Considering a Lighting Change

hobbyreefer

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I have a 60" x 26" wide x 24" tank

Currently running a 48" Aquatic life T5 with 2 blue plus and 2 coral plus - I also have 5 Kessil 360x (1 every 12 inches)

I'm thinking about replacing my Kessil/T5 Hybrid with 3 XR-30s G5 or 4 XR-30s G4

Here are the reason:

  1. Tank is about 8 months old and I'm struggling with Acropora. I've put over 30 sticks in the tank and all have browned except for a few. I do have Monti's growing and coloring well. I don't think my lights are the issue but I'm just not sold on the Kessils for an Acropora dominated tank.
  2. Heat- my tank heats up ~4 degrees when the T5s run all day. I range from 76-80 each day. Again, I don't think this is my issue but LED only should resolve.
  3. Power cords. I need 6 power cords for the current setup. I believe 3 XR-30s would open up 3 outlets and reduce wires
  4. I just changed my t5 bulbs and I was actually a bit nervous about breaking them over the tank. I'm sure this is a non-issue but I'm listing it anyway.
  5. Along the same line as number four, I have the T5's mounted in studs in the ceiling. This has made me nervous from the beginning. I just don't trust my handyman skills enough to be 100% confident the lights won't fall in the tank!
My goal for this tank is 99% acropora. I just have a few monti's growing on the bare bottom.

It seems the gold standard for acropora is metal halides. I don't think that is an option for me.

I could go with a 8 bulb T5 fixture but I worry heat would be a bigger issue. I'm also not sure I would be happy with the look of the tank. When I run my T5s without the LEDs everything looks very dull. It might just be the bulb combo and not enough bulbs to light the entire tank.

What is everyone's thoughts on the XR 30s? I know there are a million threads on these lights and I've read most of them. I'm just asking do people think 3 or 4 XR30 would be an upgrade from my current setup for Acropora?

I'm not asking about the cost, or if the new lights have quality issues. Just asking about performance only vs my setup - if that makes sense.
 

TX_Punisher

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Why do you think/assume lighting is your problem? Have you measured PAR with that lighting setup?
 
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hobbyreefer

hobbyreefer

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I honestly don't believe lighting is my problem. However, I have seen a ton of awesome acropora tanks lit with XR30s. I've never actually seen one in person lit by Kessil/T5s. There are a few online... On the flip side, it's also easy to find folks who struggle with XR30s...

I first started with 3 Kessil 360x and the 4 T5s. I rented a par meter from BRS and was a bit surprised I was only getting 200-300 par in the tank. I've since added 2 more 360x (5 total). I have not measured par with the additional lights. I actually rented a par meter again yesterday so I will measure this weekend (Apogee 512 LED from BRS).

I run the 4 t5s from 8am-7pm and I run the kessils from 8am-8pm. The kessils ramp to high 100% intensity and back down. I have 5 hours at 100% full intensity.

There is so much advise, it makes it hard to know what to do. You can find awesome acropora tanks at 250 par and also at 700+ par. I see people doing it with black boxes and others with high end LEDs. Low nutrients and others with high nutrients, Calc Reactors and others with two part, live rock and others with dry rock only, etc.

Thanks for the response.
 

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In my experience brown’d or dried out looking sticks comes from stress/starvation. I doubt the your light is what’s causing the issue but a 4 degree swing every day probably isn’t helping. I agree the T5’s sounds like a pain in the neck.
 

DesertReefT4r

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Your current lighting system is solid and proven to grow sps. But man the new G5 Radions are sick. The coverage and very even spread they provide is the best in the industry. The new Blue version provides what 80% of hobbiest want as far as look goes with the heavy blue AB+ spectrum being built into this light. It takes the guess work out of setting up the light spectrum and all you need to do is dial in overall intensity, great for newer hobbiests. Of coarse the soild performance and spectrum flexibility of the Pro model for thise that want a whiter look or more spectrum control. Its really up to you if you want to change lighting. You can same some money going with 6 XR15s over the XR30s and you can get even better spread with more of the small fixtures. I would look at other factors formyour corals being browned. How old is the tank? Dry rock or live rock? Water parameters and stability especailly with alk, salinty and temp. Nutrient levels? How long are the lights running? Have you done any PAR testing?
 

blasterman

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Doing the math you should have enough light in that tank. Kessils have drab color because of their lack of warm spectrum, but the 360s have plenty of punch.

