Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

[nick9one1]

I thought I'd had diatoms in my tank, < 6 months old. But now I'm wondering if they are Dino's. Haven't got a microscope yet, but wondered if anyone could tell me a yes or no from this video?

 

[dwest]

Would like to report some success I have had in getting controlling dinos in about a weeks time. I got them due to driving my nitrates and phosphates to 0 for a long period (months) as that was what was drilled in to my head by other reefers when I got started (this needs to change by the way people need stop telling others their nitrates should be 0). Anyways, I took a multi step approach to crushing the dinos:

I began by turning my skimmer off and feeding more heavily.
I started dosing my reef energy A&B 1/day instead of once every other day to start dirtying the water.
I started dosing microbacter 7 5ml/25g every day.
Bought a 9w uv sterilizer made for the IM tanks and ran it 24/7 (which are super cool by the way and fit in the chamber as if they are a filter sock).
Did not scrape the glass at all so some other algae could compete.
Then I decided to try to force them in to the water column so the UV could work and did a 36hr blackout. I ran carbon during this period just in case they released toxins

This was the crushing blow. They were mostly gone after the blackout and have not returned after a week since the blackout. My nitrates are holding at 2ppm and phosphates are detectable again so I may try to keep them at this level. I am hesitant to take off the UV as the corals look so happy again and I am worried they will come back. Does anyone have experience in removing their UV? Did they come back?

Do you know what type you had?

Unfortunately most of us continue to run UV I believe. Although that would be a very interesting poll question.

 

[dwest]

I vote prorocentrum here.

Does anyone with an armored dinoflagellate like ostreopsis @Clownfishy or prorocentrum have a nice mass of brown dino they could sample for an experiment and a blacklight bulb (fluorescent, not LED)?
I'm looking into a test to ID dinos and distinguish from diatoms, and it works with symbiotic dinos (zoox from corals and amphidinium from a flatworm) I just need to test it on a microscope-confirmed case of pest dinos.

That’s awesome BTW!

 

[dwest]

I thought I'd had diatoms in my tank, < 6 months old. But now I'm wondering if they are Dino's. Haven't got a microscope yet, but wondered if anyone could tell me a yes or no from this video?

I don’t believe you can get any real conclusive answer just by looking. But my vote is diatoms.

 

[clown and friends]

Do you know what type you had?

Unfortunately most of us continue to run UV I believe. Although that would be a very interesting poll question.

I don't know unfortunately, decided battle first and as questions later and honestly didn't expect them to clear up as quick as they did. I have no issue keeping the UV on I was just curious what most people do! Definitely would be an interesting poll

 

[Neoalchemist]

I think I'm making a little headway. This video is about 24 hours after blowing my sand and rock with a turkey baster. I added that about 5 days ago on top of maintaining nutrients, silicate dosing and UV. In the past it would be completely back in less than 24 hours. Still not seeing any improvement in my SPS but all the zoas, palys and RFA's seem very happy. The euphyllia in the background on the left side is happy as well.

Feels nice getting it back, right? It takes a long time for sps to recover. I believe the dinos actually infect the coral. Only new growth show the correct color and polyp extension or itat least takes much longer for the old to regain color. Be patient. The longer you keep that diatom bloom the better your chances of not seeing a resurgence. The good thing is if your nutrients stay where they are at you should be able to control the severity of the diatoms. I'll post some pics of post dino sps growth when I get a chance.

 

[Neoalchemist]

I vote prorocentrum here.

Does anyone with an armored dinoflagellate like ostreopsis @Clownfishy or prorocentrum have a nice mass of brown dino they could sample for an experiment and a blacklight bulb (fluorescent, not LED)?
I'm looking into a test to ID dinos and distinguish from diatoms, and it works with symbiotic dinos (zoox from corals and amphidinium from a flatworm) I just need to test it on a microscope-confirmed case of pest dinos.

@Elmer24 , trust Taricha on this id., as he is much more experienced.

