Lurking danger 75g Dragon Lair

[TheWB]

I am excited to report that the 3 new fish are eating. During the feeding frenzy, the tank definitely looks fully stocked! The gobies and the bass stay quietly hidden until there is food and then everyone is out in full force.

I have been dosing a capful of Flourish for the macroalgae and I believe that it helped the shaving brush I bought before Thanksgiving to last longer than any other shaving brushes I have kept. I am going to dose a capful of Flourish 2Xs a week in hopes of keeping macros thriving even better. I have known that macros use iron very quickly but I don't have an iron test kit so I have been making evaluations based on observation alone. I also have a Halimeda left from the earlier order and now I have 2 more to observe.

Another change I am making is adding AFR to my water change saltwater bin. That will be a more consistent method of adding the big 3; Calcium, Alkalinity and Magnesium. Everything looks good after 1 water change so keeping my fingers .

I really like what you’ve done with this new tank upgrade.
Curious about the rational of adding the AFR to the newly mixed SW as opposed to dosing it daily?

 

[Tahoe61]

I really like what you’ve done with this new tank upgrade.
Curious about the rational of adding the AFR to the newly mixed SW as opposed to dosing it daily?

I have read that AFR is metabolized by the bacteria that develops in water storages containers leaving ARF ineffective.
For instance you're not supposed to add AFR to ATO containers because it's metabolized before the AFR even enters the system.
It's entirely possible I am incorrect. I would sure like to simply add it to my small volume ATO containers. If you're using the replacement water promptly after adding the AFR that should be effective though.

 

[vlangel]

I really like what you’ve done with this new tank upgrade.
Curious about the rational of adding the AFR to the newly mixed SW as opposed to dosing it daily?

I have read that AFR is metabolized by the bacteria that develops in water storages containers leaving ARF ineffective.
For instance you're not supposed to add AFR to ATO containers because it's metabolized before the AFR even enters the system.
It's entirely possible I am incorrect. I would sure like to simply add it to my small volume ATO containers. If you're using the replacement water promptly after adding the AFR that should be effective though.

TheWB, I use regular IO and I know that it doesn't have much of the big 3. I had been dosing AFR separately but i do it blind. I am not a tester so I have no idea how much consumption of calcium, Alkalinity or magnesium my tank consumes. I am not getting a lot of coraline algae so I know that I am not overdosing. I thought adding it to the water change water would be a less drastic blind way of adding it.

Tahoe61, I also have read that. I probably should at least test the water change saltwater after a week to see if it still has the elements in it. I did add AFR just prior to adding the water change saltwater to the tank so maybe this time it was effective but wont be the next water change, IDK. I guess I will see.

 

[TheWB]

TheWB, I use regular IO and I know that it doesn't have much of the big 3. I had been dosing AFR separately but i do it blind. I am not a tester so I have no idea how much consumption of calcium, Alkalinity or magnesium my tank consumes. I am not getting a lot of coraline algae so I know that I am not overdosing. I thought adding it to the water change water would be a less drastic blind way of adding it.

Tahoe61, I also have read that. I probably should at least test the water change saltwater after a week to see if it still has the elements in it. I did add AFR just prior to adding the water change saltwater to the tank so maybe this time it was effective but wont be the next water change, IDK. I guess I will see.

I get it. If you are open to doing some minimal testing I would recommend getting the Hanna Alkalinity Checker. Testing Alk can be done with it in less than a minute start to finish and Alk is what the AFR dose is based on. It may also be helpful to have an LFS text your Calcium and Magnesium too if you don’t have test kits just in case adjustments are needed so that the AFR works properly.
I hope this info was helpful. Love the tank.

 

[vlangel]

I get it. If you are open to doing some minimal testing I would recommend getting the Hanna Alkalinity Checker. Testing Alk can be done with it in less than a minute start to finish and Alk is what the AFR dose is based on. It may also be helpful to have an LFS text your Calcium and Magnesium too if you don’t have test kits just in case adjustments are needed so that the AFR works properly.
I hope this info was helpful. Love the tank.

