Neptune SKY LED

[areefer01]

None of these people, except you, replaced XR 30's with Skys. Are you saying the same number XR 30's (as skys) would not work on your tank?

I have not seen a shadow test comparing XR 30's to Skys. I doubt it would be that big of a difference. Nothing that would impact coral growth or color, just the look of the tank--more contrast with radions and more flat with skys.

I did not say I replaced radions. I replaced 4 Kessil a360x's with 2 SKY's. I was going to go with 3 SKYS but they suggested 2. I wasn't sure, did the math, and said ok - I'll go with what they recommend/suggest.

1 Kessil 360x = 90w
4 x 90 = 360w

1 Sky = 219w
2 x 219 = 438w

Ignoring spread and par numbers the basic math says the 2 skys will produce a tick more total wattage than my previous lights. Assuming the spread was correct I figured it was safe to go with two so that is what I did. My display is 210 gallons @ 54 x 30 x 30. So 30's deep which the Kessil's mounting 10" above the waterline was able to still manage 90 to 130 par on the bottom (for reference). The SKYS range from 90 to 200 depending on the area of the sand bed (deepest part of the display and rock ledge).

Again everyone's system is going to be a bit different even if we have the same tank dimensions. You may have more rock, or I may. Your corals may be more mature and full. You may have more clear water because of ozone or UV or filter socks, etc. I wish it was easy to say you will need X amount but they give a guideline or recommendation similar to the minimum mounting height. I can only speak of what I have or heard via Dana and BRS. Dana noted they "technically" could recommend a wider spread but Neptune said they are happy with what they recommend. I think it is safer if that makes sense. Or consistent.

I do know a few NSI members switched from G4's but not the specifics. I apologize. I do think you need to go with what your gut tells you. You know your system better than anyone. If this is something you are considering then grab a tape measure and mark the sidewalk or cardboard with your display then the respected light spread box. See what that shows you.

Edit: corrected sky par number on sand bed

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

I did not say I replaced radions. I replaced 4 Kessil a360x's with 2 SKY's. I was going to go with 3 SKYS but they suggested 2. I wasn't sure, did the math, and said ok - I'll go with what they recommend/suggest.

1 Kessil 360x = 90w
4 x 90 = 360w

1 Sky = 219w
2 x 219 = 438w

Ignoring spread and par numbers the basic math says the 2 skys will produce a tick more total wattage than my previous lights. Assuming the spread was correct I figured it was safe to go with two so that is what I did. My display is 210 gallons @ 54 x 30 x 30. So 30's deep which the Kessil's mounting 10" above the waterline was able to still manage 90 to 130 par on the bottom (for reference). The SKYS range from 90 to 200 depending on the area of the sand bed (deepest part of the display and rock ledge).

Again everyone's system is going to be a bit different even if we have the same tank dimensions. You may have more rock, or I may. Your corals may be more mature and full. You may have more clear water because of ozone or UV or filter socks, etc. I wish it was easy to say you will need X amount but they give a guideline or recommendation similar to the minimum mounting height. I can only speak of what I have or heard via Dana and BRS. Dana noted they "technically" could recommend a wider spread but Neptune said they are happy with what they recommend. I think it is safer if that makes sense. Or consistent.

I do know a few NSI members switched from G4's but not the specifics. I apologize. I do think you need to go with what your gut tells you. You know your system better than anyone. If this is something you are considering then grab a tape measure and mark the sidewalk or cardboard with your display then the respected light spread box. See what that shows you.

Edit: corrected sky par number on sand bed

My only point is that Neptune is a bit misleading claiming that 3 Skys replace 5 XR 30's, no matter how anyone slices it.

Three of either light is about the same amount of light and spread, par wise or by any other test, by the manufacturer's own stated specs as to coverage area, number of LEDs, and wattage consumed.

I just think Neptune making any such statements/claims is out to lunch...

Lots of tanks can run on 2, 3, or 4 of either light. One light does not produce substantially more par, punch, or spread. It's just a matter of personal preference as to the look and function of the light.

I think Neptune is erroneously trying to clam that Sky is superior to XR-30's with statements like 3 Skys can replace 5 XR-30's. It's nonsense.

P.S. Neptune should make its own mount rather than constantly copying others.

 

[jcates]

Technically they do have their own hanging kit. And didn't copy ecotech's mount just the bolt pattern. If anything it has the potential to increase ecotech sales.

I honestly wish everyone would use the same pattern. We'd ( the end users) have way more options.

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Technically they do have their own hanging kit. And didn't copy ecotech's mount just the bolt pattern. If anything it has the potential to increase ecotech sales.

I honestly wish everyone would use the same pattern. We'd ( the end users) have way more options.

I just think it shows how they rushed the Sky to market. I am fine with using the same mounting pattern. Although it's probably a purposeful jab at eco-tech given the company's past relations.