 

[Jdavison911]

Just got the new microscope and I do believe I have Dino’s and something else. Need a little guidance on the dinos and identifying the other creature that’s in my tank.
Tank info
300 gallon dd, 2 80 gal frag tanks, 125 gallon sump all hooked together. System is 6 months old.
Cal 410
Alk 8.0
Mag 1320
Po4 .02
No3 8.0
I have about 400 gallons total. Started the tank with half live rock and half cured rock. 300 pounds of sand that at deepest part 3” and tapers off to the back. I have been trying to get my po4 up with dosing but now I guess I will have to get a little more aggressive. I have also been shutting down the skimmer at night. I have 2 tangs, 18” zebra eel, 2 clowns, copper band, coral beauty, and 2 chromies so other than the eel my bio load is low. I’m running 200 pounds of rock in my sump and approx 400 in the 300. My few sps is starting to show signs of stress but half of them still have good pe. I have a carbon reactor running with low flow and uv running 24/7. I dose basic BRS cal, Alk, and mag if needed and have a carx supplying 99% of the systems requirements. I do dose planted aquatics potassium phosphate and kno3 a little at a time because I do have small patches of algae growing here and there. I picked up some hydrogen peroxide to start taking care of that. Any direction and help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[saltyhog]

Just got the new microscope and I do believe I have Dino’s and something else. Need a little guidance on the dinos and identifying the other creature that’s in my tank.
Tank info
300 gallon dd, 2 80 gal frag tanks, 125 gallon sump all hooked together. System is 6 months old.
Cal 410
Alk 8.0
Mag 1320
Po4 .02
No3 8.0
I have about 400 gallons total. Started the tank with half live rock and half cured rock. 300 pounds of sand that at deepest part 3” and tapers off to the back. I have been trying to get my po4 up with dosing but now I guess I will have to get a little more aggressive. I have also been shutting down the skimmer at night. I have 2 tangs, 18” zebra eel, 2 clowns, copper band, coral beauty, and 2 chromies so other than the eel my bio load is low. I’m running 200 pounds of rock in my sump and approx 400 in the 300. My few sps is starting to show signs of stress but half of them still have good pe. I have a carbon reactor running with low flow and uv running 24/7. I dose basic BRS cal, Alk, and mag if needed and have a carx supplying 99% of the systems requirements. I do dose planted aquatics potassium phosphate and kno3 a little at a time because I do have small patches of algae growing here and there. I picked up some hydrogen peroxide to start taking care of that. Any direction and help would be greatly appreciated.

It's hard to say what the roundish cells are due to the focus but 90% of what you have is a single species of diatoms. A better picture (better yet a video) would be more conclusive.

 

[Jdavison911]

It's hard to say what the roundish cells are due to the focus but 90% of what you have is a single species of diatoms. A better picture (better yet a video) would be more conclusive.

Ok I will pull some more out tomorrow when I get out of work and see if I can a good video for you. Thank you

 

[saltyhog]

Looks great salty! Nice to hear. I wonder if you are getting amphidinium through the uv or they are truly getting outcompeted...

It's hard to say but I hope both?! The sand appearance has definitely improved since I started the blowing off. I certainly have more competition as I have at least one or two additional species of diatoms on my slides as well as some euglenia appearing critters. I also have visible but very small copepods visible on the glass when I let the biofilm grow....pretty amazing since I've never had visible copepods with my Halichoeres and leopard wrasses. Interestingly, the glass biofilm is growing much more slowly. The last time I sampled it was when I had ostreopsis and it was almost completely made up of dinos.

I need to sample the biofilm and the sand again to see what's left/dominant. Last time it was really more prorocentrum than amphidinium.

 

[Clownfishy]

I vote prorocentrum here.

Does anyone with an armored dinoflagellate like ostreopsis @Clownfishy or prorocentrum have a nice mass of brown dino they could sample for an experiment and a blacklight bulb (fluorescent, not LED)?
I'm looking into a test to ID dinos and distinguish from diatoms, and it works with symbiotic dinos (zoox from corals and amphidinium from a flatworm) I just need to test it on a microscope-confirmed case of pest dinos.

I am away until late next week but let me know what you want me to do and I would be happy to give it try.

