Marine Velvet

[MnFish1]

Thank everyone for their insight and expert advice.

My hippo tang is still recovering, I feel the cloudy eyes getting better, her breathing has improved compared to 3-4 days ago. She is upright 99% of times and flapping her fins instead is laying on her side compared to Monday. But still not eating. I’m trying to stay hopeful she will continue to improve.

Elbli tang - (one that swam against power head and had white dust on body but no cloudy eyes ) has nearly completely recovered. Barely any spots remaining in body. Started eating nori last night. I’m keeping my fingers crossed she is on her way to full recovery.

The other copper medicated hospital tank with 10 fish ( no visible sign of disease)

Foxface swims normal but not eating it’s been almost 7 days

Large leopard wrasse also not eating it’s been almost 7 days

The 8 other fish all behaving normal, eating normal and no visible sign of infection or parasites.

Great news overall. Can you remind everyone - which medication/method are you using for the fish not eating? If one was hypo salinity - it's sometimes not uncommon for appetite to drop. (This can happen during copper also) - The fish may also be eating when you're not watching - Overall its great that your fish are improving!

 

[JumboShrimp]

Well, that would certainly be classified as a "success story," no!?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I am aware velvet is a rare disease and I am aware how fast velvet can kill. The fishes that showed symptoms check all the boxes for velvet. Swimming against power head, loss of appetite. Hide in cave to avoid light, body covered in white sand /dust coating & cloudy eyes.

But as of now the 10 fish in separate quarantine tank is not showing any signs or symptoms. If it’s velvet are they asymptomatic ? If it’s not velvet and they are fine, should I stop copper treatment? As mentioned foxface and large leopard wrasse is not eating while in copper and it’s almost 7 days.?

You do need to run a full copper treatment to avoid a relapse of velvet. However, there is something else going on - foxface are not sensitive to copper at all. Leopard wrasse sometimes are, but there is something else keeping the foxface from eating. Sorry, I can't tell you what that might be though - it may not feel comfortable in your treatment tank (same with the wrasse). What fish are in the tank with them that ARE eating?

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

Great news overall. Can you remind everyone - which medication/method are you using for the fish not eating? If one was hypo salinity - it's sometimes not uncommon for appetite to drop. (This can happen during copper also) - The fish may also be eating when you're not watching - Overall its great that your fish are improving!

thanks, but i'm not out of woods yet.

*i need to note that foxface and large leopard wrasse when they were still in the 200Gal last thursday I have already noticed they were not eating when the White tail and Hippo tang were acting weird. But since they did not have any visible signs of disease i put them in the 40gal breeder tank and not together with with Hippo/Elbli/clownfish where those 3 appeared to be more severe cases.

the 1st 2 days i used coppersafe at 2ppm on both hospital tanks.
day 3 (Monday) i switched to Copper Power at 2.35ppm for all hospital tanks, using (hanna checker)
-also on monday, hippo, elbli, clownfish dipped in 30 min peroxide bath then back to 20 gal hospital tank.
- monday night clownfish passed, and i noticed more white dusting on Elbli tang I was afraid she is getting reinfected by the parasites coming off hippo tang, so I moved Elbli tang to a different 5 gal hospital tank with copper.
- tuesday by afternoon saw improvements on Elbli body and Hippo tang so bought 2 more 5 gal tanks and decide to do TTM as well as copper just because i feel the white dust/spots are improving.
-wed-friday - continue to see improvements with Hippo and Elbli tang by doing TTM every 24 hours, and continue to use Copper power at 2.35ppm. by thursday finally saw Elbli tang eating Nori I have never been happier to see a fish eat nori.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thank everyone for their insight and expert advice.

My hippo tang is still recovering, I feel the cloudy eyes getting better, her breathing has improved compared to 3-4 days ago. She is upright 99% of times and flapping her fins instead is laying on her side compared to Monday. But still not eating. I’m trying to stay hopeful she will continue to improve.