It's the fact they have nothing to attach to the light to mount it (other than a hanging kit) that i find amusing.

I guess eco-tech could equally say three XR-30's replace 5 Skys, but that is equally nonsensical; they're basically the same light, although ecotech i think makes more of theirs in the USA and Sky, from what Jake Adams wrote, has no protection for its electronics at all from water or moisture.

I am also curious if Jake is correct that the soft rubber coating on Skys may eventually turn into a sticky mess?

 

[areefer01]

My only point is that Neptune is a bit misleading claiming that 3 Skys replace 5 XR 30's, no matter how anyone slices it.

Three of either light is about the same amount of light and spread, par wise or by any other test, by the manufacturer's own stated specs as to coverage area, number of LEDs, and wattage consumed.

I just think Neptune making any such statements/claims is out to lunch...

Lots of tanks can run on 2, 3, or 4 of either light. One light does not produce substantially more par, punch, or spread. It's just a matter of personal preference as to the look and function of the light.

I think Neptune is erroneously trying to clam that Sky is superior to XR-30's with statements like 3 Skys can replace 5 XR-30's. It's nonsense.

P.S. Neptune should make its own mount rather than constantly copying others.

Really not sure what is misleading. Either they tested it or BRS did and they came up with a recommendation. Not sure what to say other than that.

As far as the mount goes also why would you care? They have a bolt pattern and use whatever works for you. It is just an option and they provide a kit should you want to use it. I happened to use the RMS mount. Center tap, mount to 80/20, slide and adjust as I see fit. Super simple and it works for me.

From what I am reading here you don't buy into the claim or brs test results. That is fine. We all get to choose.

 

[areefer01]

Technically they do have their own hanging kit. And didn't copy ecotech's mount just the bolt pattern. If anything it has the potential to increase ecotech sales.

I honestly wish everyone would use the same pattern. We'd ( the end users) have way more options.

It would make a lot easier if we had some standards for sure. Reduce some clutter and make a few quality of life improvements. Have to say the IOTA kessil, Sicce, and Apex IOTA integration was a nice start. Kessil makes amazing lights but their controller and wifi app is a bit cumbersome.

 

[Jon's Reef]

I guess this is where i am lost. Ecotech says an XR 30 has a maximum spread of 32" x 32":

Neptune says Sky has a maximum spread of 30" x 36":

To add a 3rd:

A500x

If a tank has no obstructions, eg. a frag tank, then these value apply. But when an auqascape or large corals are added, shadowing becomes a concern. In this case, the larger the area of emission, the less shadowing is present.

I just don't understand Neptune's (contradictory...) marketing statement i suppose that the 3 sky's will replace 5 XR 30's.

In this case 3 XR30 were used to create the right uniformity of coverage. (48x24x24). They are each being run at 40%. In this case I would guess 2 SKY at 60% could light the tank with same or better uniformity.

If your example of 5 XR30, if they are being used at 100%, 5 SKY would be needed. If they are being used at less that 100%... eg. 60%.... then 3 SKY would do the job.

 

[Jon's Reef]

although ecotech i think makes more of theirs in the USA and Sky, from what Jake Adams wrote, has no protection for its electronics at all from water or moisture.

Both the Radions and SKY are made in the USA. The only difference in PoM is Ecotech does board layout were Neptune uses a local supplier (they are near Silicon Valley).

Neither the Radion or SKY has passive water protection. Only Kessil has a conformal coating (I think this point came up before)

 

[jcates]

Is there a video of the guys at Neptune picking on old people or punching babies or something and I'm the last to know about it??

Some of the posts on here dragging this product through the mud would make me believe so..

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

To add a 3rd:

A500x

If a tank has no obstructions, eg. a frag tank, then these value apply. But when an auqascape or large corals are added, shadowing becomes a concern. In this case, the larger the area of emission, the less shadowing is present.

In this case 3 XR30 were used to create the right uniformity of coverage. (48x24x24). They are each being run at 40%. In this case I would guess 2 SKY at 60% could light the tank with same or better uniformity.

If your example of 5 XR30, if they are being used at 100%, 5 SKY would be needed. If they are being used at less that 100%... eg. 60%.... then 3 SKY would do the job.

I like the diagram. But you could simply have two XR 30's and still grow the same coral just fine, maybe better. What you're really discussing is the look of the tank, and contrast and shadowing or the lack there of; two XR 30's and two Sky's will do the same job but the tank may look different.

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Both the Radions and SKY are made in the USA. The only difference in PoM is Ecotech does board layout were Neptune uses a local supplier (they are near Silicon Valley).

Neither the Radion or SKY has passive water protection. Only Kessil has a conformal coating (I think this point came up before)

I'm glad i own kessils i guess then

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

Is there a video of the guys at Neptune picking on old people or punching babies or something and I'm the last to know about it??

