1]

are you washing your phosguard? I've found using less is more. just change it more often until it's at what you want
If i add even 80% of the instructed dosage my corals get ticked off

50%+ swings in phosphate in less than 24 hours is very stressful

My dosage is supposed to be 1.5 tablespoons and i do .5

 

[xiholdtruex]

Ding ding ding!!!

The nitrate was the red herring.

Phosguard releases soluble aluminum, which has shown to irritate and cause leather corals to retract and shrivel.

I will bring up the study. Please don’t use phosguard anymore.

I have read that article by @Randy Holmes-Farley . I have used phosguard for yrs and flush it threw 5g of water in my reactor prior to use. Never had any issues with my leathers or bottoming out of nutrients from phosguard though

 

[xiholdtruex]

are you washing your phosguard? I've found using less is more. just change it more often until it's at what you want
If i add even 80% of the instructed dosage my corals get ticked off

50%+ swings in phosphate in less than 24 hours is very stressful

My dosage is supposed to be 1.5 tablespoons and i do .5

Flushing my reactor threw 5g of water prior to use

 

[moretor1]

I have read that article by @Randy Holmes-Farley . I have used phosguard for yrs and flush it threw 5g of water in my reactor prior to use. Never had any issues with my leathers or bottoming out of nutrients from phosguard though

i wouldnt run it in a reactor tbh, the beads are large enough that you arent going to get clumps without flow if you just throw it in a part of your filter baffle

The reactor tumbles them around and they create aluminum particulates that build up

 

[Miami Reef]

I have read that article by @Randy Holmes-Farley . I have used phosguard for yrs and flush it threw 5g of water in my reactor prior to use. Never had any issues with my leathers or bottoming out of nutrients from phosguard though

OK. Raising the nitrate is a good idea if you think they are lacking it.

I’m not sure if using phosguard in a reactor is the best idea, especially if it tumbles.

I personally wouldn’t ever use phosguard. I see no point in risking it.

It takes a few days for the corals to perk up after the aluminum. It’s very possible that bound organics help it get skimmed out. Still, I’d never use it.

 

[moretor1]

since you already have a reactor i would just switch to GFO. The only reason i dont is because i dont have a reactor...

It's cheaper and more predictable irc

 

[xiholdtruex]

Thank you for all the input everyone I appreciate it very much. shut the reactor off last night till everything gets sorted out. Retested all my nutrients again and nitrate is back down to 0ppm phosphate is now at 0ppm and all is at 9.1dkh. Corals are all perking back up. Dosed up nitrate again and phosphate will retest in around a hour to make sure the dosage is actually showing up

 

[Miami Reef]

I like to dose 0.10ppm PO4 and 10ppm nitrate in one shot.

The phosphate will get bound to rocks, so this extra buffer will help get that process quicker.

You also don’t need to test nearly as much. The corals will have enough N & P, which is the goal.

Dosing a tiny amount and testing daily to watch it go to zero does not seem efficient.

 

[xiholdtruex]

I like to dose 0.10ppm PO4 and 10ppm nitrate in one shot.

The phosphate will get bound to rocks, so this extra buffer will help get that process quicker.

You also don’t need to test nearly as much. The corals will have enough N & P, which is the goal.

Dosing a tiny amount and testing daily to watch it go to zero does not seem efficient.

I dosed last night at 12am up to 5ppm no3 and po4 was at 0.13
It's so weird though because Saturday my po4 was at 0.83ppm and nitrate was at 13.3ppm have been keeping it consistently. Testing weekly.

I have been fighting phosphate for 6 months.

Just a note when I cleaned the kitchen 30ft from my tanks on sunday with my weevil issue I used 3 bottles of 32oZ of rubbing alcohol. So I'm thinking the vapor maybe acted like a huge carbon dose.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I dosed last night at 12am up to 5ppm no3 and po4 was at 0.13
It's so weird though because Saturday my po4 was at 0.83ppm and nitrate was at 13.3ppm have been keeping it consistently. Testing weekly.

I have been fighting phosphate for 6 months.

Just a note when I cleaned the kitchen 30ft from my tanks on sunday with my weevil issue I used 3 bottles of 32oZ of rubbing alcohol. So I'm thinking the vapor maybe acted like a huge carbon dose.

Possible, yes. A skimmer would suck in the isopropanol and drive it into the water.