I agree with you about T5s being dull. Make a tank look like everything is made of plastic.

IMO The XRs are over rated and over priced. They have a small footprint and decent shimmer and more color flexibility than the Kessils but the price per watt is ridiculous. My suggestion is to get a $100 black box, park it low , crank it up, and see if corals underneath it perk up. If they dont, then lighting isnt your problem and you havent blown a wad on Radions. If it fixes the problem, sell the light for $50 and do what you want.
 

minus9

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I don't think I would change the lighting, but there are a few things you can do with your current setup. First, four xr30's would equal eight 360x's. If you want more punch, then use the narrow reflector for the kessil's and consider adding a couple more. If you run the Kessil's at 30% to 40% color, violet at 100%, red and green around 12% to 16%, you'll match the ab+ for radions (pretty dang close). Also, they should be mounted no higher than 8" above the water, you could do 6" without any issues. I currently run five 360x's over my tank that's 36x36x16 and I'm about to add one more. They're only running at 85% intensity right now, so there's room to increase.
Anyway, how long is your peak intensity period? It should be 6hrs minimum, but 8hrs is probably better. Asking one light (spot) to cover 24" is a stretch, unless there's two pucks (spots), but that's where the T5's come in. I wouldn't describe the color from Kessil's as drab, quite the opposite, but this is very subjective and up to the user to decide. As mentioned earlier, lighting is probably not the issue here, but we would need more info on your system. Dry rock? Parameters? Also, 4 degrees doesn't seem like much, but in our closed systems, this change creates swings and we all know sps hate any rapid changes.
One thing to consider is feeding your corals/system. When I started feeding EasyBooster and sps Evo, my sps took off. I also feed my fish at least six times a day.
 
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hobbyreefer

hobbyreefer

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Thank you guys so much for the feedback. I am strongly considering a lighting change. I bought into BRSTV’s Kessil/T5 recommendation but I’ve never really been blown away by the look. It is good but I’m just not blown away. I run the T5 for most of the day and really don’t notice any shimmer when the T5 are on. My tank also heats to ~80 which feels borderline high

I do struggle keeping nutrients in the tank but this could just be test kit error. I feel that I have a pretty heavy fish load and I feed large pinches of food 4 to 5 times per day and my nutrients remain at zero if I do not dose. I use about a half tablespoon of reef roids each night. 12-13 fish in a 150 gallon DT. Yellow tang, memic tang, blue hippo, moorish idol, fox face, whitetail angel, 3 chromis, maroon clown, and cardinal fish.

pretty decent coralline algae considering the tanks is still <year old. DKH is tested daily and stays between 7-8. I target 7.5.

CA 430, Mag ~1300, N 3-10 if I dose. P is 0-.1 based on how heavy I use RR. Salinity is .35 ppt. I have a 5 stage RODI that registers 0 TDS. I’m using Brightwell salt. I recently switched from Tropic Marine Pro because it was hard to find for while during Covid.

I run my skimmer 24/7 and a small fuge. Cheato grows reasonably fast.

I’ve always ran a decent amount of ROX carbon, but recently decided to pull this out.

I’ve only ran one ICP test but everything was normal except a bit of Tin. I believe the consensus is Tin is usually not a big deal. It’s been about 2 months since my last ICP so I’m going to run another one next week just to see if anything has changed.

Again, I don’t think lighting is my issue, but I’m just not sure what to do next. Since I’m not a huge fan of the hybrids I’m considering an LED panel or the G5’s.