Some of the posts on here dragging this product through the mud would make me believe so..

I think Neptune creates its own mud and then face plants in it....

 

[Jon's Reef]

But you could simply have two XR 30's and still grow the same coral just fine, maybe better.

The 2 XR30 setup was tested by BRS and they were not able to achieve SPS par and uniformity.

 

[Jon's Reef]

I think Neptune creates its own mud and then face plants in it....

As you are making a general statement about a company, please provide 5 examples with evidence.

 

[Scorpius]

Ah, threads like this remind me of OT in NASIOC back in it's hayday.

 

[trmiv]

This thread reminds me of a quote from the Howard Stern movie, Private Parts


Researcher: 'The average radio listener listens for eighteen minutes. The average Howard Stern fan listens for - are you ready for this? - an hour and twenty minutes.'
Pig Vomit: 'How can that be?'
Researcher: 'Answer most commonly given? "I want to see what he'll say next."'
Pig Vomit: 'Okay, fine. But what about the people who hate Stern?'
Researcher: 'Good point. The average Stern hater listens for two and a half hours a day.'
Pig Vomit: 'But if they hate him, why do they listen?'
Researcher: 'Most common answer? "I want to see what he'll say next."'

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

The 2 XR30 setup was tested by BRS and they were not able to achieve SPS par and uniformity.

Who says you need 100% "par uniformity" for SPS other than the owners of Neptune? I don't see 100% par uniformity on any light.

 

[Mywifeisgunnakillme]

As you are making a general statement about a company, please provide 5 examples with evidence.

Okay Neptune fanboy, here is what i saying:

When Neptune states that 3 Sky units will "replace" 5 XR 30's--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when people call them out on the ridiculous claim.

When Neptune creates tacky fake informercials with compensated one way or another beta testers (and almost every person on youtube talking about reef tanks) before any units are sold to general public, and all claim no bias in their reviews--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it--when no criticism of the unit is expressed at all by anyone until people unaffiliated with the company review the unit, like Jake Adams....

When Neptune is so obsessed with controlling the message going out on the internet pre-sale of the Sky that they tell beta testers what they can and can't say--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it--when no criticism of the unit is expressed at all by anyone until people unaffiliated with the company review the unit, like Jake Adams....

When Neptune releases a light without an aquarium mount and has to tell buyers to use its competition's aquarium mount that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when they try to tell us it was for any reason other than they were rushing the product to market...

When Neptune solicits retailers not to sell competing controllers like Hydros, that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it, when they get caught doing so and try to deny it....

When Neptune wavemakers and products like the trident testers and requires users to buy their controllers just use those--should be stand alone products---that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when they try to say such practices some how actually benefit customers/reefers...

I think that's five or six, should i go on?

 

[Jon's Reef]

Okay Neptune fanboy

Not a fanboy. I use what works for me. When I have first hand experience, I like to share it whether good or bad.

The internet is filled with bad experiences, but people tend not to share when something works.

Who says you need 100% "par uniformity" for SPS other than the owners of Neptune? I don't see 100% par uniformity on any light.

When Neptune states that 3 Sky units will "replace" 5 XR 30's--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when people call them out on the ridiculous claim.

If the tank requires 5 XR30 run at 100% for par, then the number of SKY will be similar. If the tank is running those 5 XR30 at less than 100% for coverage... ex 60%.... then a reduced number of SKY will likely do the job... ex 3 at 100%.

When Neptune creates tacky fake informercials with compensated one way or another beta testers (and almost every person on youtube talking about reef tanks) before any units are sold to general public, and all claim no bias in their reviews--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it--when no criticism of the unit is expressed at all by anyone until people unaffiliated with the company review the unit, like Jake Adams....

That is called marketing. If you don't like it, don't watch. I watched them, knowing that they are commercials, to gain small insights. Many well respected people were in the videos and they have stated multiple times that they gave their true opinions. Reef Builders did a great job showing the interior of the light. But it is important to remember that it also contains many opinions. Examples

"rising tank temperatures from this stream of hot air" --> There are also reports of no change, or a reduction in tank temp (due to evaporation)

"it’s probably ‘fine’ during normal operation but loose parts don’t exactly instill confidence." --> Has been addressed many times, the reason for the design choice is the concern of breakage due to the thin material and small bezel.Design inspired by light diffusers in floating tile installations.

"Neptune only saw fit to include a paltry FOUR control channels" -->On other lights (Radions, Kessils) I have used all of the channels to adjust because I just didn't like the spectrum. With the Sky, I have found no reason to even touch the 4 channels. I could see if someone liked the greenish tank color, they may have preferred to separate the Royal and Blue leds.

"we couldn’t help but be somewhat alarmed at the minimal amount of aluminum of the heatsink which is somewhat offset by having double the number of cooling fans." --> Any scientific backing to this concern? From a thermal management perspective, the broad distribution of diodes results in an exponential reduction in thermal hotspots.

