Holistic Reefing without Fish

Subsea

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To remove fish disease from entry level reefing is one goal of this thread. For many years I have seen this hobby get more & more expensive, thus creating barriers for many newbies. So the second goal is to consider less technology & money and more knowledge & understanding of how a marine ecosystem works.

My first marine aquarium was in 1971 when I entered the Texas Maritime Academy as a freshmen Marine Engineer. I set up a 55G tank as a Galveston Bay theme with UG filter using air pump. The substrate was crushed up oyster shells from the chicken feed store. There were no salt water fish stores in Galveston, Tx. I found one store that set up a tank with Condalacti anemone that he collected on granite rock jetties. However, instead of brown, these were red, green & yellow. Because I fished these jetties, I knew they were brown. When I asked him about the bright colors, he took me in the back room and showed me tanks that were red, green and yellow from food dye. Go figure.

OK. Back on subject of Holistic Reefing.
I like Caribbean lagoons as a theme with a heavy emphases on diverse filter feeders.

Set up a simple tank with diver collected live rock with no fish for 1 year. During that time, learn to be a good steward of the ecosystem under your charge. You will be surprised with what grows from this rock. In addition to colorful bryozons, ornamental seaweeds; the rock sprouts its own ecosystem when not foraged by heavy fish grazers.

Happy trails.
 
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Subsea

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If Caribbean lagoons are not your thing, there are more options. John Tullocks “Natural Reef Aquariums”

Amazon product

“Debunking the myth that reef aquariums need to be wildly expensive and technologically complex, John Tullock offers a new, radically simple approach to producing beautiful, captive microcosms.
Using live rock and live sand as part of a natural filtration system, the home aquarist can now create vibrant reef tanks that are biologically stable and simple to maintain.”

With Tullocks suggestions, the reefkeeper can now mimic natural habitats such as a Florida Keys Lagoon, a Caribbean Turtle Grass Flat, an Indo-Pacific Deep Cave, or a Red Sea Patch Reef. With more than 200 color photographs and illustrations, Natural Reef Aquariums provides inspiration for both beginning and expert marine reef hobbyists
 
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Subsea

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Because many are concerned about bad microbes & parasites in our captive reefs, I offer up natures way to deal with excess microbes: filter feeders & suspension feeders like sea apples & anemonees. I must admit, I am a SpongeBob fan. Cryptic sponges ability to process DOC was my initial interst in sponges. Then I started seeing ornamental sponges from GOM and I got my feet wet. Now, I am submerged. However, I can’t brag on my success rate with Red Tree Sponges; I can brag on the hardinesss of Yellow Ball & Orange Elephant Ear Sponges as I learn their husbandry.

I also must brag on the quality of product that I observed at Mosaic Macros website. Their pictures are much better than mine:




PS: Two days ago, this 6G AIO was treated with 2.5 Tablespoons of potassium chloride for 20 minutes for Red Planario eradication. Water was drained 100% and refilled with water from mature system. It is now in quarantine isolation for 60 days. It had been previously treated with a 20 minute fresh water bath.
image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg
 
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In recent research by marine & micro biologist the Coral Reef habitat is referred to as a sentient organism, Coral Holibiont, with bacteria crosstalk using gene expression to adjust environment around them. The process has taken 100 million years to work out the details.


A coral holobiont is a complex metaorganism, a single functional unit comprising the coral animal host, its crucial photosynthetic algae (Symbiodiniaceae), and a vast community of associated microbes (bacteria, archaea, fungi, viruses) living within its tissues and mucus, forming a mutually dependent system vital for reef health, nutrient cycling, growth, and adaptation to environmental changes like warming waters. When this delicate microbial balance, or homeostasis, breaks down due to stress, it can lead to coral bleaching, disease, and mortality, highlighting the importance of understanding these microbial partners for conservation
.
Key Components of the Coral Holobiont
  • Coral Host: The invertebrate animal (polyp) that provides structure and shelter.
  • Symbiodiniaceae Algae (Zooxanthellae): Provide the coral with essential food (sugars, amino acids) through photosynthesis.
  • Microbiota: A diverse community including bacteria (e.g., Vibrio, Streptomyces), archaea, fungi, and viruses, contributing to nutrient cycling (like nitrogen) and defense.
Functions & Importance
  • Nutrient Cycling: Microbes help fix nutrients and cycle essential elements (carbon, nitrogen).
  • Biomass & Structure: Contribute to building the coral's carbonate skeleton.
  • Homeostasis & Resilience: Maintain the coral's internal balance; a shift in microbes indicates stress.
  • Adaptation: The microbial community can rapidly adapt to changing conditions, influencing host survival.
Threats & Stressors (Leading to Bleaching)
  • Environmental Factors: Rising ocean temperatures, pollution, nutrient runoff.
  • Microbial Shift: Stress causes the symbiotic algae to be expelled (bleaching), allowing potentially pathogenic microbes to dominate, disrupting the holobiont's function and potentially causing disease and death.
 