Thank you for being so kind about my tank. I was a bit afraid to admit that I dose AFR blindly as I realize that is a risky practice and there are some folks who would rip you to shreds if you admit that. Your post is helpful so maybe I will order a Hanna Alk Checker. I have always used Salifert when I tested but these days I mostly only test nitrate and phosphate and let water changes fix the rest.
Another thing I have been contemplating is using half regular IO and half Reef Crystal's. Years ago when I used all Reef Crystal's I had so much coraline algae that I was chiselling it off the back wall and cleaning pumps a lot so I don't want that. However half and half might be just right for me.

 

[Cthulukelele]

Tank looking beautiful:)

 

[vlangel]

Tank looking beautiful:)

Aw, thank you!

 

[TheWB]

Thank you for being so kind about my tank. I was a bit afraid to admit that I dose AFR blindly as I realize that is a risky practice and there are some folks who would rip you to shreds if you admit that. Your post is helpful so maybe I will order a Hanna Alk Checker. I have always used Salifert when I tested but these days I mostly only test nitrate and phosphate and let water changes fix the rest.
Another thing I have been contemplating is using half regular IO and half Reef Crystal's. Years ago when I used all Reef Crystal's I had so much coraline algae that I was chiselling it off the back wall and cleaning pumps a lot so I don't want that. However half and half might be just right for me.

You're welcome, I don't chime in on too many threads but I'm glad to be helpful if I can. No ripping to shreds from me. I use Two Little Fishies AccuraSea1 salt mix for two reasons. One is that it mixes up to my preferred parameters so I don't have to mess around with additives to freshly mixed water. The second is that it comes in pre-measured 4.5 gallons pouches so I can easily do a 4.5 or 9 gallon water change without having to carefully measure anything except the amount of water I'm adding to the mixing bin, it's very consistent. That makes my AFR use easier because I know exactly how much to adjust dosing just by doing an Alk test with the Hanna Checker. That's what works for me. My tank is not perfect but is usually pretty stable, no wild swings of Alk or Salinity so take that for what it's worth.

 

[vlangel]

You're welcome, I don't chime in on too many threads but I'm glad to be helpful if I can. No ripping to shreds from me. I use Two Little Fishies AccuraSea1 salt mix for two reasons. One is that it mixes up to my preferred parameters so I don't have to mess around with additives to freshly mixed water. The second is that it comes in pre-measured 4.5 gallons pouches so I can easily do a 4.5 or 9 gallon water change without having to carefully measure anything except the amount of water I'm adding to the mixing bin, it's very consistent. That makes my AFR use easier because I know exactly how much to adjust dosing just by doing an Alk test with the Hanna Checker. That's what works for me. My tank is not perfect but is usually pretty stable, no wild swings of Alk or Salinity so take that for what it's worth.

Thanks I will think on that!

 

[vlangel]

Wow, I actually counted my fish today and I have 17! I have never had that many fish in 1 tank before and there is no aggression. Now many of them are small, only 1" and I have a good bit of rock with lots of hidey holes so everyone has a place to call home. Even the 3 new fish are coming out regularly now. The only fish that does not seem comfortable is the firefish goby. It started hiding after I got the wrasse and hawkfish although I have never seen either of them act aggressive toward the firefish or any other fish. I would have loved to get a possum wrasse but I know that I am already overstocked so I am not going to get any more fish. I really do love watching so many fairly fat fish swim comfortably in and through the rockwork like I have seen snorkeling. Its very rewarding

 

[vlangel]

Here are some pics of the new fish during feeding time. You have to look hard to see them. The bridled goby is white and blends in with the sand. The tobacco bass is just little. The conch is doing a bang up job on the sand too! I still havent seen the new cucumber since the 2nd day. Also pictured are the new lepto and monticap. Finally i took a pic of the RFA just because its pretty! I tested NO3 and PO4. Nitrates are 10 ppm, phosphates are .5 ppm. So I wont be changing the pre-filter.

 

[kolius]

Fantastic tank! One question—I didn’t see a skimmer in your setup (in the first post). Are you using one?

 

[vlangel]

Fantastic tank! One question—I didn’t see a skimmer in your setup (in the first post). Are you using one?

Thanks kolius, that's very kind of you.

Nope, I had a huge skimmer back in my seahorse days but when I moved into keeping a high nutrient softie/macroalgae tank, I shut down the skimmer because I needed to keep the nutrients up.

