Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

[Michael Gray]

If Dino's aren't moving is that death or they just don't wanna move? Lol.
Finished the wasteaway bottle. So I'm done with that. I didn't dose silicate last night because I ran out. New bottle came today and the girl though it would be better to slowly ween off silicate than cut cold turkey. So I wussed out on stopping. Scared of dinos. Lol. So instead of the 10-12ml a day I been dosing for 12 days. I just dosed 5ml today

 

[NS Mike D]

I know I'm not of the woods yet, but the early signs are looking very good.

for comparison, last week:
'

 

[Michael Gray]

I know I'm not of the woods yet, but the early signs are looking very good.

for comparison, last week:
'

Ah that Mandarin. I want one so bad

 

[LRT]

3 things while we wait for the crew to help you,

1. Get good NO3 and PO4 testing kits. I don't see posted numbers and you said "I'm sure phosphates are also zero " which implies you really aren't sure.

2. Stop the water changes. New water fuels dinos for some reason.


3. While I am a huge fan of exporting pests to help the process, dinos can survive extreme conditions, I have read where 4 months after a bleaching and a dry tank, cells were able to survive the hybernation and revive. Don't assume that stuff you clean is dino free. I don't think any tank can be dino free, but we can keep them from taking over.

Salifert phosphate reading 0.25 barely.
Nitrates back at undetectable levels with Api test kit. Just dosed brightwell coral amino and will do so daily until I get my nitrates back up to around 10. Didnt have any issues at 10 on nitrates.
Where are you all having best success running phosphates? Ball park
And what are you using to raise phosphates?

 

[ScottB]

Salifert phosphate reading 0.25 barely.
Nitrates back at undetectable levels with Api test kit. Just dosed brightwell coral amino and will do so daily until I get my nitrates back up to around 10. Didnt have any issues at 10 on nitrates.
Where are you all having best success running phosphates? Ball park
And what are you using to raise phosphates?

I strongly discourage dosing aminos if there are dinos within 20 miles of your tank.

Nitrate > 10
Phosphate >=.1

Many options for dosing. If your system is <100G then chose a premix solution, otherwise choose solids to DIY mix your own. Here is what I chose:

2 grams per liter solution. Dump and measure. It is dilute and will take a while to remain.


85 grams per liter. Don't dose this until you have a solid phosphate reading first.

Lastly, this will take a long time without UV for all but one species which is tough to beat. Are you doing UV at 1 watt per 3 gallons?

 

[LRT]

I strongly discourage dosing aminos if there are dinos within 20 miles of your tank.

Nitrate > 10
Phosphate >=.1

Many options for dosing. If your system is <100G then chose a premix solution, otherwise choose solids to DIY mix your own. Here is what I chose:

2 grams per liter solution. Dump and measure. It is dilute and will take a while to remain.


85 grams per liter. Don't dose this until you have a solid phosphate reading first.

Lastly, this will take a long time without UV for all but one species which is tough to beat. Are you doing UV at 1 watt per 3 gallons?

Thank you! Well crap it seems I've been going at this all wrong all the way around.
I am running a 32 watt UV in my sump. It's about 30 gallons. But system is overall about 180.
It's real early on. Just started seeing them when I turned my lamps up a bit this last week or so but they came on fast and only on my table plugs.
It's not anywhere in my sump or anywhere else for that matter. YET
Thanks again
On edit:
Tell me if you see anything you would change here. I have daylight cfls over my sumps because there is a ton of sea plants growing on live rock should I turn them off?
I am going to get a new bulb for 32 watt any recommendations?
Also going to add another UV to Skimmer res. By this formula I'm looking at adding at least another 90 watts of UV to be safe? I'd rather go big than go at all.

 

[taricha]

Tell me if you see anything you would change here. I have daylight cfls over my sumps because there is a ton of sea plants growing on live rock should I turn them off?
I am going to get a new bulb for 32 watt any recommendations?
Also going to add another UV to Skimmer res. By this formula I'm looking at adding at least another 90 watts of UV to be safe?

good advice as usual from ScottB here.

I strongly discourage dosing aminos if there are dinos within 20 miles of your tank.

Keep those macroalgae growing. don't starve them (for nutrients or light).
180 gallons means you probably will want ~60 Watt UV. Jebao makes a 55 Watt that's not the best quality, but seems to get the job done for dinos on a short term basis, at least. You'll want th UV pulling from and returning water to the display. Give the best chance for dinos to get zapped by UV.

 

[LRT]

good advice as usual from ScottB here.


Keep those macroalgae growing. don't starve them (for nutrients or light).
180 gallons means you probably will want ~60 Watt UV. Jebao makes a 55 Watt that's not the best quality, but seems to get the job done for dinos on a short term basis, at least. You'll want th UV pulling from and returning water to the display. Give the best chance for dinos to get zapped by UV.

