Flame Angel randomly found stuck to powerhead and dead.

[FireUnderwater]

I had received my flame angel on Oct 16th, did an initial dip of H202 and Methylene Blue, followed by a 14-day copper QT with a TTM on day 14. Transferred fish on Day 14, then did 7-day observation period and deworming with API General Cure. Flame angel did great throughout the whole process. Never stopped eating the entire time or pecking at the PVC. No spots or other signs of distress were ever noticed, and I monitored extremely closely. Added to main DT with a Coral Beauty who was also doing great on November 8th. There was no fighting between the two. No signs of damaged fins or even bullying (monitored with camera). They even slept together in the same cave every night. He was probably the biggest eater in the tank.


Well, my wife randomly noticed that he was missing around 9PM and found him dead and stuck to the side of my SLW-30 powerhead. Rest of the fish are completely fine and swimming around like normal. Just plain bad luck? He used to occasionally swim around the gyres and powerheads or peck at them but never saw any problems before hand when he was doing it. I'm almost thinking he went to do his normal pecking but got caught when it did a jump to 100% power. Other tank mates are as follows.

Black Ocellaris
Snowflake Ocellaris
Coral Beauty Angel
Flame Tail Blenny
Royal Gramma
Purple Firefish

Parameters
Salinity 1.026
PH 8.3
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 19

 

[ya_boii]

Healthy fish don't get sucked into flow devices, generally speaking. There are rare instances where it can happen, but I've seen goldfish get out of the way of a siphon because they didn't like the weird current near it. Do you normally monitor pH? Did you dose anything that day? I've been dealing with some pH swings in my tank, and unfortunately, I changed too many things all at once, and my pH went from 8.2-8.3 all the way to 7.6. It killed three fish, including my flame angel. I wonder if the pH changes too suddenly for poor guy?

 

[FireUnderwater]

Healthy fish don't get sucked into flow devices, generally speaking. There are rare instances where it can happen, but I've seen goldfish get out of the way of a siphon because they didn't like the weird current near it. Do you normally monitor pH? Did you dose anything that day? I've been dealing with some pH swings in my tank, and unfortunately, I changed too many things all at once, and my pH went from 8.2-8.3 all the way to 7.6. It killed three fish, including my flame angel. I wonder if the pH changes too suddenly for poor guy?

No dosing of any sort atm. Checked PH Friday before water change, and it was 8.2. So my PH has been pretty stable.

 

[FireUnderwater]

Healthy fish don't get sucked into flow devices, generally speaking. There are rare instances where it can happen, but I've seen goldfish get out of the way of a siphon because they didn't like the weird current near it. Do you normally monitor pH? Did you dose anything that day? I've been dealing with some pH swings in my tank, and unfortunately, I changed too many things all at once, and my pH went from 8.2-8.3 all the way to 7.6. It killed three fish, including my flame angel. I wonder if the pH changes too suddenly for poor guy?

I don’t think it was disease, especially with QT protocol and with how long I’ve now had them. Any disease I’ve heard of would have either been wiped in QT, or at-least shown up by now in some form or fashion. Maybe a case of cyanide poisoning from initial capture just now popping up? Or something internal that GC wouldn’t have taken out?

 

[ya_boii]

Healthy fish don't get sucked into flow devices, generally speaking. There are rare instances where it can happen, but I've seen goldfish get out of the way of a siphon because they didn't like the weird current near it. Do you normally monitor pH? Did you dose anything that day? I've been dealing with some pH swings in my tank, and unfortunately, I changed too many things all at once, and my pH went from 8.2-8.3 all the way to 7.6. It killed three fish, including my flame angel. I wonder if the pH changes too suddenly for poor guy?

I don’t think it was disease, especially with QT protocol and with how long I’ve now had them. Any disease I’ve heard of would have either been wiped in QT, or at-least shown up by now in some form or fashion. Maybe a case of cyanide poisoning from initial capture just now popping up? Or something internal that GC wouldn’t have taken out?

That's likely it. Sometimes fish just die without explanation. It's nothing you did wrong, but just a case of bad luck

 

[FireUnderwater]

That's likely it. Sometimes fish just die without explanation. It's nothing you did wrong, but just a case of bad luck

It’s super frustrating since it had seemed like I found two dwarf angels that not only tolerated each other, but were basically tank buddies. (Granted it may be due to size. Flame Angel was about 1.5 inches and Coral Beauty is about 2)

 

[vetteguy53081]

I had received my flame angel on Oct 16th, did an initial dip of H202 and Methylene Blue, followed by a 14-day copper QT with a TTM on day 14. Transferred fish on Day 14, then did 7-day observation period and deworming with API General Cure. Flame angel did great throughout the whole process. Never stopped eating the entire time or pecking at the PVC. No spots or other signs of distress were ever noticed, and I monitored extremely closely. Added to main DT with a Coral Beauty who was also doing great on November 8th. There was no fighting between the two. No signs of damaged fins or even bullying (monitored with camera). They even slept together in the same cave every night. He was probably the biggest eater in the tank.