"Neptune Systems didn’t use either of these tried and tested techniques for building long lasting aquarium electronics." --> Yup, I look forward to Neptune's response.

When Neptune is so obsessed with controlling the message going out on the internet pre-sale of the Sky that they tell beta testers what they can and can't say--that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it--when no criticism of the unit is expressed at all by anyone until people unaffiliated with the company review the unit, like Jake Adams....

Before a product is released it is standard protocol for any development to limit info from Beta testers. There have been many negative comments since release, whether it be the spectrum or construction and Neptune has been doing a good job of addressing it in their live stream including bringing in external experts.

When Neptune releases a light without an aquarium mount and has to tell buyers to use its competition's aquarium mount that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when they try to tell us it was for any reason other than they were rushing the product to market...

I don't think this was an issues. It is nice that they are starting a "trend" towards a standard. Also when developing a product there is always going to be a deadline. I would rather have their team working on the light and use a well known mounting solution than spend that R&D/ testing time on an accessory.

When Neptune solicits retailers not to sell competing controllers like Hydros, that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it, when they get caught doing so and try to deny it....

This was never proven fact. Ryan from BRS specifically released a video dismissing it.

When Neptune wavemakers and products like the trident testers and requires users to buy their controllers just use those--should be stand alone products---that is creating a mud puddle and subsequently falling face first in it when they try to say such practices some how actually benefit customers/reefers...

There are benefits to the ecosystem. Making it stand alone would add substantially to the cost. If you prefer to have a stand alone, there are many different choices on the market... but this is not a stumbling point.



Overall it is great that we have choice in the market. I don't know why people have a compulsion to sow doubt. Any of the lights (Radion, Kessil or SKY) will yield great results. If you are struggling, it is probably not the light at that point.

 

[areefer01]

Not a fanboy. I use what works for me. When I have first hand experience, I like to share it whether good or bad.

The internet is filled with bad experiences, but people tend not to share when something works.



If the tank requires 5 XR30 run at 100% for par, then the number of SKY will be similar. If the tank is running those 5 XR30 at less than 100% for coverage... ex 60%.... then a reduced number of SKY will likely do the job... ex 3 at 100%.


That is called marketing. If you don't like it, don't watch. I watched them, knowing that they are commercials, to gain small insights. Many well respected people were in the videos and they have stated multiple times that they gave their true opinions. Reef Builders did a great job showing the interior of the light. But it is important to remember that it also contains many opinions. Examples

"rising tank temperatures from this stream of hot air" --> There are also reports of no change, or a reduction in tank temp (due to evaporation)

"it’s probably ‘fine’ during normal operation but loose parts don’t exactly instill confidence." --> Has been addressed many times, the reason for the design choice is the concern of breakage due to the thin material and small bezel.Design inspired by light diffusers in floating tile installations.

"Neptune only saw fit to include a paltry FOUR control channels" -->On other lights (Radions, Kessils) I have used all of the channels to adjust because I just didn't like the spectrum. With the Sky, I have found no reason to even touch the 4 channels. I could see if someone liked the greenish tank color, they may have preferred to separate the Royal and Blue leds.

"we couldn’t help but be somewhat alarmed at the minimal amount of aluminum of the heatsink which is somewhat offset by having double the number of cooling fans." --> Any scientific backing to this concern? From a thermal management perspective, the broad distribution of diodes results in an exponential reduction in thermal hotspots.

"Neptune Systems didn’t use either of these tried and tested techniques for building long lasting aquarium electronics." --> Yup, I look forward to Neptune's response.


Before a product is released it is standard protocol for any development to limit info from Beta testers. There have been many negative comments since release, whether it be the spectrum or construction and Neptune has been doing a good job of addressing it in their live stream including bringing in external experts.


I don't think this was an issues. It is nice that they are starting a "trend" towards a standard. Also when developing a product there is always going to be a deadline. I would rather have their team working on the light and use a well known mounting solution than spend that R&D/ testing time on an accessory.


This was never proven fact. Ryan from BRS specifically released a video dismissing it.


There are benefits to the ecosystem. Making it stand alone would add substantially to the cost. If you prefer to have a stand alone, there are many different choices on the market... but this is not a stumbling point.



Overall it is great that we have choice in the market. I don't know why people have a compulsion to sow doubt. Any of the lights (Radion, Kessil or SKY) will yield great results. If you are struggling, it is probably not the light at that point.

@Jon's Reef some people do not want to hear the other side of the narrative unless it aligns with their view. Doesn't matter the source the trend or pattern is the same. They are right, other side is wrong. Those that can remove their bias and are objective run with the information and make a informed decision.

This is why Neptune ran a small video going into a bit more detail and even that wasn't good enough. Conserve your energy and reply to those looking to actually use your feedback.