Ok just to make sure I'm on same page here
I need to upgrade UV but make that my return to my tables?
I could put the other UV in res with Skimmer I have extras and could make that happen or would it be overkill?
Wish I would have thought of returning UV water back to tables as this is much more efficient!

 

[FelipeCarv]

Hi,

I've been lurking for ages watching this forum. I was postponing to get a microscope, so I've treated my tank for cyano, checked silicates for diatoms, etc. Finally got one and those are my pictures. I bought an 36W UV filter for my 80 gallon that is on it's way. My parameters were always low, nitrates and phosphates, actually zero most of the time. My corals are still ok except from some zoas and a GSP not opening. I'm in the process of raising my nitrates and phosphates. Tunning down skimmer and feeding more.

My plan is to when the UV arrives, I will start a 2 days blackout together with the UV.

Last resource, I will dose H2O2...

One question that I have, should I get rid of chaeto? After my lights are on for a while, a thick brown mat with bubbles form over the chaeto. I've heard that Dinos like to be around chaeto. Photos attached.

Thanks.

 

[SMSREEF]

I need some advice. I think I have my Dino (Ostreopsis) problem under control with UV.

I have not done a water change in a month and been feeding corals a lot! Dosing nitrate and phosphate and took out my filter socks. There are piles of detritus that I would like to siphon out, and would like to do a big water change. (5 gallons on my nano which is 70%).

I made the water today, dosed with microbacter 7, a drop of ZEObac, phosphate and nitrate and a little vinegar. I was gonna let bacteria grow for 24 hours prior to water change.

I’ll probably take out the UV from my nano prior to water change.

what do you all think of this plan?

 

[ScottB]

I need some advice. I think I have my Dino (Ostreopsis) problem under control with UV.

I have not done a water change in a month and been feeding corals a lot! Dosing nitrate and phosphate and took out my filter socks. There are piles of detritus that I would like to siphon out, and would like to do a big water change. (5 gallons on my nano which is 70%).

I made the water today, dosed with microbacter 7, a drop of ZEObac, phosphate and nitrate and a little vinegar. I was gonna let bacteria grow for 24 hours prior to water change.

I’ll probably take out the UV from my nano prior to water change.

what do you all think of this plan?

This plan seems have features that contradict or magnify each other. What is the purpose of all the bacteria and carbon? They are powerful nutrient reduction tools, as is a 70% water change of course. It just seems like a lot of push/pull in a small ecosystem.

What are your nutrient levels like right now? Sky high?

 

[SMSREEF]

This plan seems have features that contradict or magnify each other. What is the purpose of all the bacteria and carbon? They are powerful nutrient reduction tools, as is a 70% water change of course. It just seems like a lot of push/pull in a small ecosystem.

What are your nutrient levels like right now? Sky high?

thanks for reply, the only reason for vinegar is that the water I’m mixing will have no carbon. I was guessing that the Microbacter and ZEObac will need carbon source, nitrate and phosphate to multiply. Hopefully making my replacement water full of good bacteria. I’m trying to make sure what I add tomorrow or next day has 10 nitrate and 0.10 phosphate.

I am hoping all carbon will all be used up by the time I do the water change and add it to the tank.

I do not dose any carbon in the tank. I am only feeding heavier and dosing phosphate and nitrate. Which in a nano is tricky.

my NO3 yesterday was 4 (I dosed it and it’s up to 12ish) Red Sea test
PO4 was 0.01 yesterday (I dosed it and it’s 0.04 today) Hanna test

 

[ScottB]

thanks for reply, the only reason for vinegar is that the water I’m mixing will have no carbon. I was guessing that the Microbacter and ZEObac will need carbon source, nitrate and phosphate to multiply. Hopefully making my replacement water full of good bacteria. I’m trying to make sure what I add tomorrow or next day has 10 nitrate and 0.10 phosphate.

I am hoping all carbon will all be used up by the time I do the water change and add it to the tank.

I do not dose any carbon in the tank. I am only feeding heavier and dosing phosphate and nitrate. Which in a nano is tricky.

my NO3 yesterday was 4 (I dosed it and it’s up to 12ish) Red Sea test
PO4 was 0.01 yesterday (I dosed it and it’s 0.04 today) Hanna test

If at the end of the WC, you end up with 10 NO3 and .1 PO4 then that sounds fine to me.

 

[ScottB]

thanks for reply, the only reason for vinegar is that the water I’m mixing will have no carbon. I was guessing that the Microbacter and ZEObac will need carbon source, nitrate and phosphate to multiply. Hopefully making my replacement water full of good bacteria. I’m trying to make sure what I add tomorrow or next day has 10 nitrate and 0.10 phosphate.

I am hoping all carbon will all be used up by the time I do the water change and add it to the tank.