 

[kolius]

@vlangel, lots to learn from you—I was pretty sure a skimmer was a must!

One more question regarding your filter: how often do you clean your canister? @GARRIGA suggested eliminating the need to open the it if large, coarse media are used in the canister. @Subsea also mentioned how important “mulm” is in a reef tank. Therefore, I last opened my canister about half a year ago because my NO and PO readings have always been good. But maybe I should?

 

[vlangel]

@vlangel, lots to learn from you—I was pretty sure a skimmer was a must!

One more question regarding your filter: how often do you clean your canister? @GARRIGA suggested eliminating the need to open the it if large, coarse media are used in the canister. @Subsea also mentioned how important “mulm” is in a reef tank. Therefore, I last opened my canister about half a year ago because my NO and PO readings have always been good. But maybe I should?

The nutrient uptake from the macroalgae that I keep essentially is why I get away from needing a skimmer. Now its important to note that I don't keep many sps and no acros. Perhaps a skimmer is necessary for more demanding coral that are getting specialized foods. My coral are softies and easy LPS which typically like dirtier water.
And yes, @Subsea and @Paul B both who are more experienced aquarists than myself can testify to the importance of mulm in creating the food webs for a diverse working of organism. Detritus is hated on by reef keepers but in the right amount it actually can serve the aquarium by supporting organisms that utilize it.

I have only set up this 75g aquarium since Sept 2025 and only switched to the canister a few months ago from a hob AC filter. So in a way I am still working out how often I need to maintenance the canister and what that maintenance looks like. I intentionally chose an Oase BioMaster 850 canister for the pre-filter which allows the aquarists to rinse the coarse media of the pre-filter without opening the canister. I believe that will be a game changer because it makes maintenance so easy and fast so there is no excuse not to do it. I can perform this task in 5-10 minutes. I shouldn't need to maintenance the baskets inside the canister filled with live rock rubble more than once or twice a year from my research of others who use a canister this way.
If your NO3 and PO4 readings are good and your flow from the output is also still good, I wouldn't open your canister more than once a year.

 

[vlangel]

Bummer, as I sat down to enjoy my coffee in front of the tank this morning, I saw something on the sand where it didn't belong. Only the blue lights were on so I got closer. It was Angelica, my Coral Beauty and she had passed . She hadn't had any signs of being sick or weak that I had noticed so this was a shock. She was my 2nd to oldest fish, right after Ozzie the ocellaris. She was adult size when I bought her so no telling how old she really was when I bought her 5 years ago in February. I can 2nd guess myself that maybe I have too many fish in the tank but she was one of the biggest and in the ruling pack, so I doubt that was it. The tank seems healthy so it was probably just her time. Still I felt attached so I am sad to lose her. A pic of her and Ozzie right before Christmas.

 

[vlangel]

This morning's quick video!

 

[vlangel]

Well, things moved in a worse direction. I lost 2 more fish last night, so most likely Angelica didn't die of old age. I am leaning toward disease, probably because I overstocked. I am hoping the remaining fish can fight it off. I do have a neon cleaner goby in the tank which could help. I should have known better so now I could kick myself.

 

[Tahoe61]

I am sorry.

No signs and symptoms of disease?
You're not seeing any aggression, even posturing?

How long ago did you add the last fish?

 

[vlangel]

I am sorry.

No signs and symptoms of disease?
You're not seeing any aggression, even posturing?

How long ago did you add the last fish?

Thanks Tahoe61,

I added the last 3 fish with the KP Aquatics order, 2 weeks ago tomorrow.

I wasn't seeing anything with the fish except that the Midas started scratching off the sandbed. That is not an uncommon occurrence when I add new fish since I know that ich is in my aquarium. I do not do QT or TTM to keep disease out of my tank. Instead I try to keep my fish as stress free, and well fed and healthy as possible so when pathogens attack the fishes' immune systems fight it off.

That works best when one stays within the bounds of proper stocking and I sensed that I was crossing that line. Its a nebulous line and the last 3 fish were so small that I thought it would be alright. I hope that the rest of my fish will be okay but I will just have to wait and see. Its a painful lesson.