Well, my wife randomly noticed that he was missing around 9PM and found him dead and stuck to the side of my SLW-30 powerhead. Rest of the fish are completely fine and swimming around like normal. Just plain bad luck? He used to occasionally swim around the gyres and powerheads or peck at them but never saw any problems before hand when he was doing it. I'm almost thinking he went to do his normal pecking but got caught when it did a jump to 100% power. Other tank mates are as follows.

Black Ocellaris
Snowflake Ocellaris
Coral Beauty Angel
Flame Tail Blenny
Royal Gramma
Purple Firefish

Parameters
Salinity 1.026
PH 8.3
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 19

Fish was likely weak and may have been one of several that are cyanide captured and will appear healthy but slowly deteriorate

 

[FireUnderwater]

Fish was likely weak and may have been one of several that are cyanide captured and will appear healthy but slowly deteriorate

Any recommendations for finding one that wasn’t cyanide captured? Seems finding them is pretty difficult. Been looking at Captive Bred Biota but a $275 flame angel is a pretty hard reach.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I had received my flame angel on Oct 16th, did an initial dip of H202 and Methylene Blue, followed by a 14-day copper QT with a TTM on day 14. Transferred fish on Day 14, then did 7-day observation period and deworming with API General Cure. Flame angel did great throughout the whole process. Never stopped eating the entire time or pecking at the PVC. No spots or other signs of distress were ever noticed, and I monitored extremely closely. Added to main DT with a Coral Beauty who was also doing great on November 8th. There was no fighting between the two. No signs of damaged fins or even bullying (monitored with camera). They even slept together in the same cave every night. He was probably the biggest eater in the tank.


Well, my wife randomly noticed that he was missing around 9PM and found him dead and stuck to the side of my SLW-30 powerhead. Rest of the fish are completely fine and swimming around like normal. Just plain bad luck? He used to occasionally swim around the gyres and powerheads or peck at them but never saw any problems before hand when he was doing it. I'm almost thinking he went to do his normal pecking but got caught when it did a jump to 100% power. Other tank mates are as follows.

Black Ocellaris
Snowflake Ocellaris
Coral Beauty Angel
Flame Tail Blenny
Royal Gramma
Purple Firefish

Parameters
Salinity 1.026
PH 8.3
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 19

Sorry to hear.

Tough to say - flame angels never used to be collected with cyanide, but they are getting them from different islands now, so I've been seeing more issues with them. However, cyanide poisoning, while causing "sudden death", usually show in a fish where it just isn't doing quite as well as you would expect, and then it dies.

I once had an Africanus angel that was doing great and then died suddenly like this. I sent it out for histopathology and the report came back peritonitis from a nematode worm that had grown so large, it burst out of its gut. Things like that, visually from the outside, seem to not have any clue as to what happened.....

 

[FireUnderwater]

Sorry to hear.

Tough to say - flame angels never used to be collected with cyanide, but they are getting them from different islands now, so I've been seeing more issues with them. However, cyanide poisoning, while causing "sudden death", usually show in a fish where it just isn't doing quite as well as you would expect, and then it dies.

I once had an Africanus angel that was doing great and then died suddenly like this. I sent it out for histopathology and the report came back peritonitis from a nematode worm that had grown so large, it burst out of its gut. Things like that, visually from the outside, seem to not have any clue as to what happened.....

Is there any treatment that could be done while in QT for nematode worms? Or warning signs to look out for? I did notice the coral beauty I QT’d the flame Angel with had white stringy poop for a few days while feeding GC but it went away and went back to normal colors after the 4th daily treatment.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Is there any treatment that could be done while in QT for nematode worms? Or warning signs to look out for? I did notice the coral beauty I QT’d the flame Angel with had white stringy poop for a few days while feeding GC but it went away and went back to normal colors after the 4th daily treatment.

No - these large nematodes are tough to treat - if you kill them, they decompose inside the fish and kill the fish anyway.

As a side note - never dose GC orally! It contains praziquantel and metronidazole that have two different oral doses, so it is impossible to dose it properly. I know people talk about doing that, but it is bad advice.

 

[FireUnderwater]

So tank treatment only? Well I guess with the fish dying, I at-least got to learn something new. Especially since I was about to start doing GC on my current set of QT fish on Friday. (one spot, yellow coris, red eye solar, and a Tomini)

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

So tank treatment only? Well I guess with the fish dying, I at-least got to learn something new. Especially since I was about to start doing GC on my current set of QT fish on Friday. (one spot, yellow coris, red eye solar, and a Tomini)

Yes - use GC in water only. You can dose metronidazole orally at 1% by weight in food and Praziquantel (pure powder) is dosed at 50mg per kg of fish weight.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/proper-dosing-of-medicated-foods.765689/

 

[vetteguy53081]

Any recommendations for finding one that wasn’t cyanide captured? Seems finding them is pretty difficult. Been looking at Captive Bred Biota but a $275 flame angel is a pretty hard reach.