I do not dose any carbon in the tank. I am only feeding heavier and dosing phosphate and nitrate. Which in a nano is tricky.

my NO3 yesterday was 4 (I dosed it and it’s up to 12ish) Red Sea test
PO4 was 0.01 yesterday (I dosed it and it’s 0.04 today) Hanna test

You are describing an interesting and intriguing process that is new to me. I've never thought about "preloading" water change water with bacteria. Kinda cool. I've read many places how coral take up PO4 indirectly, by consuming bacteria that have already consumed PO4.

How will you know when the carbon is exhausted? Will you be encouraging a bacterial bloom in the bucket and just wait for it to clear? Will you oxygenate the WC water before the change? Please don't think I am trying to be critical. Instead I am really curious about this process. Is this a process you have read about that you could share a link?

 

[SMSREEF]

You are describing an interesting and intriguing process that is new to me. I've never thought about "preloading" water change water with bacteria. Kinda cool. I've read many places how coral take up PO4 indirectly, by consuming bacteria that have already consumed PO4.

How will you know when the carbon is exhausted? Will you be encouraging a bacterial bloom in the bucket and just wait for it to clear? Will you oxygenate the WC water before the change? Please don't think I am trying to be critical. Instead I am really curious about this process. Is this a process you have read about that you could share a link?

Hey Scott,
It’s just a theory on my part, and I wanted to run it by some of you in this thread.

I have a powerhead (pointed at surface) to help oxygenation. I have a heater in there to hopefully speed up bacteria multiplication. Normally tha MB7 and Zeobac don’t cause a bloom I can see in the water with naked eye.

I have no clue how to tell when carbon is used up. I was thinking if I sample the water tomorrow and see bacteria under microscope, I think I can safely assume carbon is gone. But don’t know.

 

[LRT]

If at the end of the WC, you end up with 10 NO3 and .1 PO4 then that sounds fine to me.

Hi Scott sorry if this seems like a dumb question but I'd rather ask it.
I'm reading 0.25 are you saying I need to get down to 0.1 phosphate or up to 1?
I'm color blind and still trying to wrap my head around this.
Thanks in advance

 

[ScottB]

Hi Scott sorry if this seems like a dumb question but I'd rather ask it.
I'm reading 0.25 are you saying I need to get down to 0.1 phosphate or up to 1?
I'm color blind and still trying to wrap my head around this.
Thanks in advance

Not a dumb question at all. You have plenty of PO4 to spare. Bringing it down slowly is good. My tanks do well around .1
Are you using Hanna ULR checker to measure PO4?

The bacteria will consume some PO4 but I don't know how to forecast that consumption at all. Much of the PO4 in the tank is actually bound up in your rock and substrate. GFO or lanthanum chloride can strip it (too) fast IMO, so I like your bacterial approach. I just don't have a ton of experience with it.

A 70% water change will remove about 70% of your nitrate. If it is already lower than 10 or 15, you should be prepared to dose nitrate back in. My systems do well in 10-15ppm nitrate.

 

[ScottB]

Not a dumb question at all. You have plenty of PO4 to spare. Bringing it down slowly is good. My tanks do well around .1
Are you using Hanna ULR checker to measure PO4?

The bacteria will consume some PO4 but I don't know how to forecast that consumption at all. Much of the PO4 in the tank is actually bound up in your rock and substrate. GFO or lanthanum chloride can strip it (too) fast IMO, so I like your bacterial approach. I just don't have a ton of experience with it.

A 70% water change will remove about 70% of your nitrate. If it is already lower than 10 or 15, you should be prepared to dose nitrate back in. My systems do well in 10-15ppm nitrate.

@LRT I apologise. I am crossing up posts here between you and @SMSREEF . Sorry for the confusion folks. My ADHD has me doing too many things at once.

 

[NS Mike D]

The steps I took really knocked this stuff back to the point I am not seeing anything obvious. The microscope arrived today. I scraped the last bits of algae from the sump. I will have to find the post with pics of dinos so I know what to look for, but there were a few of these here and there that I were mobile so if you can take a look as ID these critters

Not in abundance, but these did catch my attention

video

 

[hotdrop]

Im still struggling with mine the first round killed half my tank, all my acros and also took out all the algee. Got the UV up and running for about 2 months, things were good for a month but now im seeing a few strings of Dinos appear again mid day. Had a couple days where Nitrates dropped to 2-3 and since then ive been seeing taces of Dinos.

Currently hovering around 8 Nitrate .15 PO4. Dosing silicate at 1ml for 1ml/200Ml H2O 40% sodium silicate, running 15w AquaUV in DT, running tank at 77F and running carbon. For a 35 gal system bare bottom. Ideas/Suggestions on what else I can do? Black out seems to work for a few days but after that it comes back and I dont want it to get a foothold again. So Far alk consumption is stable and going up but the presense of stringy Dinos really worries me.