New Borbonius Anthias lying on its side

[christinna77]

Hey all! I just received my beautiful Borbonius anthias today. Unfortunately, the overnight shipping was delayed, and it was stuck in the bag for two days. The water smelled absolutely awful when I opened it. I temp acclimated it - salinity in the bag was already at 34ppt, so I dropped it in the QT right after, as I didn’t want it in that water any longer than necessary.

It was lying on its belly in the bag and barely alive. Now it's doing a bit better, but still swimming sideways. Is there anything I can do to help? I have ruby rally and methylene blue on hand, but I’m not sure if a bath would just stress it out more right now. Thanks!

 

[nasdds]

Borbonius like to perch against a wall and swim like that when they are in a new environment.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hey all! I just received my beautiful Borbonius anthias today. Unfortunately, the overnight shipping was delayed, and it was stuck in the bag for two days. The water smelled absolutely awful when I opened it. I temp acclimated it - salinity in the bag was already at 34ppt, so I dropped it in the QT right after, as I didn’t want it in that water any longer than necessary.

It was lying on its belly in the bag and barely alive. Now it's doing a bit better, but still swimming sideways. Is there anything I can do to help? I have ruby rally and methylene blue on hand, but I’m not sure if a bath would just stress it out more right now. Thanks!

Not an abnormal swimming pattern, even head down at times, but do allow it to settle in. It should be ready to eat and breathing should be non-labored as it settles

 

[christinna77]

Thank you both! I just fed it with some LRS and mysis for the first time, and it aggressively gobbled it up, so that's great news.

 

[MnFish1]

Hey all! I just received my beautiful Borbonius anthias today. Unfortunately, the overnight shipping was delayed, and it was stuck in the bag for two days. The water smelled absolutely awful when I opened it. I temp acclimated it - salinity in the bag was already at 34ppt, so I dropped it in the QT right after, as I didn’t want it in that water any longer than necessary.

That makes sense -Did you happen to test the ammonia?

It was lying on its belly in the bag and barely alive. Now it's doing a bit better, but still swimming sideways. Is there anything I can do to help? I have ruby rally and methylene blue on hand, but I’m not sure if a bath would just stress it out more right now. Thanks!

Methylene blue will not be helpful. I don't see a reason for ruby rally. What is your plan for quarantine? Copper? Prazipro? I would not do 'bath'

I would carefully watch - consider the quarantine protocol. I would also notify the shipper etc - in case you need to open a claim. (Though my understanding is that live animals are not included). To me the wrasse looks pretty good considering everything

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Thank you both! I just fed it with some LRS and mysis for the first time, and it aggressively gobbled it up, so that's great news.

Borbonius develop a variety of swim bladder and health issues. That this one is eating is a good sign though.

I’d use black construction paper to black out the tank sides where it is liking to hang out. Then, only light the tank enough for it to see its food. The tank looks brand new, so monitor the ammonia closely.

 

[christinna77]

That makes sense -Did you happen to test the ammonia?

Methylene blue will not be helpful. I don't see a reason for ruby rally. What is your plan for quarantine? Copper? Prazipro? I would not do 'bath'

I would carefully watch - consider the quarantine protocol. I would also notify the shipper etc - in case you need to open a claim. (Though my understanding is that live animals are not included). To me the wrasse looks pretty good considering everything

Thanks! I didn't test the bag water ammonia, no, I just temp acclimated and dropped the anthias in.

Yeah, I'm leaning towards not bathing it in anything, it perked up and is already exploring the QT tank a bit.

The plan is to follow the current quarantine protocol like I've done in the past, however I transfer the fish mid treatment - copper for 4 weeks, then it goes to a clean observation tank, followed up by 2-3 GC treatments every 7 days, depending on whether I'm seeing any signs of flukes at all. Then one more week of observation and DT.

I already notified the vendor, they're going to issue me a credit as I had one other fish that was DOA, and they should also get a full refund from Fedex as it was supposed to be a guaranteed overnight shipping.

 

[christinna77]

Borbonius develop a variety of swim bladder and health issues. That this one is eating is a good sign though.

I’d use black construction paper to black out the tank sides where it is liking to hang out. Then, only light the tank enough for it to see its food. The tank looks brand new, so monitor the ammonia closely.

Thanks, Jay, appreciate it! I blacked out both sides, it seems to be doing better now. The tank uses pre-cycled sponges from my DT, as well as has been re-dosed with more nitrifying bacteria, so we should be good there. I always scrub it clean between batches, and replace all the media, just in case there's still anything left that could infect the new fish.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Thank you both! I just fed it with some LRS and mysis for the first time, and it aggressively gobbled it up, so that's great news.

