New DIY Two Part Recipes with Higher pH Boost

[Miami Reef]

So I started dosing the sodium hydroxide version a couple of weeks ago. The first few days I got a great ph boost, peaking above 8.3 for a few days. Then I noticed the boost started to lessen. Yesterday ph peaked at 8.17. Today it’s on track to peak around 8.12. I measured the ph of the alk solution and got 12.1 and 12.2 (two different meters, pinpoint and apex). I did not measure the ph of the solution when I first made it so not sure what it was then. It it absorbing co2 and losing potency? I’ve probably dosed a 1/4 of the gallon container I’m using.

Great question! Does CO2 lower the PH of these additives?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Great question! Does CO2 lower the PH of these additives?

Yes. CO2 converts hydroxide into carbonate and then bicarbonate. It takes a lot though.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So I started dosing the sodium hydroxide version a couple of weeks ago. The first few days I got a great ph boost, peaking above 8.3 for a few days. Then I noticed the boost started to lessen. Yesterday ph peaked at 8.17. Today it’s on track to peak around 8.12. I measured the ph of the alk solution and got 12.1 and 12.2 (two different meters, pinpoint and apex). I did not measure the ph of the solution when I first made it so not sure what it was then. It it absorbing co2 and losing potency? I’ve probably dosed a 1/4 of the gallon container I’m using.

I do not think those pH values are accurate. Calibration is tricky at very high pH, and the starting pH is above 14.

I would keep the container mostly closed to prevent CO2 entry.

 

[JCOLE]

@Randy Holmes-Farley Does concentration affect pH of the solution?

I currently use Reef Fusion 2 which has an alkalinity of 4400 meq/L. Should I concentrate the solution to the same level or just dose more of it throughout the day?

 

[venugopalreddyg]

Here's a first crack at what may end up being multiple possible recipes for a DIY two part that either has a higher pH or can be made more concentrated than traditional two part recipes. This one has about twice the pH raising effect compared to a carbonate based two part, per unit of alkalinity or calcium added. Note that I have neither made nor used this recipe. I fully expect it to work, but first adopters will be guinea pigs.

Note that the formation of some cloudiness of magnesium hydroxide is expected when the alk part hits the water (as carbonate versions also do). That is OK since it redissolves on mixing in more. But since the local pH is higher, there may be more chance for local precipitation of calcium carbonate, which is not optimal since it may waste additive (but otherwise is not a huge problem, IMO). To reduce this chance, add slowly to a very high flow area.

This first one is based on Jim Welsh's version of a DIY two part:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/s...hould-i-expect-to-change.215171/#post-2466696

Jim's recipe (with some text added by me):

Part 1 - The Calcium and Magnesium Part​

Dissolve 500 g of calcium chloride dihydrate plus 261.2 g of magnesium chloride hexahydrate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

Part 2 - The Alkalinity and Sulfate Part​

Dissolve 374.7 g of sodium carbonate (594 g of baking soda that has been baked; = 3.535 moles of sodium carbonate) plus 68.7 g of sodium sulfate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

This recipe is the same strength as Randy's Recipe #1 (e.g., BRS). To make these two parts with the same strength as B-Ionic, then multiply the amounts of the salts by 1.5 (but note dissolving the carbonate can become challenging).​

The sodium hydroxide version:

Part 1 - The Calcium and Magnesium Part​

Dissolve 500 g of calcium chloride dihydrate plus 261.2 g of magnesium chloride hexahydrate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon.​

​

Part 2 - The Alkalinity and Sulfate Part​

Dissolve 282.8 g of sodium hydroxide (=7.07 moles of sodium hydroxide to match the 3.535 moles of sodium carbonate in alkalinity) plus 68.7 g of sodium sulfate in enough water to make a total volume of one gallon. BE CAREFUL WITH THIS SOLUTION: IT HAS A pH ABOVE 14. Do not get it in your eyes or on your skin.​

​

This recipe is the same strength as Randy's Recipe #1 (e.g., BRS). To make these two parts with the same strength as B-Ionic, then multiply the amounts of the salts by 1.5. This version can readily be made more concentrated, if that is a goal.​

Hello Randy, Thank you very much for providing us the high PH recipe.. Can i use my Neptune DOS to dose sodium Hydroxide...? I am not sure if the silicon tubing can withstand the potency of the NaOH solution... What are my dosing pump options if i want to dose Na OH.?