 

[SnownSky]

At a risk of thread highjacking, I'll add my current, similar situation.

Just passed 2 years into a healthy looking mixed reef 100g tank supported by a skimmer, filter sock (changed 2x weekly), and sump macro refugium w/14hrs of daily light. Other than 2 freebie SPS frags, I've had good success keeping things alive.

My Phos is consistently near zero so I dose Randy's Sodium Nitrate solution several times weekly. Alk/Calk/Mag have been stable within their suggested ranges for over a year with WC's and an occasional A4Reef dose. My nitrates have always run in the mid-high teens with occasional 20+ readings. October brought extended travels and despite Mrs' best attempts, my nitrate tested 30 upon my return with a dying hammer head and retracting brain coral flesh. A 30g WC plus adding nitrate reducing filter, increasing refugium light & skimmer run time followed by weekly 10-15g WC's began a downward nitrate trend with a target of single digit readings before backing off.
11/12: 30ppm
11/16: 25.4 (post 11/13 30g WC)
11/17: 18.8 (post 15g WC)
11/23: 19.5 (pre 10g WC)
11/29: 16.7. At this point PPM's were trending downward before WC' as the macro algae grew noticeably and the nitrate filters kicked in. I skipped a H2O change.
12/7; 10.6 (post 10g WC)
12/16: 9 ppm (post 10g H20 change)
12/25: 3.6 - Harvested macro, reduced refugium light time & skimmer run time.
1/2: 0ppm - removed nitrate filters.
1/9:0ppm.

Feeding schedule remained consistent throughout.

Do I start dosing nitrate 2 months after I scrambled to reduce it?

 

[xiholdtruex]

Possible, yes. A skimmer would suck in the isopropanol and drive it into the water.

Would having a reactor with carbon in the inlet of the skimmer airline filter out isopropyl in the future? Want to store it in my brain

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Would having a reactor with carbon in the inlet of the skimmer airline filter out isopropyl in the future? Want to store it in my brain

Some, but not all given how fast the air is likely moving through.

 

[rishma]

At a risk of thread highjacking, I'll add my current, similar situation.

Just passed 2 years into a healthy looking mixed reef 100g tank supported by a skimmer, filter sock (changed 2x weekly), and sump macro refugium w/14hrs of daily light. Other than 2 freebie SPS frags, I've had good success keeping things alive.

My Phos is consistently near zero so I dose Randy's Sodium Nitrate solution several times weekly. Alk/Calk/Mag have been stable within their suggested ranges for over a year with WC's and an occasional A4Reef dose. My nitrates have always run in the mid-high teens with occasional 20+ readings. October brought extended travels and despite Mrs' best attempts, my nitrate tested 30 upon my return with a dying hammer head and retracting brain coral flesh. A 30g WC plus adding nitrate reducing filter, increasing refugium light & skimmer run time followed by weekly 10-15g WC's began a downward nitrate trend with a target of single digit readings before backing off.
11/12: 30ppm
11/16: 25.4 (post 11/13 30g WC)
11/17: 18.8 (post 15g WC)
11/23: 19.5 (pre 10g WC)
11/29: 16.7. At this point PPM's were trending downward before WC' as the macro algae grew noticeably and the nitrate filters kicked in. I skipped a H2O change.
12/7; 10.6 (post 10g WC)
12/16: 9 ppm (post 10g H20 change)
12/25: 3.6 - Harvested macro, reduced refugium light time & skimmer run time.
1/2: 0ppm - removed nitrate filters.
1/9:0ppm.

Feeding schedule remained consistent throughout.

Do I start dosing nitrate 2 months after I scrambled to reduce it?

Third paragraph starts with My Phos is consistently near zero so I dose Randy's Sodium Nitrate solution

I’m confused by that.

Regarding dosing nitrate to keep it off zero, I think it’s a good idea, though admittedly I am in the process of letting my nitrate drift to zero to see what happens. I’ve always accepted that having measurable nitrate is a good idea, but I’m going to test that

 

[SnownSky]

Third paragraph starts with My Phos is consistently near zero so I dose Randy's Sodium Nitrate solution

I’m confused by that.

Regarding dosing nitrate to keep it off zero, I think it’s a good idea, though admittedly I am in the process of letting my nitrate drift to zero to see what happens. I’ve always accepted that having measurable nitrate is a good idea, but I’m going to test that

Yes indeed, I meant Randy’s phosphate concoction.