As stated, ready to eat while settling in Offer also spirulina brine shrimp, plankton, LRS fish frenzy and TDO pellets
Mine eat a whole array of foods including

 

[mcarroll]

I didn't test the bag water ammonia, no, I just temp acclimated and dropped the anthias in.

If the bag water is suspected to have ammonia (eg smells) then raising pH, salinity or temperature causes the ammonia to skew toward being more and more toxic. IMO if the water is badly compromised, there's no harm in taking them out "now".

http://www.sustainableaquatics.com/docs/Acclimation-White-Paper.docx

 

[christinna77]

I didn't test the bag water ammonia, no, I just temp acclimated and dropped the anthias in.

If the bag water is suspected to have ammonia (eg smells) then raising pH, salinity or temperature causes the ammonia to skew toward being more and more toxic. IMO if the water is badly compromised, there's no harm in taking them out "now".

http://www.sustainableaquatics.com/docs/Acclimation-White-Paper.docx

That's what I did. I don't drip acclimate shipped fish anymore, I just temp acclimate and lower my QT salinity if needed.

 

[mcarroll]

I think temp has the lesser effect of the three factors mentioned (temp, salinity and pH) but if the water is really bad and you know it (if it smells bad, it is bad), I think you can even skip temperature equalization.

Don't let me contradict anything in that doc file I linked though....IMO that's one of the best acclimation procedures. Very well thought out. :)

 

[christinna77]

I think temp has the lesser effect of the three factors mentioned (temp, salinity and pH) but if the water is really bad and you know it (if it smells bad, it is bad), I think you can even skip temperature equalization.

Don't let me contradict anything in that doc file I linked though....IMO that's one of the best acclimation procedures. Very well thought out. :)

Hey, just got a chance to read it now. Thanks for the article! The conclusion on acclimating long shipped fish lines up with what Jay recommends here too, and which is what I follow now: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/acclimation-methods.903/. In this case I just temp acclimated though, as the other fish was already DOA, and the anthias looked like it was on its way out soon too.

Since I started ignoring vendor instructions (like drip acclimating with Prime or Ammo Lock), I haven't had any acclimation issues. Yeah, I might not get my money back if the fish doesn't make it, but I'm fine taking that risk.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

That's what I did. I don't drip acclimate shipped fish anymore, I just temp acclimate and lower my QT salinity if needed.

A refinement of that method is to adjust the pH of the receiving water as well as salinity and temperature and then acclimate the pH up from there. This is the best method to use if the receiving tank is at a higher salinity.

 

[christinna77]

Update: Anthias is doing well and seems healthy overall. I feed 4-5 times a day. It's quickly becoming my favorite, right after my tilefish :) Thanks everyone for your insights!

 

[larrysaltisfun]

Ah, the tile fish… August and September’s read…. Glad he’s doing well

 

[Damage12]

Beautiful fish and good job bringing him back. They are such cool fish.

 

[christinna77]

Ah, the tile fish… August and September’s read…. Glad he’s doing well

It's been a journey, lol. He's the boss of the tank now.

 

[christinna77]

A small update: After 3 weeks in 2.3 ppm copper power (monitored religiously with the Hanna checker) doing great, the anthias started flashing - coming up to the wavemaker and rubbing its gills and belly area against it repeatedly, every few minutes. I couldn't record a video since he would stop flashing whenever I got too close. Breathing doesn't seem rapid or heavy, and he's still eating really well (fed four times daily with a frozen mix).

After seeing the signs, I performed a FW dip on both fish in the QT and noticed a few ovals in the bucket, but they could've been leftover sand from quarantining a wrasse previously. Could it be that either the anthias or the clown had flukes, and I'm only now seeing signs now, after almost a month in QT?

The anthias completely freaked out during the FW dip too (tap water, temp and pH matched, heavily aerated) - he tried to repeatedly jump out, then kept belly flopping every few seconds. I only did 4 minutes before getting him out and into a new (cycled) observation tank (same salinity, temp and similar pH as my QT tank), away from all the copper and any possible leftover eggs in the QT tank. He seems pretty stressed out now, so I'll see how he's doing in the morning before administering Prazi (I prefer to observe the fish for a few hours after dosing) - planning to do 3 doses 7 days apart.

The clown handled the FW dip well and never showed any signs of flukes, no heavy/rapid breathing, or anything else. Nothing new was introduced to the QT tank, so it's a bit of a mystery. I'll try to grab some new pictures/videos tomorrow.

 

[christinna77]

Here's a video from this morning. Both fish are eating and exploring the tank. Will go ahead and proceed with Prazi.