 

[Paullawr]

Thank you @Paullawr.

I think H2O2 affected some of my dinos competition far more than it did the dinos. Is that a reasonable assumption?

Its indiscriminate it what it oxidizes. Add to this the competition may not be as difficult to kill due to softer cell walls then yes its a very real assumption.

H202 simply isn't going to get them all in an aquarium.

 

[dwest]

Just got the new microscope and I do believe I have Dino’s and something else. Need a little guidance on the dinos and identifying the other creature that’s in my tank.
Tank info
300 gallon dd, 2 80 gal frag tanks, 125 gallon sump all hooked together. System is 6 months old.
Cal 410
Alk 8.0
Mag 1320
Po4 .02
No3 8.0
I have about 400 gallons total. Started the tank with half live rock and half cured rock. 300 pounds of sand that at deepest part 3” and tapers off to the back. I have been trying to get my po4 up with dosing but now I guess I will have to get a little more aggressive. I have also been shutting down the skimmer at night. I have 2 tangs, 18” zebra eel, 2 clowns, copper band, coral beauty, and 2 chromies so other than the eel my bio load is low. I’m running 200 pounds of rock in my sump and approx 400 in the 300. My few sps is starting to show signs of stress but half of them still have good pe. I have a carbon reactor running with low flow and uv running 24/7. I dose basic BRS cal, Alk, and mag if needed and have a carx supplying 99% of the systems requirements. I do dose planted aquatics potassium phosphate and kno3 a little at a time because I do have small patches of algae growing here and there. I picked up some hydrogen peroxide to start taking care of that. Any direction and help would be greatly appreciated.

I agree with salty above. Are the round things moving? If they do not move, I’m thinking no dinos here. Good news is you have lots of diatoms.

 

[Jdavison911]

I agree with salty above. Are the round things moving? If they do not move, I’m thinking no dinos here. Good news is you have lots of diatoms.

Some of the round orange things where moving when I took these pictures. I will really try to get a good video tonight when I get home. I really hope it just diatoms but the round things is what Im really concerned of. Thanks

 

[Jdavison911]

Ok so here’s a video I did.

Any help identifying would be greatly appreciated

 

[dwest]

Ok so here’s a video I did.

Any help identifying would be greatly appreciated

I believe the one that are moving are amphidinium, but would love someone else to verify.
@taricha

 

[taricha]

agree with @dwest on amphidinium.
Y'all get bored of the same old dinos and itching for something new? right? anyone?
I got you.

ceratium!



If you have this in your tank, it's because your tank is actually a lake.

 

[dwest]

agree with @dwest on amphidinium.
Y'all get bored of the same old dinos and itching for something new? right? anyone?
I got you.

ceratium!



If you have this in your tank, it's because your tank is actually a lake.

Looks like a brachiosaurus to me

 

[Bigfudge]

Good morning everyone. I’m back again! After my last post identifying ostreopsis I got a 55w jebao UV and set it up inside the DT along with tossing all my chaeto out, running a felt filter sock / replacing it daily due it clogging up quickly, along with blowing off / scrubbing the rocks / sand and running 36 hour black out I’ve noticed a good improvement.

I decided to take some samples tonight with the tank completely dark from; the water column, sand bed, inside a crevice in the rock work and a spot of mulm at the base of one of my blasto colonies that is mounted towards the bottom of my rock work.

I wanted to see how it was coming along and if I could see any other issues. Ive noticed I don't find the mulm on the sand bed. I find it on the rock work, growing on the under hangs or where there isn't much coraline. That appears to be where I'm finding these at.

The water column tested clear of any dinos.
The sand tested clear.
Inside the crevice tested clear.
The mulm at the base of my blasto colony however most definitely has dinos and they appear to be a different strain.

I’m thinking Amphidinium but can I get a point of sale ID on this strain? They def don’t act like their anchored and they’re small. @taricha

Parameters as of today;
Sg 1.026
N03 5ppm
P04 0.11ppm

Thanks for all the help. Just trying to develop a solid plan of attack to rid these different strains from my tank. At least I have some copepods still roaming.