 

[trmiv]

Hello Randy, Thank you very much for providing us the high PH recipe.. Can i use my Neptune DOS to dose sodium Hydroxide...? I am not sure if the silicon tubing can withstand the potency of the NaOH solution... What are my dosing pump options if i want to dose Na OH.?

I'm not Randy, but I've been using my DOS to dose sodium hydroxide for a few months now. Appears to be fine. I know of others using a DOS as well.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley Does concentration affect pH of the solution?

I currently use Reef Fusion 2 which has an alkalinity of 4400 meq/L. Should I concentrate the solution to the same level or just dose more of it throughout the day?

Did this get resolved?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hello Randy, Thank you very much for providing us the high PH recipe.. Can i use my Neptune DOS to dose sodium Hydroxide...? I am not sure if the silicon tubing can withstand the potency of the NaOH solution... What are my dosing pump options if i want to dose Na OH.?

silicone tubing should be ok. There are tables of chemical comparability with many types of plastics and tubing. I do know know what brand pumps are best. Avoid polycarbonate.

 

[JCOLE]

Did this get resolved?

Hey Randy! No. I haven't switched from Reef Fusion yet. I have everything to make this but wanted to know these first before I make the switch. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Reefahholic]

I haven’t read the whole thread, but I’m curious how high of a pH bump people are getting from this awesome hybrid 2-part!?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hey Randy! No. I haven't switched from Reef Fusion yet. I have everything to make this but wanted to know these first before I make the switch. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I would just dose more. It won’t reduce the pH effect. Spreading the dose out reduces the peak, but the concentration dosed doesn’t alter the pH boost per dKH of alk added.

 

[JCOLE]

I would just dose more. It won’t reduce the pH effect. Spreading the dose out reduces the peak, but the concentration dosed doesn’t alter the pH boost per dKH of alk added.

Perfect. Thank you!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Perfect. Thank you!

You're welcome.

Happy Reefing.

 

[venugopalreddyg]

silicone tubing should be ok. There are tables of chemical comparability with many types of plastics and tubing. I do know know what brand pumps are best. Avoid polycarbonate.

Thank you Randy..

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you Randy..

You're welcome.

Happy Reefing.

 

[Cassklar]

I was looking and reading through the pages. so just to be sure this recipe will boost ph I have a problem with low ph and I don't like what im using now bright well alkaline 8.3 p I wanted to do your recipe randy but I just wanted to make sure it will help with ph and which recipe you would recommend thanks

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I was looking and reading through the pages. so just to be sure this recipe will boost ph I have a problem with low ph and I don't like what im using now bright well alkaline 8.3 p I wanted to do your recipe randy but I just wanted to make sure it will help with ph and which recipe you would recommend thanks

the normal carbonate two part recipe is a big step over the Brightwell product, and this hydroxide is another step up again.
You might try a normal sodium carbonate recipe first.

 

[Cassklar]

the normal carbonate two part recipe is a big step over the Brightwell product, and this hydroxide is another step up again.
You might try a normal sodium carbonate recipe first.

So are you referring to your original recipe ? In the first post of this thread ?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So are you referring to your original recipe ? In the first post of this thread ?

yes, as from BRS, or many other carbonate based 2 parts such as ESV.

 

[Cassklar]

Randy thanks for your help one more question I got the sodium hydroxide ordered for the alk can I use the BRS calcium chloride bags used to mix in a gallon of water for my calcium a well as magnesium mix for dosing I have a few bags of that laying around thanks again