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If Caribbean lagoons are not your thing, there are more options. John Tullocks “Natural Reef Aquariums”

Amazon product

“Debunking the myth that reef aquariums need to be wildly expensive and technologically complex, John Tullock offers a new, radically simple approach to producing beautiful, captive microcosms.
Using live rock and live sand as part of a natural filtration system, the home aquarist can now create vibrant reef tanks that are biologically stable and simple to maintain.”

With Tullocks suggestions, the reefkeeper can now mimic natural habitats such as a Florida Keys Lagoon, a Caribbean Turtle Grass Flat, an Indo-Pacific Deep Cave, or a Red Sea Patch Reef. With more than 200 color photographs and illustrations, Natural Reef Aquariums provides inspiration for both beginning and expert marine reef hobbyists

Reading Tullock's books is what got me started on reefing many years ago.
 

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My first source of diver collected live rock was The Package from Tampa Bay Saltwater. It’s a bullet proof way to go.

TBS Package

Prepare for Success. The Package offers essential components for establishing a stable and healthy long-term marine environment. This proven two-step process has been utilized successfully for over 30 years. Based on volume in the display tank, the Package process avoids guesswork and a new tank ugly stage. Step 1: Ultra Live Sand and Base Rock will cycle a new tank hassle-free. Step 2 Premium Rock and the Keep-It-Clean-Crew complete the setup




Since then, I have also used Gulf Live Rock. Once when I requested a center piece for a 150G tank, I was sent an underwater picture of the rock. Two days after I approved the rock, George sent me a picture of that rock on the boat ride in to shore. I received it along with 200 lbs via air freight at midnight and it was in holding tanks by 1 am.

PS: Where do you international reefers get your live rock from?
Help a reefer out!
In the UK live rock can be had from some LFSs, mostly Indonesian. However, by the time it arrives it's nolonger so live and may smell to high heaven. Most of my live rock has come from tank shutdowns.
 

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Set up a simple tank with diver collected live rock with no fish for 1 year. During that time, learn to be a good steward of the ecosystem under your charge. You will be surprised with what grows from this rock.

I love this idea. I’m only a couple months into my first reef tank. I started with dry rock and one night after a really stiff cocktail ordered myself 5 pounds of TBS premium live rock to add in. I could stare for hours at all the cool stuff that brought to my little tank. Next tank I start will absolutely go with the full “package”.
 
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I love this idea. I’m only a couple months into my first reef tank. I started with dry rock and one night after a really stiff cocktail ordered myself 5 pounds of TBS premium live rock to add in. I could stare for hours at all the cool stuff that brought to my little tank. Next tank I start will absolutely go with the full “package”.
Yes, I so enjoy watching the little people. Also, you can target detrivores & herbivores at IndoPacific SeaFarm. They also farm Tang Heaven Red/Red Ogo/Gracilaria Parvispora. I like eating it raw, rinsed in fresh water.

 
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Subsea

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In the UK live rock can be had from some LFSs, mostly Indonesian. However, by the time it arrives it's nolonger so live and may smell to high heaven. Most of my live rock has come from tank shutdowns.
@Lassie
Where do you’ll get live rock in Sweden and don’t tell me the Stockholm Aquarium

@EnterName
Where in Germany do you get your live rock?
 

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@Lassie
Where do you’ll get live rock in Sweden and don’t tell me the Stockholm Aquarium

@EnterName
Where in Germany do you get your live rock?
I never used live rock. I use 100% artificial dry reef rock.

I assume if you find a LFS that actually still sells reef tank stuff, it will have quite a significant portion of its live stock, corals, and rocks from De Jong Marinelife (they only sell to companies, not individuals). Until recently Germany had the largest pet store in the world which also had a reef tank section, but it's closed now. My LFS closed their reef tank quite a while ago, so I need to order online, drive a while, or ask in a WhatsApp group of reefers in my area.
 
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Subsea

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I never used live rock. I use 100% artificial dry reef rock.

I assume if you find a LFS that actually still sells reef tank stuff, it will have quite a significant portion of its live stock, corals, and rocks from De Jong Marinelife (they only sell to companies, not individuals). Until recently Germany had the largest pet store in the world which also had a reef tank section, but it's closed now. My LFS closed their reef tank quite a while ago, so I need to order online, drive a while, or ask in a WhatsApp group of reefers in my area.
“I never used live rock. I use 100% artificial dry reef rock”

Now, I know why the amino acid experiment.

PS: Where in Germany are you located? I lived outside of Frankfurt at Rhien Main Air base May 1967 - November 1970.
 

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“I never used live rock. I use 100% artificial dry reef rock”

Now, I know why the amino acid experiment.

PS: Where in Germany are you located? I lived outside of Frankfurt at Rhien Main Air base May 1967 - November 1970.
Haha, no this doesn't have anything to do with the amino acid experiment :D

The tank requires nitrogen and sometimes phosphate dosing, but I just really enjoy the chemistry and biology side of this hobby and would like to understand if amino acid products are actually worth it.