My tank is only 8 months old and it was started with dry rock. I live relatively close to the beach. I’m considering putting a few scoops of ocean sand in my sump for additional biodiversity???
 

minus9

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Ditch the T5's and keep the Kessil's, then add some Orphek OR3 bars. That's what I did and love the combo. I get shimmer from the Kessil's and plenty of pop from the Orphek's. But I understand a need for a change.
Here's what I get with Kessil/orphek combo.
CF92BB88-F9BB-4175-B580-8E4B49DE4087.jpeg

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D6EFB0FE-C345-4424-A201-1C9FAA2BCBBA.jpeg
 

Sgolden

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Thank you guys so much for the feedback. I am strongly considering a lighting change. I bought into BRSTV’s Kessil/T5 recommendation but I’ve never really been blown away by the look. It is good but I’m just not blown away. I run the T5 for most of the day and really don’t notice any shimmer when the T5 are on. My tank also heats to ~80 which feels borderline high

I do struggle keeping nutrients in the tank but this could just be test kit error. I feel that I have a pretty heavy fish load and I feed large pinches of food 4 to 5 times per day and my nutrients remain at zero if I do not dose. I use about a half tablespoon of reef roids each night. 12-13 fish in a 150 gallon DT. Yellow tang, memic tang, blue hippo, moorish idol, fox face, whitetail angel, 3 chromis, maroon clown, and cardinal fish.

pretty decent coralline algae considering the tanks is still <year old. DKH is tested daily and stays between 7-8. I target 7.5.

CA 430, Mag ~1300, N 3-10 if I dose. P is 0-.1 based on how heavy I use RR. Salinity is .35 ppt. I have a 5 stage RODI that registers 0 TDS. I’m using Brightwell salt. I recently switched from Tropic Marine Pro because it was hard to find for while during Covid.

I run my skimmer 24/7 and a small fuge. Cheato grows reasonably fast.

I’ve always ran a decent amount of ROX carbon, but recently decided to pull this out.

I’ve only ran one ICP test but everything was normal except a bit of Tin. I believe the consensus is Tin is usually not a big deal. It’s been about 2 months since my last ICP so I’m going to run another one next week just to see if anything has changed.

Again, I don’t think lighting is my issue, but I’m just not sure what to do next. Since I’m not a huge fan of the hybrids I’m considering an LED panel or the G5’s.

My tank is only 8 months old and it was started with dry rock. I live relatively close to the beach. I’m considering putting a few scoops of ocean sand in my sump for additional biodiversity???
Do not put sand in your aquarium. Unless it’s from a coral coast. You will get a diatom bloom like never before.
 

Reeffragger

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Um.. these are my acros under just 4 t5. Two blue plus. Two coral plus. Take note.. the larger colonies are maybe 7-12months old. The smaller peices are only 1-3 months. But i can grow all of them. And yes this is jist under my 460nm blue leds i use for night.

My lights are 8imchs from the water and all the acros are about 8-12 inchs from the surface. Its DEFF not the t5s because i habe the same 4 bulbs and same two blue and two coral plus.

Its something else

My water params are.

Temps 80-82
Calcium 460
Alk 8
Ph 8.0
Nitrates 20-40ppm it varies.
Mag is 1380-1440 depends

Dont bother checking anything else. I use city tap water too no rodi
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Reeffragger

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Oh and here they are with the blues off. DEFFF is not the lighting since i have the same 4 bulbs you do.. This is in a 135g 6ft 24 1.2 tall tank. Keep the lights. If your corals are browning its something else.

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Rick.45cal

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Plenty of ways to skin a cat. My tank is about the same dimensions as yours, it’s 60”x27.5”x27.5“. I love my ATI powermodule (Hybrid 8x80w T5’s and 4x75w LED) and it grows corals like weeds with wicked color. Their user interface for the fixture is super slick and has been totally carefree. I wouldn’t trade it for any other fixture.

83AC4A73-817D-490D-9F2A-1BF795341A1E.jpeg
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billwill

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Short of going to a 60” T5 hybrid with those same Kessils, I’d say that’s an amazing lighting setup. I ran two 360W with four bulb T5 over 48” 90g, and colors and growth were great. Though I must admit growth was slower than when I ran radium MH with four bulb VHO. I think you’d be crazy to change that up. But then again, here i am with G4 Radions with four bulb T5 hybrid today. Growth is not as good as I had with Kessil though. Not to say lighting has anything to do with that, but who knows
 

Reeffragger

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I think some if the issue here is this. Your using only 4 bulbs for a 26 inch wide tank. 4 bulbs barely covers all my 18 inchs on my 6 ft 135. I almost need 6. In fact i added 2 to cover the back more ( but the pics i shiwed was with 4 growth)

For your wide tank youd need 6-8 bulbs cover the tank properly.