Elbli tang - (one that swam against power head and had white dust on body but no cloudy eyes ) has nearly completely recovered. Barely any spots remaining in body. Started eating nori last night. I’m keeping my fingers crossed she is on her way to full recovery.

The other copper medicated hospital tank with 10 fish ( no visible sign of disease)

Foxface swims normal but not eating it’s been almost 7 days

Large leopard wrasse also not eating it’s been almost 7 days

The 8 other fish all behaving normal, eating normal and no visible sign of infection or parasites.

This other tank you mention, What medication in that tank and at what treatment level?
Are they breathing normal or labored?
Assure with this many fish there is not an increase of ammonia above .025 and do add an air stone to assure good oxygen exchange

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

You do need to run a full copper treatment to avoid a relapse of velvet. However, there is something else going on - foxface are not sensitive to copper at all. Leopard wrasse sometimes are, but there is something else keeping the foxface from eating. Sorry, I can't tell you what that might be though - it may not feel comfortable in your treatment tank (same with the wrasse). What fish are in the tank with them that ARE eating?

yes all the hospital tanks are doing full copper treatment.

i need to note foxface and large wrasse i have not seen them eating since last thursday while they were in the 200gal display tank. Then Friday i had the fish death of the white tail and pull all fish out. They have been in copper since. Saturday i did do peroxide bath for foxface and wrasse but wrasse did not have a good reaction so pulled him out less than a min. but foxface did do a 30 min bath then back to copper treatment.

40gal with copper power at 2.35ppm
Foxface - not eating
large leopard - not eating
small leopard - eating
possum wrasse - eating
Mimic tang - eating
Gem tang - eating
Midas blenny - eating
springer damsel - eating
green chromis - eating
melanarus wrasse - eating

 

[JumboShrimp]

Regarding your Foxface and your Wrasse... I recently QT'd two butterfly fish in the same (divided) tank for 14 days of Copper Power, then General Cure. The Threadfin ate rather well the whole time, but the Pearlscale must have been STEALTH-eating, because all totaled I almost never saw him eat a thing for about 20 days. Naturally, I was quite worried. But he made it-- and both are now eating like pigs in the DT. Keep us posted!

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

This other tank you mention, What medication in that tank and at what treatment level?
Are they breathing normal or labored?
Assure with this many fish there is not an increase of ammonia above .025 and do add an air stone to assure good oxygen exchange

The other tank is also copper power at 2.35 ppm pwith air stone . I’m doing 30% water change every 2 days but even after wc the ammonia levels are 1ppm. From what I read it’s the copper causing this reading ?

I’m using seachem prime to detox ammonia while with copper. Fish doesn’t appear to show any sign of ammonia but I’m def concerned until my fishes can go back to normal display tank fully cycled

 

[MnFish1]

The other tank is also copper power at 2.35 ppm pwith air stone . I’m doing 30% water change every 2 days but even after wc the ammonia levels are 1ppm. From what I read it’s the copper causing this reading ?

I’m using seachem prime to detox ammonia while with copper. Fish doesn’t appear to show any sign of ammonia but I’m def concerned until my fishes can go back to normal display tank fully cycled

Seachem prime is not recommended with copper (though there are sites that say it's ok) - Many people also do not believe it detoxified ammonia - and it will affect ammonia tests - (they may stay high).

I would not to use it in a QT tank/hospital tank

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

Seachem prime is not recommended with copper (though there are sites that say it's ok) - Many people also do not believe it detoxified ammonia - and it will affect ammonia tests - (they may stay high).

I would not to use it in a QT tank/hospital tank

Got it,

What about dosing bacteria with copper will that help? Or just stick to water change and nothing else

 

[vetteguy53081]

The other tank is also copper power at 2.35 ppm pwith air stone . I’m doing 30% water change every 2 days but even after wc the ammonia levels are 1ppm. From what I read it’s the copper causing this reading ?