I'm located in North Rhine-Westphalia (northern part of it), so like a 3 hours drive away from your former location.
 
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Subsea

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Haha, no this doesn't have anything to do with the amino acid experiment :D

The tank requires nitrogen and sometimes phosphate dosing, but I just really enjoy the chemistry and biology side of this hobby and would like to understand if amino acid products are actually worth it.

I'm located in North Rhine-Westphalia (northern part of it), so like a 3 hours drive away from your former location.
When I was there, where you are now, would have been East Germany and part of USSR.

Yes, chemistry & biology are scientific principals that reflect your signature, which I like, “Precision isn’t obsession, its respect for complexity”.
And,
You will find that biochemistry is much more complex.
 

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Haha, no this doesn't have anything to do with the amino acid experiment :D

The tank requires nitrogen and sometimes phosphate dosing, but I just really enjoy the chemistry and biology side of this hobby and would like to understand if amino acid products are actually worth it.

I'm located in North Rhine-Westphalia (northern part of it), so like a 3 hours drive away from your former location.
When I was there, where you are now, would have been East Germany and part of USSR.

Yes, chemistry & biology are scientific principals that reflect your signature, which I like, “Precision isn’t obsession, its respect for complexity”.
And,
You will find that biochemistry is much more complex.
North Rhine-Westphalia is part of "West Germany" so it wasn't part of the USSR. Brandenburg, Mecklenburg-Western Pomerania, Saxony, Saxony-Anhalt, and Thuringia were part of the USSR and they still suffer the consequences of that time, even 35/36 years later. Good, that this time is over. Germany's past is dark.

I really try to live by this signature and learn to respect how complex even the smallest details can become :)
 
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Because I focus on growing nutrients in the tank (nutrient recylcling) and not nutrient export ( more equipment cost & technology), Instead of forcing things, I choose to walk hand in hand with Nature, that took 100 million years to evolve into the beauty of the Coral Holibiont. I speak of more than the visual beauty of the reef. I speak of how the microbes “run the ship”, the Microbial Overlords.

Overview
A coral reef holobiont is the entire living system of a coral, encompassing the coral animal host, its crucial photosynthetic algae (Symbiodiniaceae), and a vast community of microbes (bacteria, archaea, fungi, viruses) and other small organisms, all interacting as a single functional unit to build reefs and influence their environment using gene expression & the DNA code.




1765971106957.jpeg
 
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Jamie9

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Because I focus on growing nutrients in the tank (nutrient recylcling) and not nutrient export ( more equipment cost & technology), Instead of forcing things, I choose to walk hand in hand with Nature, that took 100 million years to evolve into the beauty of the Coral Holibiont. I speak of more than the visual beauty of the reef. I speak of how the microbes “run the ship”, the Microbial Overlords.

Overview
A coral reef holobiont is the entire living system of a coral, encompassing the coral animal host, its crucial photosynthetic algae (Symbiodiniaceae), and a vast community of microbes (bacteria, archaea, fungi, viruses) and other small organisms, all interacting as a single functional unit to build reefs and respond to the environment.




1765971106957.jpeg
Could you describe briefly how you incorporate macro algae into your reef tank? Do you include it in the display or in a sump/redugium. I love the idea of mixing some into my display, but I can see a couple issues.

1) I have some nice red grape macro that came in with my live rock, but as soon as a piece broke off it got sucked into my mp10. Scared the heck out of me when I got home from work and heard the noise the wet-side was making…happily it was fine when I pulled the macro out of it. But, if we have things like lagoon flow and minimizing dead spots in our mixed reef…how do we get the macro established and not clogging our pumps? (Most videos I see of people adding macro to a tank they just sort of place it where they want it in a macro dedicated tank…but with flow I don’t see that working too well.)

2) Lighting…I assume the lighting that many macro algae like won’t be the same as what coral like. Are there certain types you’ve found to work better than others?

I appreciate all the thoughts you’ve been sharing, I love reading about what people are doing in their tanks to try to follow what nature has been doing all along.
 
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Subsea

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Jamie,

“Could you describe briefly how you incorporate macro algae into your reef tank? Do you include it in the display or in a sump/redugium“

KEEP THE TANGS OUT OF THE SEAWEED TANKS.
When I decided I wanted ornamental seaweeds in my mixed garden five year mature 120G, I removed all three tangs. I have small display tanks with a peppermint shrimp as the apex predator. In my 120G now, I have a school of Blue Yellow Tail damsels and a Copper Banded Butterfly fish.


With respect to lighting, I like 6K for seaweed tanks and I like 10K for mixed reef with anything inbetween. Corals and seaweed will adjust to what they get. Run lights to your viewing pleasure.

PS: @vlangel
What tang do you keep in your mixed garden? Any pictures.
 
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