Agree 100%, but it may be helpful to try to get a better idea of the current ammonia (TAN) level to determine next steps. Currently we just know it is 2.5 or greater (and definitely not cycled). My understanding is: next steps might be different depending on whether the actual concentration is 3 ppm or 10+ ppm.
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I agree; 3 or 10, either is still too high. And I do not believe any bottled bac can -- with certainty -- bring the (unknown) ammonia concentration down to a safe level in under 24 hrs. That said . . .
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Bottom line up front: I don't have a specific concentration, but instead I just have a general approach to err on the side of caution.
I don’t think that feeding them is going to lower ammonia levels but it could increase them and cause distress.
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Thanks for that link. I think I was already fairly familiar with points 4-10 (due primarily to info shared by you and others here at R2R), but the boundaries outlined in points 1-3 are clearly higher than I had been working with in my mind. I may need to recalibrate my "take evasive action" threshold(s).I don’t have a specific number, but healthy fish wont die in a few days at 5 ppm total ammonia. It may not be ideal, but in a scenario where the hope is for it to be dropping, it may be ok.
Ammonia is Our Friend!
Ammonia is Our Friend By Randy Holmes-Farley Yes, I know the title is provocative, and likely goes against much of what you read and hear in the reef aquarium hobby. I believe, however, that the hobby may have been harmed by the continual...
From it:
1. While ammonia is toxic at high levels, the levels needed to be lethal to a marine fish are higher than many people think. I’ve not seen any study in the literature that shows an LC50 (half of fish die) in less than 15 ppm total ammonia in seawater over 4 days or more of exposure at normal pH.
2. Sublethal toxic effects of ammonia, such as gill lesions observed by histopathology, do not seem to become significant until levels reach 5-10 ppm total ammonia at pH 8.1.
3. The toxicity of ammonia is a function of pH. At pH 8.5, toxic effects kick in at ammonia levels 2.5x lower than at pH 8.1. Likewise, at pH 7.8, it takes twice as much ammonia to be toxic as at pH 8.1. In a situation where ammonia might well reach toxic levels, such as a shipping bag, raising pH in the bag should not take place.
4. Toxic levels of ammonia are just not reached in typical operating reef aquaria. Seeing a measured value of 0.2 ppm, whether real or test error, is not a concern. It may be a benefit.
5. Commercial chemical methods to control or detoxify ammonia in marine systems at doses recommended are seemingly ineffective at impacting ammonia, despite folks thinking they were effective. If you believe that 2 ppm ammonia will kill a fish, and you add an ammonia detoxifier and it survives, you may falsely conclude it worked, as opposed to misunderstanding how toxic ammonia was.
I don’t have a specific number, but healthy fish wont die in a few days at 5 ppm total ammonia. It may not be ideal, but in a scenario where the hope is for it to be dropping, it may be ok.
Ammonia is Our Friend!
Ammonia is Our Friend By Randy Holmes-Farley Yes, I know the title is provocative, and likely goes against much of what you read and hear in the reef aquarium hobby. I believe, however, that the hobby may have been harmed by the continual...
From it:
1. While ammonia is toxic at high levels, the levels needed to be lethal to a marine fish are higher than many people think. I’ve not seen any study in the literature that shows an LC50 (half of fish die) in less than 15 ppm total ammonia in seawater over 4 days or more of exposure at normal pH.
2. Sublethal toxic effects of ammonia, such as gill lesions observed by histopathology, do not seem to become significant until levels reach 5-10 ppm total ammonia at pH 8.1.
3. The toxicity of ammonia is a function of pH. At pH 8.5, toxic effects kick in at ammonia levels 2.5x lower than at pH 8.1. Likewise, at pH 7.8, it takes twice as much ammonia to be toxic as at pH 8.1. In a situation where ammonia might well reach toxic levels, such as a shipping bag, raising pH in the bag should not take place.
4. Toxic levels of ammonia are just not reached in typical operating reef aquaria. Seeing a measured value of 0.2 ppm, whether real or test error, is not a concern. It may be a benefit.
5. Commercial chemical methods to control or detoxify ammonia in marine systems at doses recommended are seemingly ineffective at impacting ammonia, despite folks thinking they were effective. If you believe that 2 ppm ammonia will kill a fish, and you add an ammonia detoxifier and it survives, you may falsely conclude it worked, as opposed to misunderstanding how toxic ammonia was.