You can start with origin and see where they may be collected from but many stores wont even know this

 

[exnisstech]

Any recommendations for finding one that wasn’t cyanide captured? Seems finding them is pretty difficult. Been looking at Captive Bred Biota but a $275 flame angel is a pretty hard reach.

No help really but just a thought. Maybe keep it in observation without meds for a month or so to rule out cyanide before proceeding with medications?

I hope you have luck mixing a flame with a coral beauty. Mine were fine together for over a year in a 7ft tank with a lot of rock. One day the CB decided it didn't want to get along with the flame any longer. By the time I was able to catch the flame it was badly beat up and didn't survive.

 

[atoll]

Another fish death not long after QT and medications. Thats so sad but not uncommon unfortunately. Could be other causes of course. However, the meds and QT could have been a factor in its death.

 

[ReeferMo]

I had received my flame angel on Oct 16th, did an initial dip of H202 and Methylene Blue, followed by a 14-day copper QT with a TTM on day 14. Transferred fish on Day 14, then did 7-day observation period and deworming with API General Cure. Flame angel did great throughout the whole process. Never stopped eating the entire time or pecking at the PVC. No spots or other signs of distress were ever noticed, and I monitored extremely closely. Added to main DT with a Coral Beauty who was also doing great on November 8th. There was no fighting between the two. No signs of damaged fins or even bullying (monitored with camera). They even slept together in the same cave every night. He was probably the biggest eater in the tank.


Well, my wife randomly noticed that he was missing around 9PM and found him dead and stuck to the side of my SLW-30 powerhead. Rest of the fish are completely fine and swimming around like normal. Just plain bad luck? He used to occasionally swim around the gyres and powerheads or peck at them but never saw any problems before hand when he was doing it. I'm almost thinking he went to do his normal pecking but got caught when it did a jump to 100% power. Other tank mates are as follows.

Black Ocellaris
Snowflake Ocellaris
Coral Beauty Angel
Flame Tail Blenny
Royal Gramma
Purple Firefish

Parameters
Salinity 1.026
PH 8.3
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 19

Last night I bought my 4th flame angle ($69) in the past 4 months number 1-2 and 3 died the same way you described healthy eating swimming then dead. I believe it died first and then ended up at the side of the power head. Flames are a hit or miss IMO

 

[atoll]

Last night I bought my 4th flame angle in the past 4 months number 1-2 and 3 died the same way healthy eating swimming then dead. I believe it died first and then got to the pump

Sounds like something is very much amiss either in your tank or poison capture.
Did you buy them all from the same LFS? How long did you have them before they died?
Did you QT?
Did you medicated before introduction?

 

[ReeferMo]

I had received my flame angel on Oct 16th, did an initial dip of H202 and Methylene Blue, followed by a 14-day copper QT with a TTM on day 14. Transferred fish on Day 14, then did 7-day observation period and deworming with API General Cure. Flame angel did great throughout the whole process. Never stopped eating the entire time or pecking at the PVC. No spots or other signs of distress were ever noticed, and I monitored extremely closely. Added to main DT with a Coral Beauty who was also doing great on November 8th. There was no fighting between the two. No signs of damaged fins or even bullying (monitored with camera). They even slept together in the same cave every night. He was probably the biggest eater in the tank.


Well, my wife randomly noticed that he was missing around 9PM and found him dead and stuck to the side of my SLW-30 powerhead. Rest of the fish are completely fine and swimming around like normal. Just plain bad luck? He used to occasionally swim around the gyres and powerheads or peck at them but never saw any problems before hand when he was doing it. I'm almost thinking he went to do his normal pecking but got caught when it did a jump to 100% power. Other tank mates are as follows.

Black Ocellaris
Snowflake Ocellaris
Coral Beauty Angel
Flame Tail Blenny
Royal Gramma
Purple Firefish

Parameters
Salinity 1.026
PH 8.3
Ammonia 0
Nitrites 0
Nitrates 19

Last night I bought my 4th flame angle ($69) in the past 4 months number 1-2 and 3 died the same way you described healthy eating swimming then dead. I believe it died first and then ended up at the side of the power head. Flames are a hit or miss IMO

My friend told me they are very sensitive to high nitrate levels

 

[ReeferMo]

Last night I bought my 4th flame angle in the past 4 months number 1-2 and 3 died the same way healthy eating swimming then dead. I believe it died first and then got to the pump

The first 3 (in a 2-3 month radius ) died within 3-10 days

The first 2 deaths I blamed on my 5 convicted terrorist sleeper cell members called 3 striped damsels. I got rid of them (gave them away) and added the third flame.. and it died 3 days later.

Prior to that I had a flame for 3-4 years and decided to jump out of my tank (small opening ) And this particular flame was QT’d by a pro

All others weren’t


I just acclimate them and dump

And and when I say they died with no clue why. I mean pristine condition