I’m using seachem prime to detox ammonia while with copper. Fish doesn’t appear to show any sign of ammonia but I’m def concerned until my fishes can go back to normal display tank fully cycled

Seachem prime does not do what the bottle implies and is not much different than stress coat and others which treat chloromine. chlorine, etc however can be used with copper. Best effect on ammonia are water changes and yes you can use bacteria which is encouraged

 

[MnFish1]

Got it,

What about dosing bacteria with copper will that help? Or just stick to water change and nothing else

Yes - bacteria help - if you have a sponge filter or something for the bacteria to 'land on'. Unless you're using chlorinated tap water - I would not use prime with copper (for ammonia reduction) - and the problem with it is that it will keep your ammonia test high -and its impossible to know what the true level is. Frankly - I would stick to water changes - with a sponge filter (or something similar) and RODI water to mix salt - though some use tap water for QT

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

Yes - bacteria help - if you have a sponge filter or something for the bacteria to 'land on'. Unless you're using chlorinated tap water - I would not use prime with copper (for ammonia reduction) - and the problem with it is that it will keep your ammonia test high -and its impossible to know what the true level is. Frankly - I would stick to water changes - with a sponge filter (or something similar) and RODI water to mix salt - though some use tap water for QT

Yes I’m still using RODI water for water changes. I read there may be some toxins in tap water for hospital tank so didn’t use it.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

yes all the hospital tanks are doing full copper treatment.

i need to note foxface and large wrasse i have not seen them eating since last thursday while they were in the 200gal display tank. Then Friday i had the fish death of the white tail and pull all fish out. They have been in copper since. Saturday i did do peroxide bath for foxface and wrasse but wrasse did not have a good reaction so pulled him out less than a min. but foxface did do a 30 min bath then back to copper treatment.

40gal with copper power at 2.35ppm
Foxface - not eating
large leopard - not eating
small leopard - eating
possum wrasse - eating
Mimic tang - eating
Gem tang - eating
Midas blenny - eating
springer damsel - eating
green chromis - eating
melanarus wrasse - eating

You may have said this, but what was the peroxide dose?

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

You may have said this, but what was the peroxide dose?

I used humble fish formula for 150ppm 20ml of 3% peroxide per gallon of saltwater for 30 min. Any sign of distress pull fish out.
Large Leopard wrasse was only wrasse I dipped within seconds it was laying on its side not moving so pulled him out right away. since no other wrasse was acting weird and also after seeing the leopards reaction to h2o2 I was afraid to do baths for others.

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

So today I noticed Mimic tang not eating and hiding in pvc pipe all day. Today is 8th day of copper treatment . Could this be copper sensitivity? In the brief moment I saw him out the body looks clean.

Yesterday he was eating nori and frozen for sure. Not sure what’s going on today ?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

So today I noticed Mimic tang not eating and hiding in pvc pipe all day. Today is 8th day of copper treatment . Could this be copper sensitivity? In the brief moment I saw him out the body looks clean.

Yesterday he was eating nori and frozen for sure. Not sure what’s going on today ?

Tangs are not at all sensitive to a properly done amine-chelated copper treatment. Are you seeing any rapid breathing or scratching? Is the water testing out good?

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

Tangs are not at all sensitive to a properly done amine-chelated copper treatment. Are you seeing any rapid breathing or scratching? Is the water testing out good?

No rapid breathing no flashing or scratching. Hope it’s just temporary. Water is good copper level at 2.3ppm . did a 30% water change yesterday.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

No rapid breathing no flashing or scratching. Hope it’s just temporary. Water is good copper level at 2.3ppm . did a 30% water change yesterday.

So zero ammonia? pH is above 7.8?
How is it doing this morning?

 

[m3xm3xm3x]

So zero ammonia? pH is above 7.8?
How is it doing this morning?

Yes PH is above 7.8 , ammonia even right after wc is still around 1ppm but I’m using seachem prime.

Mimic comes out more today but goes back to pvc pipe. And all I can see is his tail so can’t get to take good pic or have a good look at him.

Hippo tang and eibli tang I don’t see any more white spots or dust on body but I see them zooming around tank appears to be scratching or flashing on the heater. They prob had ich in addition to velvet?