Because to cover a 26 inch tank with 4 youd have to raise it high thus lowering par.

So what i would do is get an 6-8 bulb fixture probly 8 On amazon the grow fixtures are cheap. Here is one for 144$ . Many brands so do searching on amazon. Theyre all basically the same though.. have good polished individual reflectors.. HELA cheaper then the ati fixture the guy above me uses.. ATI is just a name.. with a splash sheild and fan.. big woop.

For 144$ and 120$ for 4 more bulbs you cant beat that. But i love T5s lol. So its up to you.. and BRS already proved ato bulbs last 14-15 months before major par reduction.

Note this ones reflectors are bumpy.. so if you dont like that look at 20 other brands eith the flat shiny ones.

 
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Rick.45cal

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There are many other differences besides just a splash guard and a fan, that’s like saying Black box LED’s are the same as Ecotech‘s ;) But to each their own!
 

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Plenty of ways to skin a cat. My tank is about the same dimensions as yours, it’s 60”x27.5”x27.5“. I love my ATI powermodule (Hybrid 8x80w T5’s and 4x75w LED) and it grows corals like weeds with wicked color. Their user interface for the fixture is super slick and has been totally carefree. I wouldn’t trade it for any other fixture.

83AC4A73-817D-490D-9F2A-1BF795341A1E.jpeg
7FA94222-428F-49ED-BE0F-6AF8C9E2F3BA.jpeg
AC6E0F6B-93FF-4444-9F8B-61EB5D326901.jpeg
415CB4D6-1363-45F0-8929-927597147404.jpeg
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Looks like it’s time to trim the homewrecker
 

Bluedore

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Plenty of ways to skin a cat. My tank is about the same dimensions as yours, it’s 60”x27.5”x27.5“. I love my ATI powermodule (Hybrid 8x80w T5’s and 4x75w LED) and it grows corals like weeds with wicked color. Their user interface for the fixture is super slick and has been totally carefree. I wouldn’t trade it for any other fixture.

83AC4A73-817D-490D-9F2A-1BF795341A1E.jpeg
7FA94222-428F-49ED-BE0F-6AF8C9E2F3BA.jpeg
AC6E0F6B-93FF-4444-9F8B-61EB5D326901.jpeg
415CB4D6-1363-45F0-8929-927597147404.jpeg
C0D968B0-7911-40A4-86B9-2849DDAA16A1.jpeg
8E4D786A-24AB-458E-B3DC-FF9D628D7910.jpeg
WOW! Crazy tank! would you mind sharing your light schedule? Thanks.
 

jda

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I am NOT a fan of Kessils for acropora, but they should not be causing browning. Could you get an upgrade by switching? Sure, IMO. Are the Kessils the source of your issues? Not likely, IMO, especially with the T5s helping out.

If you are going to switch, just get a 8x 60" ATI and put some ReefBrite or Orphek bars on each side. That is a real upgrade, IMO.

Unless you live in South Florida or the Mojave, then heat is easy to deal with and is usually more of an excuse than a problem. If you live in a climate where a chiller is needed to run any tank, then heat from a light could be more than you want to deal with.
 

Reeffragger

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There are many other differences besides just a splash guard and a fan, that’s like saying Black box LED’s are the same as Ecotech‘s ;) But to each their own!


A regular ati fixture.. the main thing is a splash guard and with the splash guard it holds heat so it needs a fan and it has a timer big deal. Doesnt justify the price being 4x more. The reflectors are no different. Neither is the spacing if the bulbs. The cheap ones just dont have a splash guard and they dont need a fan with no guard.

Youre litterally paying extra for leather seats in a car when you dont need them
 
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